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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

View Poll Results: Grade the movie...
Excellent 706 62.70%
Above Average 213 18.92%
Average 84 7.46%
Below Average 46 4.09%
Poor 77 6.84%
Voters: 1126. You may not vote on this poll

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Old May 8 2009, 07:00 AM   #496
Borgminister
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Mr. B wrote: View Post

take a shit on canon.
In a nutshell; execution has nothing to do with it. You just didn't like the story line.
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Old May 8 2009, 07:01 AM   #497
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Just saw it. There was so much cool in that couple hours. I'm going to see it again when I get some free time this upcoming week.
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Old May 8 2009, 07:05 AM   #498
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

9.999/10

I didn't like Scotty's little friend. I thought that was pretty stupid. I also didn't like the Enterprise reference or Kirk's big hands. Other than that, this is an amazing film. The visual effects and acting were phenomenal.
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Old May 8 2009, 07:07 AM   #499
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

you know as annoying as the lens flare was in the clips i didnt notice it as much in the theatre. i wonder if the quality of the screening system would have something to do with it.
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Old May 8 2009, 07:08 AM   #500
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Borgminister wrote: View Post
Mr. B wrote: View Post

take a shit on canon.
In a nutshell; execution has nothing to do with it. You just didn't like the story line.
To be frank, I can't think of anything I liked about this movie.
[edit]Well, the Kobayashi Maru sequence was pretty funny[/edit]
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Last edited by Mr. B; May 8 2009 at 07:28 AM.
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Old May 8 2009, 07:09 AM   #501
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

I am still trying to take this all in...this film is, in a word, disorienting...it's very good, and I voted above average, but it's one of those things I'm going to have to take time to digest...

At first, I was a bit dissappointed...the opening scenes are extraordinary, but the way outer space scenes look in this film is VERY similar to the dissapointing Lost In Space film...everything looks just like that film...and yet, as time went on, I realized that where Lost In Space failed, Star Trek works...the movie has a very comic-bookish look to it..if you don't know what I mean, then recall the space scenes from either Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer or Superman Returns...again, this film succeeds where those failed, but it took a while to win me over with the style...It's just such a novel idea for Trek, but it's done well...

The lens flares were irritating as hell...I don't know how anyone could not have noticed this...too much...hopefully, Abrams cuts back in the sequel...

The actors were all great, except that Chekov's accent is so annoying, that if he wasn't such a goofy, likeable character, you'd want him marooned on Delta Vega along with Kirk...but the standout here was Pine. Why? Because even though Pegg, Urban, and Quinto do excellent jobs at imitating their predecessors (Quinto is a bit nasally, but still fantastic), Pine takes the Kirk character and runs with it. I was totally unconvinced until the swagger and arrogance I saw in the Kobayashi Maru scene...it's absolutely hilarious and it's an original take...I expected Pine to be nothing more than a pretty boy...I was wrong...I was never a huge Kirk fan until now...seriously, he's that good, you just root for him the whole time..

Leonard Nimoy's appearance was a lot more substantial than I expected, and I know I will take flack for this, but I was a bit dissapointed...it is wonderful to see him on screen, and it's surreal (I should say that his appearance in this film adds to the comic-book nature...you truly feel like you're in an alternate universe when he shows up)...He still has the quiet dignity, and he's still Spock, but he had this tendency to re-hash his best known lines ("I am, and ever shall be, your friend") in moments where they lost their impact. It's still cool that he's in this continuity.. I doubt that Nimoy will make another appearance, but at least we have some sense of Spock's ultimate fate by the end of the film...plus, this Spock has mellowed ALOT with age...he's VERY emotional, as if he has come to accept his human side alot more with age...there's no "fascinating", no "if logic dictates", and he's almost hyperactive when he sees Jim, which is touching because it's so sweet to see old Spock look on his long dead friend's young face again... but again, I was happy to see him...

I'm not going to see this film again in theatres...it was very well done, but I'd rather watch it on DVD and take time in between to let it sink in...again, while I enjoyed it, it's just such a radical take on Star Trek that it takes a while to really comprehend...but I can say this: I am swelling with pride to see these characters again...everyone did a great job (Pine and Cho surprisingly well), and you get the feeling that despite the fact that you are VERY well aware that this is another reality, these are the same people...I can't explain this, it's an emotional thing that you either feel or don't feel...again, surreal...

To to sum up: this is Star Trek done comic book style - whizzbang fast, with bold new effects, and a dynamic young cast...the sci fi is more along the lines of Fantastic Four than say previous Trek series...the look is like Lost in Space: bright, shiny, lots of holograms and visual displays everywhere...I didn't like the engineering deck (it looks like a damn chemical plant), but I liked the brisk pace of the ship (everyone is actually DOING something, running around to keep the damn thing running, not just standing at a console)

I'm sorry that my post is so disjointed...I don't mean to ramble, but I really feel like I was in an alternate reality just now, and I need to sleep on it...

