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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old April 14 2009, 09:28 AM   #901
firehawk12
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

Late to the thread, but has anyone done a full blown plot summary post?
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Old April 14 2009, 09:57 AM   #902
RJDiogenes
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

Borgminister wrote: View Post
RJDiogenes wrote: View Post

Sure, I'm not averse to action if the substance is there, as in TWOK et cetera.
Sounds to me like redemption, tragedy, heroism, and other issues of "substance" will indeed be explored in this very movie--at the very least to the extent they were in TWOK.
It does seem that way sometimes (although the review that was Posted indicates that it may be pretty lightweight), which is why I said it's a shame they didn't apply all this effort to the traditional characters and setting.
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Old April 14 2009, 11:45 AM   #903
EJA
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

What's this I hear about Spock turning Kirk in for cheating? Does Kirk still get his commendation for original thinking?
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Old April 14 2009, 02:57 PM   #904
Borgminister
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

RJDiogenes wrote: View Post
Borgminister wrote: View Post
RJDiogenes wrote: View Post

Sure, I'm not averse to action if the substance is there, as in TWOK et cetera.
Sounds to me like redemption, tragedy, heroism, and other issues of "substance" will indeed be explored in this very movie--at the very least to the extent they were in TWOK.
It does seem that way sometimes (although the review that was Posted indicates that it may be pretty lightweight), which is why I said it's a shame they didn't apply all this effort to the traditional characters and setting.
The difficulty is that, with Batman, you essentially had one character to flesh out with a backstory, same with Iron Man. The secondary characters are truly secondary.

With Trek, not only do you have "the big 3" in Kirk, Spock and Bones, and then well-established secondary characters to introduce, you also have to set up the Trek universe and include Nimoy and pass the baton and...

Well, that's a lot more to do in 2 hours than was the case for Batman and Iron Man. Plus you want to reel in the general audience.

The Supreme Court bit off a hell of a lot here, and man has it had to chew.

Pass 'em a napkin and give 'em a pat on the back, because that plate is clean, baby...
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Old April 14 2009, 03:17 PM   #905
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

EJA wrote: View Post
What's this I hear about Spock turning Kirk in for cheating? Does Kirk still get his commendation for original thinking?
Who says he ever did? That was Kirk's "spin" on the story when he was trying to impress Saavik; it'll be fun and much more believable if it turns out that behind his self-created legend was a rather harrowing and humiliating learning experience for a young man who'd made a mistake.
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Old April 14 2009, 03:34 PM   #906
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

Starship Polaris wrote: View Post
EJA wrote: View Post
What's this I hear about Spock turning Kirk in for cheating? Does Kirk still get his commendation for original thinking?
Who says he ever did? That was Kirk's "spin" on the story when he was trying to impress Saavik; it'll be fun and much more believable if it turns out that behind his self-created legend was a rather harrowing and humiliating learning experience for a young man who'd made a mistake.
Well, we're assuming events unfolded the same way, too, which is a false assumption. This is still Kirk, so he will probably chafe at a "no win" scenario. But so many circumstances are different that the "hows" and "whys" of his cheating are probably different. He may have received a commendation in the prime timeline, but not in this one. In this timeline, his method of winning may not have been so commendable.
What it does go to show, however, is that this is still Jim Kirk, and he'll do what he needs to do to win. Act first, apologize later.
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Old April 14 2009, 03:46 PM   #907
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

Actually, in this timeline he barely has time for either censure or commendation before he's in command of the Enterprise.
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Old April 14 2009, 04:28 PM   #908
EJA
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

Franklin wrote: View Post
Starship Polaris wrote: View Post
EJA wrote: View Post
What's this I hear about Spock turning Kirk in for cheating? Does Kirk still get his commendation for original thinking?
Who says he ever did? That was Kirk's "spin" on the story when he was trying to impress Saavik; it'll be fun and much more believable if it turns out that behind his self-created legend was a rather harrowing and humiliating learning experience for a young man who'd made a mistake.
Well, we're assuming events unfolded the same way, too, which is a false assumption. This is still Kirk, so he will probably chafe at a "no win" scenario. But so many circumstances are different that the "hows" and "whys" of his cheating are probably different. He may have received a commendation in the prime timeline, but not in this one. In this timeline, his method of winning may not have been so commendable.
What it does go to show, however, is that this is still Jim Kirk, and he'll do what he needs to do to win. Act first, apologize later.
I think the results of his cheating would still have played out largely as they did in the prime timeline, despite the alterations that've been made. He gets suspended for this, but his superiors could grudgingly admire him for his ingenuity.

BTW, what do the Klingon ships look like in the Kobayashi Maru sequence? Are they the classic D7 battlecruiser type?
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Old April 14 2009, 05:17 PM   #909
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]


I think the results of his cheating would still have played out largely as they did in the prime timeline, despite the alterations that've been made. He gets suspended for this, but his superiors could grudgingly admire him for his ingenuity.

