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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Battlestar Galactica & Caprica

Battlestar Galactica & Caprica This forum was created by man. It rebelled. It evolved. And it has a plan.

View Poll Results: Grade the episode...
Excellent 300 71.94%
Above Average 59 14.15%
Average 20 4.80%
Below Average 19 4.56%
Poor 19 4.56%
Voters: 417. You may not vote on this poll

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Old March 22 2009, 10:25 PM   #466
What's his face
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Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"

Now THAT'S an interesting idea. Steam-powered cylons
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Old March 22 2009, 10:27 PM   #467
Location: England, UK
Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"

Temis the Vorta wrote: View Post
Ditto for Cavil's suicide. That guy was the fight-to-the-last type. Didn't buy that one iota.
You seriously think that Cavil wanted to see his hopes, his dreams of the future, unfold via his feeble, inferior, organic eyes which the Final Five 'blessed' him with?

To eat shitty human prisoner food, only using his unworthy tastebuds which would give him an imperfect sensation of the food he's eating?

No fracking chance. A quick death was a mercy for himself, he knew it and he took that option.
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Old March 22 2009, 10:35 PM   #468
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Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"

Noname Given wrote: View Post
Below Average

I was honestly expecting something WAY LESS cliche'. Sorry, I called this one over a year ago. Again, go watch the Japanese anime OVA Gall Force.

I'm also very happy that Tyrol 'broke the circle' because that whole bit was treading a V: The Final Battle territory (and it was bad back in the 1980ies too. Hell the ONLY missing from that sequence was them having to use Hera as a conduit too.

And will someone PLEASE explain the sense of the 'Cavil' leader suddenly blowing his brains out for no reason?

And Adama just abndons Lee to his own tent - look I know he was distraught over Roslin's death, but come on - he has to fly off with her (soon to be) body in a Raptor and never come back? (Remember this was the Commander who back in season one, when looking for Kara Thrace who had crash landed and was ordered and about to abandon the search for her, told Lee: "If it was you, we'd NEVER leave!" - yep way to go Dad. Graet end to a character there.

And also, God(Head 6); Satan/Count Iblis (Head baltar) and Starbuck are all divine beings who guided the Colonists and us all through the messthat RDM claims is 'groundbreking. Well at least we know RDM did watch the Count Iblis episodes of BSG1978; because in one of those episodes; Count Iblis killed Starbuck, and the 'angels' of the 'Ship of Lights' brought him back too - so at leat; in 4 YEARS, RDM did manage to cover all the plot points that the original BSG1978 covered in 24 episodes; way to drag it out Ron.

Also, the Cylon Colony (aside from being partially nuked); still looked operational; and there's still a butt-load of Cylon Basestars (and other Cavils too); so you're going to tell me that in 150,000 years, those Cylons COULDN'T find a planet within ONE JUMP of their main colony (whether it was destroyed or not)? Oh yeah, I forgot God (Head 6) and Satan/Count Iblis (Head Baltar) have probably kept them all away and allowed us to 'flourish'.

Finally, a group of people with advanced technology are suddenly going to just throw that technology away? Sorry, don't think so - hell, if we as a society did that right now, 95% of us would be dead in a year. Apollo wants to explore/relax eh? Well someone should tell him that with rudamentry farming tools, if he slaves over his fields 12 hours a day, he might be abloe to grow enough food (assuming the areas they landed in aren't in winter.

Yep - a "gritty and realistic end" to a "gritty and realistic" show...NOT!

(Oh and if I were Sci-Fi; I'd ask he pay for those extra two hours they gave him because the last 10 episodes were so padded and bloated with useles crap (beyong the pointless 'Pre-Cylon-Fall of the Colonies' Flashbacks (tm) - they got ripped off. RDM once again proves he doesn't know how to properly edit his stories for television.

Glad this show is over - and for me it has ZERO re-watcability. I was going to tune in for "The Plan" but after seeing the mess RDM made after all the hype - I have better things to do then waste another 2 hours watching some other dis-jointed mess from his re-imagined BSG.

BSG1978 was FAR from art; and had countless flaws, but overall it's 24 hours were more entertaining; and in the battle of the Pegasus Episodes BSG1978 and Loyd Bridges trumped nuBSG2003 and 'Toasty' Michelle Forbes by a good lightyear.

As for what I've now seen of Caprica - pass, thanks. I didn't like Beverly Hills 90210 back in the 1990ies either; and I don't think Beverly Hills 90210 with 'hot' female robots will be much of a ratings winner either.
Gail Force? more like Zeta Gundam.
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Old March 22 2009, 10:53 PM   #469
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Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"


Blew my expectations out of the water. Some of the best 2 hours of television I've seen.

Gaius Baltar is probably the best character in the history of television.