Oh yes, and one last thing...no matter what anyone says, this film takes place in 2258...why? Because Countdown is explicity stated to take place in the year 2387...during the mind meld sequence, Old Spock tells Kirk ("The future..thats where I'm from, Jim...129 years from now") So do the math...it all adds up...2233, Kirk is born...2258, the events in this film...just thought I'd throw that in there as it was something that I thought was so obvious that I can't believe people are still debating it...

Well, good night for now...I have a feeling I'll be having some trippy dreams
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Old May 8 2009, 07:09 AM   #502
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Tim M wrote: View Post
Below average. A decent movie, but not a "Star Trek" movie. I'm no canon freak, but there was no attempt to reconcile Abrams' take with the other 40+ years of Trek apart from the "parallel universes" cop-out.

Disappointing.
Ha, didn't even see you'd posted just before me! I was wondering how you liked it.

I do agree that the time travel/parallel universe thing was a cop-out (I went in COMPLETELY spoiler-free, which I think actually harmed me because I had to acclimate too quickly). I thought, I truly did, that surely they would not use time travel yet again in this one. The conclusion I am kind of coming around to, however, is that the Trek Universe we know and love it still there, we're just not going to see it in the movies anymore. And as such, again, I think I agree that it's not quite the real deal.

But, you know, there have been plenty of things in the run of the shows/movies I didn't like, and I just reconciled them in my mind (because it's fiction so I can), so I figure I will do that here, too. I'm going to reserve final judgement until I see it again.
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Old May 8 2009, 07:11 AM   #503
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

galleywest wrote: View Post
My head is reeling.

Okay, I'm not much of a fan of the original, so there wasn't much for me to feel threatened by in the sense of messing with "my" Trek, which is TNG.

Loved:

The look of the film. I love it. Love, love, love the way it both looks back to the original and moves forward at the same time. It's retro and sleek and new and sexy all at once.

Loved the alien makeup effects, some great work there.

The cast: everyone did a superb job of recreating the characters without mimicking them. My favorite was Karl Urban, which shocked me. Karl Urban, if you're out there, I'm sorry I maligned the choice of you as McCoy. You were wonderful!

Didn't love:

Well...the destruction of Vulcan. Really? They had to destroy the whole planet? Doesn't that majorly mess up the entire Star Trek continuum, like, entirely and irreparably? I am NOT a canon fanatic, not in the slightest, but, uh......??? I can't wrap my brain around it. Only 10,000 Vulcans left??? WTF? This point, and this point alone, upsets me. Are we just disposing of the original timeline completely and starting over from scratch, and EVERYTHING is alternate now? Freaking me out big time and completely hampering my enjoyment of the film, because a. it's a little upsetting and b. saying it's an alternate timeline makes me feel like this movie doesn't count as real Star Trek, like it's a flimsy, not-quite-real Trek universe. On the one hand there's this film and it's new direction, on the other is the weight of all the amassed storylines of all the other series and movies. I mean, I'm still going to see all of those as the "correct" timeline--one film doesn't wipe them out for me. To me, Kirk was still born in Iowa and was posted to the Farragut. Enterprise was not built on Earth. Vulcan is still around. Am I a stick in the mud because I can't immediately surrender these facts of the timeline and accept the new one as correct?

Spock/Uhuru...romance? I find it extremely difficult to believe that Spock, even at his most distressed, would commit the egregious crime of PDA (not hot-blooded Vulcan pon farr raw sexual emotion, but cuddling) on the transporter pad. Ew.

So I don't know how to vote yet. I'm still computing it, but I am upset about the Vulcan thing, not because of Vulcan itself, but because I feel like it jettisoned all the rest of Trek in the process...like it never happens now. I don't know what to think about it. I'm really mad about it because I really, really, really want to love it as much as so many other people do. And it was a fun, funny, witty, action-packed movie, so I really want to just let go and love it. But I don't, quite.
Yep. Agree on all points. There's the weak "alternate universe" cop-out, but come on...this isn't Terminator.

I did not like the production design. It was just...lazy. Engineering was a friggin' brewery with a few flat-panel LCD displays thrown in there! They should've made some effort to make it seem futuristic.
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Old May 8 2009, 07:12 AM   #504
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

really a lot of stuff that happened in tos could still happen.
while some things will be brand new .. which the writers admitted is one reason they did it..
that we wont know now everything that might happen to these people.

and while i wish we saw a little more of that one section of engineeriing that looked well more spacey i dont have issues with a lot of sections were we just saw tubes ect..
we only saw very little of the tos engineering and with main engineering grid being made up of use tubes they came from some place..
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Old May 8 2009, 07:18 AM   #505
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

galleywest wrote: View Post
I do agree that the time travel/parallel universe thing was a cop-out (I went in COMPLETELY spoiler-free, which I think actually harmed me because I had to acclimate too quickly). I thought, I truly did, that surely they would not use time travel yet again in this one. The conclusion I am kind of coming around to, however, is that the Trek Universe we know and love it still there, we're just not going to see it in the movies anymore. And as such, again, I think I agree that it's not quite the real deal.
Yeah, but the cop-out is so lame it just insults my intelligence. I was hoping that the destruction of Nero would erase his timeline meddling and restore things. Yes, I would have preferred a reset button on this. Perhaps Trek XII will do that, but I think Abrams is rather enamoured of his take.