BTW, what do the Klingon ships look like in the Kobayashi Maru sequence? Are they the classic D7 battlecruiser type?
Yes but there could be different people running the Academy- what one smart prof will discipline but also commend as original thinking another may be more of a by the book type and only discipline and not commend
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Old April 14 2009, 09:01 PM   #910
EJA
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

Just what exactly is Spock doing at the academy when Kirk takes the Kobayashi Maru test? Isn't he supposed to have already graduated by this time? Any indication of how long he's served in Starfleet proper? Has he served with Pike prior to the launch of Enterprise?

Oh, and just how much detail do they go into as to how "brand new" the Enterprise is? Is there any room for the possibility that it's only undergone a brand new upgrade, so it could have seen prior action under Pike (& April?), in an earlier form?
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Old April 14 2009, 11:40 PM   #911
RJDiogenes
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

Borgminister wrote: View Post
RJDiogenes wrote: View Post
Borgminister wrote: View Post

Sounds to me like redemption, tragedy, heroism, and other issues of "substance" will indeed be explored in this very movie--at the very least to the extent they were in TWOK.
It does seem that way sometimes (although the review that was Posted indicates that it may be pretty lightweight), which is why I said it's a shame they didn't apply all this effort to the traditional characters and setting.
The difficulty is that, with Batman, you essentially had one character to flesh out with a backstory, same with Iron Man. The secondary characters are truly secondary.

With Trek, not only do you have "the big 3" in Kirk, Spock and Bones, and then well-established secondary characters to introduce, you also have to set up the Trek universe and include Nimoy and pass the baton and...

Well, that's a lot more to do in 2 hours than was the case for Batman and Iron Man. Plus you want to reel in the general audience.

The Supreme Court bit off a hell of a lot here, and man has it had to chew.

Pass 'em a napkin and give 'em a pat on the back, because that plate is clean, baby...
Well, it couldn't be any more difficult to establish the traditional characters and setting than it was to create alternate ones. The general audience-- if they even show up for something called Star Trek-- is unlikely to care either way.
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Old April 15 2009, 12:07 AM   #912
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

RJDiogenes wrote: View Post
Borgminister wrote: View Post
RJDiogenes wrote: View Post
It does seem that way sometimes (although the review that was Posted indicates that it may be pretty lightweight), which is why I said it's a shame they didn't apply all this effort to the traditional characters and setting.
The difficulty is that, with Batman, you essentially had one character to flesh out with a backstory, same with Iron Man. The secondary characters are truly secondary.

With Trek, not only do you have "the big 3" in Kirk, Spock and Bones, and then well-established secondary characters to introduce, you also have to set up the Trek universe and include Nimoy and pass the baton and...

Well, that's a lot more to do in 2 hours than was the case for Batman and Iron Man. Plus you want to reel in the general audience.

The Supreme Court bit off a hell of a lot here, and man has it had to chew.

Pass 'em a napkin and give 'em a pat on the back, because that plate is clean, baby...
Well, it couldn't be any more difficult to establish the traditional characters and setting than it was to create alternate ones. The general audience-- if they even show up for something called Star Trek-- is unlikely to care either way.
If its a straight up prequel then how would they have gotten around using the cheesy looking old sets and ships and so forth? There is no way they could use those, they'd look like a joke in todays big budget summer blockbusters.
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Old April 15 2009, 12:35 AM   #913
RJDiogenes
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

Personally, I think they should have gone the direct-to-DVD route and used the Starship Exeter approach. I think that concepts should be allowed to be what they are. But I'm sure you're right that the contemporary audience wouldn't be able to deal with it; it's hard enough to get people to watch black-and-white movies.

In any case, they still could have "modernized" the sets and uniforms and done a straight prequel. Westerns from the 60s and today look quite different, yet they are set in the same time period.
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Old April 15 2009, 12:40 AM   #914
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

Why would making something true to the established continuity mean using the old plywood sets? Why is there this attitude that something either has to be completely different or exactly the same as it was. Just look around the art forum, there's plenty of stuff in there to show that updating the old designs would be a great way to go.
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Old April 15 2009, 12:43 AM   #915
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

SiddFinch1 wrote: View Post

I think the results of his cheating would still have played out largely as they did in the prime timeline, despite the alterations that've been made. He gets suspended for this, but his superiors could grudgingly admire him for his ingenuity.

BTW, what do the Klingon ships look like in the Kobayashi Maru sequence? Are they the classic D7 battlecruiser type?
Yes but there could be different people running the Academy- what one smart prof will discipline but also commend as original thinking another may be more of a by the book type and only discipline and not commend
You know in the Prime Universe Kirk took the test three times and reprogramed it before taking it the third time, and from what it sounds like Kirk in the Nu Universe reprogramed it before taking the test the for the first time. If this is the case then that could explain the difference there.
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