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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > The Next Generation

The Next Generation All Good Things come to an end...but not here.

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Old October 15 2013, 07:33 PM   #46
sonak
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Re: Measure of a Man

the episode makes no sense. Why is the issue of Data's self-awareness being ruled on LONG AFTER HE JOINED STARFLEET?

The ruling should have been simple: "starfleet officers aren't property."
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Old October 15 2013, 07:36 PM   #47
2takesfrakes
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Re: Measure of a Man

I found "Measure of a Man" to be well-written. I found it to be a very strong episode for Riker, actually. He had some very memorable moments, throughout the episode. And at the end, when Data comes looking for him, that was very touching. I liked how Frakes played it, it was almost "real." It had a lot going for it, as a character-driven episode. It was very good.
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Old October 15 2013, 08:26 PM   #48
Mutai Sho-Rin
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Re: Measure of a Man

All you mini-mods, let's cut Yanks some slack. Yes, he unearthed an old thread but he added substantive commentary to it. This old mod won't complain. Resurrecting a necrotic topic then just adding an emoticon or a three word burp is not OK.
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Old October 15 2013, 10:11 PM   #49
Yanks
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Re: Measure of a Man

sonak wrote: View Post
the episode makes no sense. Why is the issue of Data's self-awareness being ruled on LONG AFTER HE JOINED STARFLEET?

The ruling should have been simple: "starfleet officers aren't property."
Agree completely. In my view this makes this episode even worse.

The worst part is Picard's little chat with Guinan. None of the conversation had anything to do with the trial or Data.

2takesfrakes wrote: View Post
I found "Measure of a Man" to be well-written. I found it to be a very strong episode for Riker, actually. He had some very memorable moments, throughout the episode. And at the end, when Data comes looking for him, that was very touching. I liked how Frakes played it, it was almost "real." It had a lot going for it, as a character-driven episode. It was very good.
Exactly! Riker's performance was right on target and yes that ending with Data and Riker is classic and well played. I really did feel like Riker hated himself for doing it and almost winning. Then, Data being Spock like, states the obvious as clears the air.

Mutai Sho-Rin wrote: View Post
All you mini-mods, let's cut Yanks some slack. Yes, he unearthed an old thread but he added substantive commentary to it. This old mod won't complain. Resurrecting a necrotic topic then just adding an emoticon or a three word burp is not OK.
Thank you.
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Old October 16 2013, 03:45 AM   #50
Mojochi
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Re: Measure of a Man

I like the episode, but also recognize the fact that it does seem a bit contrived in that Data just being in Starfleet would have to have been recognized as a being long ago, & thereby due all the rights of any being in Starfleet. It's mostly the wonderful acting from everyone featured that makes it truly wonderful to watch

& since I never got to comment on the thread when it was new, I too have no problem with it being brought out of mothballs
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Old October 16 2013, 01:56 PM   #51
PaleMoonlight
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Re: Measure of a Man

The dialogue between Picard and Louvois when they see eachother never fails to make me laugh, would have been interesting to nsee their relationship explored a bit more.
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Old October 16 2013, 03:45 PM   #52
Yanks
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Re: Measure of a Man

PaleMoonlight wrote: View Post
The dialogue between Picard and Louvois when they see eachother never fails to make me laugh, would have been interesting to nsee their relationship explored a bit more.
Agree. I would like to know more detail about the Stargazer trial. It always puzzled me as to why Picard gets so worked up about her. I'm guessing the result of the trial was truthful and obviously didn't hurt Picard.

Why is he so pissed?
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Old October 16 2013, 05:12 PM   #53
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Re: Measure of a Man

Yanks wrote: View Post
PaleMoonlight wrote: View Post
The dialogue between Picard and Louvois when they see eachother never fails to make me laugh, would have been interesting to nsee their relationship explored a bit more.
Agree. I would like to know more detail about the Stargazer trial. It always puzzled me as to why Picard gets so worked up about her. I'm guessing the result of the trial was truthful and obviously didn't hurt Picard.

