RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 142,302
Posts: 5,553,874
Members: 25,273
Currently online: 480
Newest member: KTJ

TrekToday headlines

Ortiz Art Mugs
By: T'Bonz on Jan 28

Ingham Passes
By: T'Bonz on Jan 28

Star Trek Online Celebrates Five Years
By: T'Bonz on Jan 27

WizKids/Star Trek Online Caption Contest
By: T'Bonz on Jan 26

No Quinto In Heroes Reborn
By: T'Bonz on Jan 26

Pine Responds To Pegg Writer Announcement
By: T'Bonz on Jan 26

Retro Review: Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges
By: Michelle on Jan 24

Urban in Aquaman?
By: T'Bonz on Jan 23

Pegg Co-writing Star Trek 3
By: T'Bonz on Jan 22

Stewart Narrated NASA Documentary
By: T'Bonz on Jan 21


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > Deep Space Nine

Deep Space Nine What We Left Behind, we will always have here.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old January 9 2015, 03:02 AM   #1
tafkats
Vice Admiral
 
tafkats's Avatar
 
Location: That'll put marzipan in your pie plate, bingo!
Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

While rewatching "Emissary" for dub's "Superthread," I started thinking about how much more traumatic it would have been for Sisko if, instead of her already being dead when he arrived at their quarters, he'd been forced to abandon her in order to save Jake.

It's pretty clear that as far as Sisko knows, Jennifer was dead and he didn't have to make that decision. But what if the Bolian lieutenant lied in order to save him?

The lieutenant was the only one looking at tricorder readings. If Jennifer had been alive but so thoroughly trapped that there was no way to pull her out in time, might he have allowed Sisko to think she was dead, knowing that if he didn't, Sisko would have refused to leave, resulting in both of them dying and Jake being orphaned?
__________________
"I don't mind the fact that race, creed, sex, ethnicity, and the disabled are protected classes, but I draw the line at stupidity." -- Jethro Elvis

WordForge.net: Attack otters of the ass. In submarines.
tafkats is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 9 2015, 03:21 AM   #2
2takesfrakes
Commodore
 
2takesfrakes's Avatar
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Re: Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

"The first duty of every Starfleet officer is to The Truth, whether it's scientific truth or historical truth or personal truth!"
-- Captain Jean-Luc Picard
2takesfrakes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 9 2015, 05:12 AM   #3
JirinPanthosa
Rear Admiral
 
Re: Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

It wasn't 100% clear she was already dead, but it was clear there was no chance of saving her.
JirinPanthosa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 9 2015, 06:00 AM   #4
tafkats
Vice Admiral
 
tafkats's Avatar
 
Location: That'll put marzipan in your pie plate, bingo!
Re: Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

If she were alive but unreachable and Sisko knew it, would he go to the escape pod? Or would he send Jake with the tactical officer and keep trying to free her until the ship was destroyed and they both died?
__________________
"I don't mind the fact that race, creed, sex, ethnicity, and the disabled are protected classes, but I draw the line at stupidity." -- Jethro Elvis

WordForge.net: Attack otters of the ass. In submarines.
tafkats is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 9 2015, 06:41 AM   #5
T'Girl
Vice Admiral
 
T'Girl's Avatar
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
Re: Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

tafkats wrote: View Post
... would he send Jake with the tactical officer and keep trying to free her until the ship was destroyed and they both died?
This.
T'Girl is online now   Reply With Quote
Old January 9 2015, 07:08 AM   #6
Captrek
Rear Admiral
 
Captrek's Avatar
 
Location: second star to the right
Re: Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

If there was no chance to save her, and staying would only deprive her son of his only surviving parent, is there no chance he would listen to reason? He is a trained Starfleet Officer as well as a father.

I agree that it would have been more traumatic and dramatic.
Captrek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 9 2015, 12:36 PM   #7
Orphalesion
Commander
 
Orphalesion's Avatar
 
Re: Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

It might have broken Sisko. Leaving his wife to die, even if there was no way of saving her...it would have still gnawed at his conscience, the idea that, maybe if he had stayed, he might have saved her.
If she was still alive it was merciful of the Bolian Officer to lie about it.
__________________
I am Orphalesion, Guardian of the Outhouse and Holder of the Holy Hand Grenade of Betazed.
Orphalesion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 9 2015, 02:17 PM   #8
bbjeg
Vice Admiral
 
bbjeg's Avatar
 
Location: C,IMD14U.
Re: Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

IIRC, didn't the tricorder give us the 'she's dead' sound as opposed to the critically injured sound?
bbjeg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 9 2015, 04:12 PM   #9
dub
Fleet Captain
 
dub's Avatar
 
Location: Location? What is this?
Re: Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

