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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old April 13 2009, 11:30 PM   #856
Admiral Buzzkill
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

Captain Robert April wrote: View Post

Dennis, do you have a clue how the military -- ANY MILITARY -- operates?
Absolutely. Frankly if I held the creators of these things to any reasonable standards of plausibility where military protocol or operations are concerned I should have abandoned Trek during the TOS era. That you take umbrage at my flippancy about "Captain Kirk" is something I care not a fig about. Okay, that's not true - I suppose it amuses me a little that you either didn't get the joke or didn't like it.

OTOH, despite your own service, I've yet to see you make a post here indicating a reasonable level of expertise or understanding of anything we're discussing. I'm afraid that a thorough familiarity with the minutiae of Trek canon is not the same as knowing something about anything.

You simply have an unfounded conviction, which you truculently repeat in often vulgar fashion, that these people are failing because they're not making the film you want to see.

Your conviction is unfounded because despite the considerable controversy the movie is causing, it's already achieved a degree of acceptance here and created levels of anticipation among Trek fans that almost nothing in the last twenty years of the Franchise has managed.

Simply because you wish something to be so has no bearing whatever on what is happening or is going to happen, and you've produced absolutely no argument or evidence of substance that elevates your opinion above uninformed wishful thinking.
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Old April 13 2009, 11:42 PM   #857
Captain X
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

number6 wrote: View Post
Some of those people have seen the film. The need not withold judgement any longer. Those who haven't who want to like this film are encouraged by this, while those who want this film to fail have little to stand on since it would seem they still haven't seen the film and have no idea about the veracity of their conclusions.
I've always found it fascinating how some people equate seeing something of a movie and not liking it to "wanting it to fail".

number6 wrote: View Post
How the current military operates isn't ultimately important to the Star Trek story, any Star Trek story.
Well, unless you want some of that realism people are always going on about, so it'll be easier for the "mainstream" audience to grab onto and understand what's going on. Even if you know nothing of the military I'm pretty sure most people would find a cadet ending up in command of a ship a bit odd. Unless of course you were desperate for the film to be popular and just need every aspect of the movie to be awesome despite anything negative someone might point out.
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Old April 13 2009, 11:47 PM   #858
Admiral Buzzkill
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

Captain X wrote: View Post
I've always found it fascinating how some people equate seeing something of a movie and not liking it to "wanting it to fail".
Selective reading is fascinating to me. If you're paying attention you know that we have a small but determined chorus here rooting for the film's failure.
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Old April 13 2009, 11:48 PM   #859
Captain X
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

You also might have noticed he's said that more than once in reference to myself.
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Old April 13 2009, 11:52 PM   #860
number6
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

Captain X wrote: View Post
number6 wrote: View Post
Some of those people have seen the film. The need not withold judgement any longer. Those who haven't who want to like this film are encouraged by this, while those who want this film to fail have little to stand on since it would seem they still haven't seen the film and have no idea about the veracity of their conclusions.
I've always found it fascinating how some people equate seeing something of a movie and not liking it to "wanting it to fail".
Interesting still how someone puts words into another's mouth to deflect the point being made.
number6 wrote: View Post
How the current military operates isn't ultimately important to the Star Trek story, any Star Trek story.
Well, unless you want some of that realism people are always going on about, so it'll be easier for the "mainstream" audience to grab onto and understand what's going on. Even if you know nothing of the military I'm pretty sure most people would find a cadet ending up in command of a ship a bit odd. Unless of course you were desperate for the film to be popular and just need every aspect of the movie to be awesome despite anything negative someone might point out.
There only seem to be a small and vocal handful of Trek fans saying that.

Military accuracy has never been a focal point of Star Trek. It's only military folk who seem to want it to be just like how it is for them. No one else really cares too much about that.

I am not "desperate for the film to be popular." I haven't seen it. Of course I want it to be good. Why wouldn't anyone? I haven't decided for the rest of the BBS how it should be or whether or not it will fail. Some insist on drawing conclusions from what little they've seen and declare this film a waste, based only on what they want the film to be and little else. I can't help those people when people who have seen the film seem to be saying otherwise, from the experience of having actually, you know, seen the film.

You want to continue attacking every poster who is willing to defend that? That is your perogative. It only seems to underscore how desperate you are to make a point that cannot be validated, and your only real proof is to try and repeat yourself over and over again until people give in or give up. That doesn't exactly make you right, nor will it ever.
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Old April 14 2009, 12:02 AM   #861
Captain X
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

number6 wrote: View Post
Interesting still how someone puts words into another's mouth to deflect the point being made.
I don't have to put words into anyone's mouth; they pretty much say it themselves.

There only seem to be a small and vocal handful of Trek fans saying that.
Because one needs a majority to be correct.

Military accuracy has never been a focal point of Star Trek. It's only military folk who seem to want it to be just like how it is for them. No one else really cares too much about that.
Because just wanting something to be marginally believable means everything has to be exactly like it is in the modern military. Sort of like everything would have to be completely redesigned to be "updated" or look exactly like it did in the '60s - there is no middle ground.

I am not "desperate for the film to be popular."
I never said you were, I just said that some people seem like they are so desperate for the film to be popular with the "mainstream" audience that they will not acknowledge even the smallest fault in it.