Why is he so pissed?
I think it's because he did not like he fact that his girlfriend was dragging him through the mud to make sure there was no wrongdoing on his part, people died and a ship was left crippled and abandoned after all. Picard probably knows and understands why she did what she did, but enough trust was betrayed and feelings were hurt that Picard needed to separate from Phillipa in order to move on.
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Old October 16 2013, 05:46 PM   #54
Savage Dragon
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Re: Measure of a Man

Mutai Sho-Rin wrote: View Post
All you mini-mods, let's cut Yanks some slack. Yes, he unearthed an old thread but he added substantive commentary to it. This old mod won't complain. Resurrecting a necrotic topic then just adding an emoticon or a three word burp is not OK.
Just for the record I don't actually have a problem with resurrecting old threads. I agree if there is something meaningful added to the discussion it shouldn't be an issue.

I just like using the the thread necromancy image.
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Old October 17 2013, 03:29 AM   #55
Hober Mallow
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Re: Measure of a Man

Zombie Seeker wrote: View Post
Just for the record I don't actually have a problem with resurrecting old threads. I agree if there is something meaningful added to the discussion it shouldn't be an issue.

I just like using the the thread necromancy image.
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Old October 17 2013, 04:14 AM   #56
Makarov
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Re: Measure of a Man

PaleMoonlight wrote: View Post
The dialogue between Picard and Louvois when they see eachother never fails to make me laugh, would have been interesting to nsee their relationship explored a bit more.
I like to think they did the deed after the episode. To be honest their relationship is the most interesting part of the episode to me.

I saw this episode looong after already seeing all the other data episodes. So to me it felt like a retread of all I learned about him, maybe it was different back at that time.

One thing that seems ridiculous is Riker being assigned to argue Maddox's side even though he doesn't believe in it. What kind of crazy system is that?
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Old October 17 2013, 10:30 AM   #57
Mojochi
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Re: Measure of a Man

Yeah, a weak plot mechanism. Surely they could have searched the base for some other officer to present the case. It's a starbase. It can't be completely empty of officers. Even Pulaski would seem to be a better choice
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Old October 17 2013, 12:27 PM   #58
Yanks
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Re: Measure of a Man

Kevman7987 wrote: View Post
Yanks wrote: View Post
PaleMoonlight wrote: View Post
The dialogue between Picard and Louvois when they see eachother never fails to make me laugh, would have been interesting to nsee their relationship explored a bit more.
Agree. I would like to know more detail about the Stargazer trial. It always puzzled me as to why Picard gets so worked up about her. I'm guessing the result of the trial was truthful and obviously didn't hurt Picard.

Why is he so pissed?
I think it's because he did not like he fact that his girlfriend was dragging him through the mud to make sure there was no wrongdoing on his part, people died and a ship was left crippled and abandoned after all. Picard probably knows and understands why she did what she did, but enough trust was betrayed and feelings were hurt that Picard needed to separate from Phillipa in order to move on.
That seems pretty petty for someone of Picard's stature. It seemed forced and out of character to me. His juvinile reaction to her wasn't needed for the story at all.
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Old October 17 2013, 01:56 PM   #59
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Re: Measure of a Man

A great episode, would probably be the chronologically earliest if I made a list of top 10 TNG episodes. Worth it all for Picard's best speechifying moment ever. It doesn't make Season 2 great, but it's an indicator of what the show can and will be in the future

I find Louvois to be a weak point of the episode...she seems like a too-on-the-nose rehash of Kirk's old flame in "Court-Martial", right down to quoting the amount of time since they'd last seen each other (IIRC).
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Old October 17 2013, 05:35 PM   #60
jpv2000
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Re: Measure of a Man

Kreacher wrote: View Post
Melakon, it took me a long time to figure out the multi-quote function, but it's actually very simple:

Click the MultiQuote button for each post that you want to quote, and, after the last one, also click either the Quote button or Post Reply.
Many Thanks. I didn't know how to use it either.
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