It's an interesting idea. Or some situation where Jennifer slipped through his fingers. "If only I held on tighter" or "if only I found her sooner" sort of thing. Obviously that would be a different scenario entirely than the one we saw. Having said that, I did truly believe his grief, which was clearly overwhelming for him and didn't really need an additional angle. But I agree it would have been interesting.
dub is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 9 2015, 08:14 PM   #10
Kobayshi Maru
Commodore
 
Kobayshi Maru's Avatar
 
Location: France
Re: Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

2takesfrakes wrote: View Post
"The first duty of every Starfleet officer is to The Truth, whether it's scientific truth or historical truth or personal truth!"
-- Captain Jean-Luc Picard
That doesn't apply when there's a good chance that someone will go berserk and do something stupid. In that case you have a duty to lie, be it momentarily, for the greater good.
Kobayshi Maru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 10 2015, 07:03 AM   #11
kkt
Lieutenant
 
Location: Seattle
Re: Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

I don't think a starfleet officer, used to telling the truth in all situations, could tell a convincing lie to a fellow officer. Not without more planning and rehearsal time than he would have had in that situation.
kkt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 10 2015, 07:06 AM   #12
Kobayshi Maru
Commodore
 
Kobayshi Maru's Avatar
 
Location: France
Re: Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

kkt wrote: View Post
I don't think a starfleet officer, used to telling the truth in all situations, could tell a convincing lie to a fellow officer. Not without more planning and rehearsal time than he would have had in that situation.
They have to at least lie by omission when they're told to keep a secret, don't they? Or when they are under cover and have to lie all the time to everyone around!!!


Besides, even Tuvok once said that he only lied when ordered to do so. So that shows that it happens, even to Vulcan officers.
Kobayshi Maru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 11 2015, 12:38 AM   #13
USS Triumphant
Rear Admiral
 
USS Triumphant's Avatar
 
Location: Go ahead, caller. I'm listening...
Re: Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

2takesfrakes wrote: View Post
"The first duty of every Starfleet officer is to The Truth, whether it's scientific truth or historical truth or personal truth!"
-- Captain Jean-Luc Picard
Picard blows a lot of smoke about humans being beyond money, greed, or religion, too.

Either the Bolian was lying to save the most people or he was telling the truth - either way, the necessary thing for the most good happened at that point. If he were a real person, I would want that Bolian to know that.
__________________
As the brilliant philosopher once said... Everybody, have fun tonight. Everybody, Wang Chung tonight.
USS Triumphant is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 11 2015, 01:10 AM   #14
kkt
Lieutenant
 
Location: Seattle
Re: Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

Kobayshi Maru wrote: View Post
kkt wrote: View Post
I don't think a starfleet officer, used to telling the truth in all situations, could tell a convincing lie to a fellow officer. Not without more planning and rehearsal time than he would have had in that situation.
They have to at least lie by omission when they're told to keep a secret, don't they? Or when they are under cover and have to lie all the time to everyone around!!!


Besides, even Tuvok once said that he only lied when ordered to do so. So that shows that it happens, even to Vulcan officers.
I'm not saying starfleet officers never lie, that would be silly. Just that the truth is the first automatic response to a situation, and to lie would require thinking about, and a stressful situation like abandoning ship he'd be too rushed to think about it.
kkt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 11 2015, 05:57 AM   #15
Kobayshi Maru
Commodore
 
Kobayshi Maru's Avatar
 
Location: France
Re: Do you think Jennifer was really dead?

kkt wrote: View Post
Kobayshi Maru wrote: View Post
kkt wrote: View Post
I don't think a starfleet officer, used to telling the truth in all situations, could tell a convincing lie to a fellow officer. Not without more planning and rehearsal time than he would have had in that situation.
They have to at least lie by omission when they're told to keep a secret, don't they? Or when they are under cover and have to lie all the time to everyone around!!!


Besides, even Tuvok once said that he only lied when ordered to do so. So that shows that it happens, even to Vulcan officers.
I'm not saying starfleet officers never lie, that would be silly. Just that the truth is the first automatic response to a situation, and to lie would require thinking about, and a stressful situation like abandoning ship he'd be too rushed to think about it.
Unless the guy was smart enough to realize that if he told Sisko that she was alive, he would never leave. That kind of stuff doesn't take more than a fraction of a second when you are under pressure.
Kobayshi Maru is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 12:14 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.