Some insist on drawing conclusions for what little they've seen and declare this film a waste, based only on what they want he film to be and little else.
I can only speak for myself, but seeing what I have it's not that hard to make a determination about this film - one needs to see only so many things they don't like before a movie just becomes bad to them.

You want to continue attacking every poster who is willing to defend that?
I'm not attacking anyone, so I'd appreciate it if you'd refrain from accusing me of such. I make observations based on statements, and I comment on information about the movie. A difference of opinion is a difference of opinion, and it's very possible to have a debate and even share a little friendly ribbing without being adversarial.

That doesn't exactly make you right, nor will it ever.
No one is right or wrong when it comes to opinion, and I certainly feel secure enough in mine to not require consensus in order to validate it.
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Old April 14 2009, 12:22 AM   #862
RJDonner&Blitzen
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

Captain X wrote: View Post
QFT. I especially like this part: "with the obvious exceptions of pandering to the Generation ADHD and fanboi mentality"
I really should get paid for stuff like that.

The Academic wrote: View Post
Be glad you are here...
Write stuff like that in the Enterprise forum and they slap you with an infraction!
Well, I don't know about that, but since I've seen a few "Get a life" and "Go back to your mommy's basement" remarks here, directed at specific Posters, I don't think my mentioning the movie's obviously intended audience is worth a Warning.

Franklin wrote: View Post
But I do hope in the second movie he remembers that Trek fans (indeed most movie goers) don't mind being made to think a bit as they are being entertained. Let's hope Trek movies don't become a series of mindless (even if well-produced) "Independence Day" type action flicks. A little depth. A little time to think and let things sink in. A little maturity.
Sure, I'm not averse to action if the substance is there, as in TWOK et cetera. But it will take more than a different ambiance to change the fact that we're not being shown the characters (or the setting) of Star Trek. Hopefully, the outcome will mirror that of the first Hulk movie, where they just abandoned it and started over. If future movies and series continue to take place in the primary Trek universe, this picture will become a lot easier to take, as a novelty or footnote, perhaps one of those supernumary universes we caught a glimpse of in "Parallels."
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Old April 14 2009, 12:48 AM   #863
GulDucati
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

BillJ wrote: View Post
Captain X wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post
Saw Nemesis twice in the theatre. This couldn't possibly be worse.
Personally I saw INS as worse, because it not only had the same idiot factor, but because it was boring as all hell too.
But Donna Murphy (Anij) is smoking hot. Advantage: Insurrection
Uh, no she's not. Anyways, comparing Insurrection to Nemesis is like comparing rubbish to crap.
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Old April 14 2009, 01:06 AM   #864
Borgminister
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

RJDiogenes wrote: View Post

Sure, I'm not averse to action if the substance is there, as in TWOK et cetera.
Sounds to me like redemption, tragedy, heroism, and other issues of "substance" will indeed be explored in this very movie--at the very least to the extent they were in TWOK.
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Old April 14 2009, 01:25 AM   #865
protocida
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Dark Horizons movie Review it's (moved to spoiler review thread.)

And it's rather negative:

http://www.darkhorizons.com/reviews/911/Star-Trek/

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Old April 14 2009, 01:29 AM   #866
Michael Chris
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Re: Dark Horizons movie Review it's out.

"it simply can not be stated enough how effectively Abrams and his crew have revived and repositioned not just the franchise but the 'space opera' genre itself" is negative?
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Old April 14 2009, 01:30 AM   #867
Borgminister
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Re: Dark Horizons movie Review it's out.

Let's see, it leaves you "aching to see more Trek", sounds pretty good to me.

Although why I kept scanning after reading that Pine lacks "Shatner's humility" is beyond me...
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Old April 14 2009, 01:30 AM   #868
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Re: Dark Horizons movie Review it's out.

It seems to be saying it's fun but there are a few problems. I haven't seen anything that flat out says it was a complete disaster yet, so overall the reception's been rather positive, especially when compared with the previous entry.
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Old April 14 2009, 01:36 AM   #869
SalvorHardin
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Re: Dark Horizons movie Review it's out.

protocida wrote: View Post

Granted it's the most critical review we've seen, but negative

Easily set to be amongst the best films of the Summer, where it stands in the scheme of things a few years from now will be interesting to contemplate.

what is setup here shows such great potential that if Abrams direction and the current cast & mythology were to combine with a stronger story - it could be an achievement of "Spider-Man 2" or "The Dark Knight" caliber.

Most of the issues here are nitpicks and it simply can not be stated enough how effectively Abrams and his crew have revived and repositioned not just the franchise but the 'space opera' genre itself. After the painfully stilted "Star Wars" prequels and the last few lackluster 'Trek' films, this 'Trek' at last brings back a sense of fun adventure to the space epic which has not really been seen since the 80's. By the end of this film when the crew is in place, the cast has settled into their roles, and this once familiar universe now feels wide open and new - you can not help but be aching to go on another Trek - a feeling many of us Trekkers haven't felt in a long time.
I've already posted about this review in the no-spoilers thread by the way
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Old April 14 2009, 01:44 AM   #870
Kelso
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Re: World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

I hope these questions haven't been asked yet (I keep getting lost in the pissing match)...


1) How are the stardates different from what we're used to?

2) If Klingon ships are seen on the view-screen during the KM... what do they look like?

3) Do Spock and McCoy bicker?
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