It's pretty clear there was a plan at work here from the get go.

They pulled it off, what can you say.

Anyone else is just really a hater.
Ice up son, ice up.
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Old March 22 2009, 11:03 PM   #470
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Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"

^Have you just recently discovered The Wire, or something, Garak?
An illusion--with intelligence! A malignant vision, with a will of pure evil!
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Old March 22 2009, 11:15 PM   #471
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Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"

Just finished it, what an excellent show.
Ice up son, ice up.
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Old March 22 2009, 11:21 PM   #472
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Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"

^Indeed. Just wondering.
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Old March 22 2009, 11:38 PM   #473
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Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"

Temis the Vorta wrote: View Post
The Cylons' behavior was still pretty much illogical to the last. Boomer gave up Hera, why? Oh because the writers needed her to. Ditto for Cavil's suicide. That guy was the fight-to-the-last type. Didn't buy that one iota.
Really? I read Cavil in the opposite way. Consider his scene in Lay Down Your Burdens, II. He argues that he is not a Cylon--right until the point when he meets his double--and then he just stops. He doesn't keep talking (like Doral in the miniseries, for example), he doesn't fight (like Leoben in the miniseries), he just stops and accepts his fate. Here, the situation was similar. Once Tory was dead (and resurrection unobtainable), and the Colony fatally wounded, he accepted his fate. Mainly, that he was frakked. After that, it was either commit suicide, or risk capture. Cavil didn't want to spend the end of his days in a box surrounded by the very humans he loathed, I guess.

As for Boomer, I didn't think the decision came out of nowhere, either. In fact, it was pretty telegraphed in "Islanded in a Stream of Stars," when Boomer spends time projecting with Hera, and sobs when she has to give Hera away to Cavil. Combine that with her recently reignited feelings for Tyrol (and, by extension, the rag tag fleet) and Simon's logical coldness towards Hera, and it only makes sense that Boomer would reverse allegiances one last time.
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Old March 23 2009, 12:03 AM   #474
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Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"

It looked to me, as the fleet headed for the sun, that there weren't as many ships as in the past. Might we assume that some of the 38,000 did NOT agree, took a ship or two and headed out on their own?[/QUOTE]

I noticed that and assumed that the landable ships were on the surface as they were in the New Caprica arc. They would be disassembled and their parts distributed to build shelters, etc. It would all be dust by now anyway.
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Old March 23 2009, 01:08 AM   #475
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Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"

A handful of ship heading out on their own with limited fuel, limited food, limited medicine, and no protection would be suicide. Finally an inhabitable planet in the BSG universe has been like finding a needle in a haystack. Finding one with humans and advanced civilzation is impossible. The most likely route for those who disagreed with Lee is to land their respective ships on Earth and try to build a civilization out of that.
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Old March 23 2009, 02:25 AM   #476
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Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"

My thoughts were the situation among the civilian ships had to be getting increasingly desperate. Supplies, after four years, had to be nearly gone. Equipment had to be breaking down with no chance of repair. People had to be totally sick of eating algae gruel. But the show never touched on it much. If it had, the decision to stay would make more sense.
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Old March 23 2009, 02:50 AM   #477
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Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"

Brolan wrote: View Post
My thoughts were the situation among the civilian ships had to be getting increasingly desperate. Supplies, after four years, had to be nearly gone. Equipment had to be breaking down with no chance of repair. People had to be totally sick of eating algae gruel. But the show never touched on it much. If it had, the decision to stay would make more sense.
Even if Lee had just put it that way, rather than some tripe about colonial society being broken and they shouldn't try to rebuild it, I could have accepted the decision better.
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Old March 23 2009, 04:37 AM   #478
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Location: Toronto, Canada
Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"

^ But we're smart people. We can figure that out. And we have. I love writers who don't talk down to their audience.
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Old March 23 2009, 05:27 AM   #479
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Location: NY
Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"


I just watched it and have been trying to take it all in. I feel like I have been on this roller coaster ride for along time now, but especially since Dragon Con 08. I don't think any other show has impacted me like this one has. I don't think I have ever had as many heated discussions about life, politics and morality that this show brought about.

I loved the ending. What depth this show has had since the mini. Its so deep and I understand that depth may turn some people people off but this show will live on and be talked about for decades. RM is a true genius and I think there is no end to how many times we can re-watch this series and discover something new about how we think about ourselves.

I am blown away
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Old March 23 2009, 06:49 AM   #480
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Re: Battlestar Galactica Series Finale: "Daybreak, Part II"

Hmm... first thread where I've been more than 100 posts behind (in this case, 479 posts) and I managed to read all the way through. Go me.