I'm going to reserve final judgement until I see it again.
You're a braver woman than I (well, that and the fact that I'm not a woman). I just don't have the heart to see this movie again any time soon.

Also, Trek is supposed to have a hopeful view in the future. It would've been nice if Quinto-Spock, knowing the future from Nimoy-Spock, would be able to save Romulus and thus avoid the dual genocides of the Romulans and Vulcans. Instead, we get this "grittier" Trek in which billions are dead.
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Old May 8 2009, 07:22 AM   #506
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Eddie Roth wrote: View Post
About the other thing, the different bridge designs etc: How is it - and this annoys me to no end - that some of you guys just can't turn off that fucking fanboy attitude for TWO HOURS IN A MOVIE THEATER, that notion that everything we saw in a television series from the 1960s (!) is some sort of official recording sent back from the future where, if in another "recording", the slightest detail is changed, that change must either be explained at length and to your satisfaction or else be discarded as an historical falsification???
I've said this before another way, I feel I must say it again:

These particular fans actually believe that page 4 (EDIT: pardon me, TO:00:00:04) of Franz Joseph's "Star Fleet Technical Manual" is a real memo from the United States Military referencing a real transmission from the Enterprise when it arrived in the 1960s in "Tomorrow is Yesterday." They've also said many times that because of this movie's existence, the television series TOS/TNG/DS9/VOY *cease to exist*. They're not living in reality.

Come on! It's no that hard to accept that there are simply different production values today as they were 40 years ago. More money, a different sense of style... Try the idea for a change that maybe the ship always looked like that, but the resolution on your TV was too low to pick up on all the detail. Or some other bullshit that makes you accept that there are always different artistic versions representing the same thing.... and yes, even in Star Trek. How do you explain that uniforms in Star Trek change with every series, five times in eleven movies? And that they all look completely different from one another. Would a real military organization stage such a fashion show every other year? Why did the Enterprise bridge look completely different between TVH, TFF and TUC? Same ship, three completely different designs in as many films. Did you lie awake at night coming up with a "canon" way to explain that? No, I guess not. So why this time?
They did come up with a "canon" explanation for this -- they took the "replaceable bridge module" idea from the "Star Trek: The Next Generation Technical Manual" and applied it to these movies so that they could put out of their mind that it was really due to artistic license by the movie producers.

And, my favorite -- the Eugenics Wars with Khan Singh. Star Trek "canon" and fan "timelines" all had the Eugenics Wars and the "rise of the genetic supermen" occurring in the 1990s. By the time the 90s rolled around and this didn't actually happen in real life, they updated all of their fan timelines, literally, to say all of this warfare occurred "in secret." These fans do not want to face the fact that they are not living in the fictional Star Trek universe. Star Trek XI is not just a movie to them. It's the destruction of the fantasy they live in.

I've been a Star Trek fan for twenty-six years and thanks to these fans, I usually keep that fact guarded in real life outside of message boards.

Praetorian wrote: View Post
SalvorHardin wrote: View Post
Praetorian wrote: View Post
Regarding Nero's motivation... It was simply a very misdirected revenge. He blammed the Federation for not being fast enough to help his planet (as if the UFP *had* to help Romulus...). His ship was simply a mining ship, but overpowered since it was from 130 years or so in the future. The black hole technology was from Spock's ship. Remember Nero was pulled into the past unwillingly. However I wonder why he waited 25 years roaming around in space, in the hopes of getting his hands on Spock and his blackhole technology to execute his irrational vengeance..instead of going to Romulus and help them prepare for the upcomming Super Nova. Or even use the black hole technology for that purpose instead...
1. his ship wasn't a simple mining ship. It was a mining ship turned into a superweapon thanks to it being refitided with Romulan adapted Borg technology.

Info from the Countdown comics.

2. He wasn't just roaming 25 years in space. After the Kelvin incident he was captured by Klingons and spent quite some time in Rura Penthe from where he later escaped.

This plot was cut in the editing room

3. As for Nero...I suppose one can be expected to be half mad and irrational when one sees child, wife, entire planet destroyed and spends a few years in a Klingon prison
I'm sorry, those things weren't in the movie....Not Canon! =P
About this -- I haven't seen this movie yet -- I'm seeing it Saturday -- please tell me I don't have to read these comic books to enjoy or understand the movie, because I would be irked if that were the case.

Last edited by FKnight; May 8 2009 at 07:38 AM. Reason: Corrected episode name for TOS Time Travel Episode
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Old May 8 2009, 07:29 AM   #507
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

FKnight wrote: View Post
Eddie Roth wrote: View Post
About the other thing, the different bridge designs etc: How is it - and this annoys me to no end - that some of you guys just can't turn off that fucking fanboy attitude for TWO HOURS IN A MOVIE THEATER, that notion that everything we saw in a television series from the 1960s (!) is some sort of official recording sent back from the future where, if in another "recording", the slightest detail is changed, that change must either be explained at length and to your satisfaction or else be discarded as an historical falsification???
I've said this before another way, I feel I must say it again:

These particular fans actually believe that page 4 (EDIT: pardon me, TO:00:00:04) of Franz Joseph's "Star Fleet Technical Manual" is a real memo from the United States Military referencing a real transmission from the Enterprise when it arrived in the 1960s in "Return to Tomorrow." They've also said many times that because of this movie's existence, the television series TOS/TNG/DS9/VOY *cease to exist*. They're not living in reality.

Come on! It's no that hard to accept that there are simply different production values today as they were 40 years ago. More money, a different sense of style... Try the idea for a change that maybe the ship always looked like that, but the resolution on your TV was too low to pick up on all the detail. Or some other bullshit that makes you accept that there are always different artistic versions representing the same thing.... and yes, even in Star Trek. How do you explain that uniforms in Star Trek change with every series, five times in eleven movies? And that they all look completely different from one another. Would a real military organization stage such a fashion show every other year? Why did the Enterprise bridge look completely different between TVH, TFF and TUC? Same ship, three completely different designs in as many films. Did you lie awake at night coming up with a "canon" way to explain that? No, I guess not. So why this time?
They did come up with a "canon" explanation for this -- they took the "replaceable bridge module" idea from the "Star Trek: The Next Generation Technical Manual" and applied it to these movies so that they could put out of their mind that it was really due to artistic license by the movie producers.

And, my favorite -- the Eugenics Wars with Khan Singh. Star Trek "canon" and fan "timelines" all had the Eugenics Wars and the "rise of the genetic supermen" occurring in the 1990s. By the time the 90s rolled around and this didn't actually happen in real life, they updated all of their fan timelines, literally, to say all of this warfare occurred "in secret." These fans do not want to face the fact that they are not living in the fictional Star Trek universe. Star Trek XI is not just a movie to them. It's the destruction of the fantasy they live in.

I've been a Star Trek fan for twenty-six years and thanks to these fans, I usually keep that fact guarded in real life outside of message boards.

Praetorian wrote: View Post
SalvorHardin wrote: View Post

1. his ship wasn't a simple mining ship. It was a mining ship turned into a superweapon thanks to it being refitided with Romulan adapted Borg technology.

Info from the Countdown comics.

2. He wasn't just roaming 25 years in space. After the Kelvin incident he was captured by Klingons and spent quite some time in Rura Penthe from where he later escaped.

This plot was cut in the editing room

3. As for Nero...I suppose one can be expected to be half mad and irrational when one sees child, wife, entire planet destroyed and spends a few years in a Klingon prison
I'm sorry, those things weren't in the movie....Not Canon! =P
About this -- I haven't seen this movie yet -- I'm seeing it Saturday -- please tell me I don't have to read these comic books to enjoy or understand the movie, because I would be irked if that were the case.
You don't have to, but the way Spock Prime tells the story its sort of the stripped down version..you see him talking to the Romulans, you see Romulus destroyed, but if you're like me, you want to see more, so you might considering reading more out of curiosity...

In a nutshell: Spocks recounting will be sufficient for the audience, but as a Trek fan, I want to know more
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Old May 8 2009, 07:31 AM   #508
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Kruge wrote: View Post
FKnight wrote: View Post
About this -- I haven't seen this movie yet -- I'm seeing it Saturday -- please tell me I don't have to read these comic books to enjoy or understand the movie, because I would be irked if that were the case.
You don't have to, but the way Spock Prime tells the story its sort of the stripped down version..you see him talking to the Romulans, you see Romulus destroyed, but if you're like me, you want to see more, so you might considering reading more out of curiosity...

In a nutshell: Spocks recounting will be sufficient for the audience, but as a Trek fan, I want to know more
Cool, thanks. I might just have to check it out then, not out of necessity, but as you say, to "fill it out" a little.
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Old May 8 2009, 07:32 AM   #509
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

I'm gonna have to get it too.
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Old May 8 2009, 07:37 AM   #510
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

I ordered it earlier this evening. Along with the novelization of Star Trek.
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