It was a phenominal episode, and the best finale that I have seen. I was caught up in it the entire time, and there were many points where I was gape-jawed, grabbing my head, or just exclaming, "No way!" or, "What the hell?!?". It had the perfect balance of action and story.

Right off the bat, I would like to say that I was thrilled about the flashbacks getting some context in part 2. I would have been mighty pissed if the only flashbacks we had were in part 1, and if they continued to have nothing to do with anything. It was definately cool to see what sort of seemed like a series of "origins" stories... it struck me as short tales about how the big players ended up where they were before the miniseries. Adama refusing a desk job and retirement in favor of the Old Girl, Roslin ending up in line for the presidency, more Baltar and Caprica history, Lee's and Starbuck's attraction.

The big battle was incredible. I now realise why so little had been going on this half-season... Moore wanted to make sure he had some big bucks for this. And it was all sorts of impressive. I loved how the Opera House was worked into the chase through the Galactica, and seeing the final five in their "balcony" was incredibly creepy and cool at the same time.

A few people mentioned that the Colony still looked half-functioning when the Galactica left, and I have a few thoughts on that. First, it is conceivable that the nukes knocked it out of the stable orbit that it had, and may have disabled enough systems to prevent it from getting back into place. Second, the Galactica jumped inside her. If you recall Tigh's comments from "Someone to Watch Over Me", he commented that if the Raptor were to jump while inside the Galactica, the distortion would gut the ship. Well, not only was the Galactica inside the colony, but it would have been a much, much, much, much bigger distortion. I can't imagine that not messing things up real bad.

Tori died!!!! Yay! Of all of the characters, including the bad guys, Tori was the character I despised the most. I hated her reaction to being a Cylon the most, and I hated that she killed Callie off like that. I'm not entirely what it was, but I just hated Tori, so I was excited to see her get what she had coming. Of course, she knew what was coming too. No way would she make that whole speech about "We've all done bad things" with out knowing that she was about to be screwed. I liked how quickly everything came unravelled again, though at the time, Cavil's end did seem a mite odd. I liked how the Final Five theme came into play, and how yet another line from "All Along the Watchtower" was used. It will be interesting to rewatch this season and just count how many times a "AAtW" line gets used in "random" places.

Earth. That was the biggest damned mind-blower for me. That was a definate, " What the hell is going on?!?" moment for me, but in a good way. It took a few minutes for it to sink in that they didn't somehow end up back at the planet from "Revelations", but that there was a different earth that they paid a visit to.

It was cool to see them finally reach a happy end. They not only reached a new home, but it was a very nice place to be, especially compared to the other place they decided to call home briefly. Adama heading off was very touching, and I liked the final scene between Lee and Kara. For the breeding with the natives, and especially those arguing the "statatory rape" perspective, it probably didn't happen immediately. In fact, they probably had a couple generations before it started happening, and they probably had many generations before the human/ Cylon gene-pool became too similar. As horny as the people in the BSG universe are, I can imagine them having issues screwing cavemen. They probably didn't start "mingling" in that fashion until they had taught them some language and either imposed their sort of society on them or merged into their own. But I doubted they got it on until they were on a similar playing field. Also, I doubt that Hera was the literal Mitocondrial Eve. The Cylons, though they are always being called robots and there are some differences, are almost entirely indistinguishable from humans. Based on that, I would assume that the genetic makeups are very similar. So, what do you assume you have when you find the remains of a child from a human and a very nearly human? The last step before humans evolve.

The answers. I was always worried about the answer being "God done it." However, (and I say this as an Atheist too), I watched the episode, and I liked how it was done. It was sort of neat in its simplicity. No elaborate explination. No painting a giant picture saying, "This is how I did it and why", just a very simple, very open-ended answer. And I liked that. Give us enough information to actually count as an answer, but leave it open enough that we can still draw conclusions or ask questions. I thought it was kind of cool to find that the head characters were angels/ demons/ whatever you want to call them. I will definately have to keep that in mind during the series rewatch to see how that changes some of the interactions. Kara's departure was a very neat side of that as well.

The ending. First off, I 100% agree that the picture-perfect ending would have been Adama sitting on the hill with Roslin's grave. Initially, The modern-day end didn't bother me, and it had a very Smokey The Bear feel to it... "Only you can prevent your robots from becoming homicidal maniacs." Hearing "AAtW" over the montage of modern robots was pretty cool too. However, the more times i see that ending, the more I hate it. Maybe that ending isn't all that bad, but the Adama ending was just so gods-damned perfect! It's not a disaster, but I won't be shocked when I get my DVDs if I stop the episode at the blackout overlooking Adama.

A very worthy send-off for a phenominal series. One of my favorite episodes to date, and I am definately glad that I picked up season one a year and a half ago. No idea what possessed me to do it, but it was a wild ride that I enjoyed every minute of.
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