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Voyager There's coffee in this forum!

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Old February 16 2009, 02:45 PM   #76
JustKate
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

GodBen wrote: View Post
Emanations (*½)
I read somewhere that Brannon Braga is an atheist and speaks at atheist conferences (there are atheist conferences?) so I guess this episode plays into that a little bit. As an atheist myself I think this is an interesting idea for an episode; a society who have an absolute certainty about the afterlife, but it turns out that they end up as decaying corpses on lifeless asteroids.

The problem is that the episode feels very scattered and failed to hold my interest largely due to some goofy performances by the guest roles. Then the episode ends by suggesting that there is strange energy patterns in the asteroid field which is probably a sign that these aliens really do go to an afterlife, which is a complete about-face on what the episode had been until that point. I come away from this episode not knowing what it was about.

This is another episode which could have been done on TNG, but it does contain Harry's first death, something he will experience a couple more times before Voyager finishes her journey.
To me (and I am a religious person), this episode was - dare I say it? - kind of spiritual. Like you, GodBen, I thought it would be one of those "Oh, those poor deluded religious fools" episodes and I'm like, jeez, not again...but it didn't seem that way to me in the end.

I KIND of liked this episode. It was clumsy, but the themes were big, and I do admire an episode that tries to tackle a big theme. Albeit clumsily. So I give it a meh+a couple points for theme.

Praetor wrote:
'Emanations' is important because it is (I believe) the first episode to reinforce my one rule of 'Voyager':
The universe hates Harry Kim.
Maybe the universe is just kind of bored with Harry?

Last edited by JustKate; February 16 2009 at 03:35 PM.
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Old February 16 2009, 03:01 PM   #77
joyofvgr
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

Many comment about Emmanations being an Atheistic episdode. It may be true that the way the afterlife the people of that planet believed in was nothing more than an Asteroid which had now become a tomb, but at the end of Emmanations the crew finds an energy source around the planet that leads them to believe it is still possible that there is life after death.

KIM: Thank you, Captain. I have been a little preoccupied with the experience. I mean, all those people think that they know what happens after death. They look forward to it. They're prepared for it. But the truth is, none of it's real. They don't have an afterlife. They just decay inside those asteroids.
JANEWAY: I wouldn't be so sure of that, if I were you. That neural energy their bodies release, it becomes part of the ambient electromagnetic field surrounding the planet. Our readings also indicate the energy is unusually dynamic. There's a great deal of variation and pattern complexity, quantum density.
KIM: Are you saying you think they do have an afterlife? That the energy field is where they exist at a higher level of consciousness, just like they believe?
JANEWAY: I'm not certain, but I am certain about this. What we don't know about death is far, far greater than what we do know. See you in two days, Ensign.
KIM: Thank you, Captain.
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Old February 16 2009, 06:35 PM   #78
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

leola wrote: View Post
Are we adding Harry Death Count to the Torpedo Count and Shuttle Count?
May as well. It would be great if Harry dies in a shuttle crash caused by Voyager shooting at him with a torpedo!

Praetor wrote: View Post
'Emanations' is important because it is (I believe) the first episode to reinforce my one rule of 'Voyager':
The universe hates Harry Kim.

When you accept and watch with this in mind, everything about Voyager makes more sense. Seriously, try it.
I'll keep that in mind. In fact it already seems to have worked for me because...


Prime Factors (*****)

Now how did I forget about this little gem? When the aliens showed up in the beginning I thought it was going to be a boring episode about some nice aliens with a dark secret, but this episode really turns into something meaningful. As Janeway says in one scene, this is the first time that we have seen the Prime Directive from the other side of the fence and it explores this idea well. I would even go as far as to say that it is a perfect use of Voyager's premise.

There is a nice scene between Janeway and Tuvok where she is debating whether it is okay to break her principles in order to get home, and how could she explain it to the crew if she does not. I agree with Janeway's decision in this episode and it is made more poignant by knowing that in Endgame she is going to sacrifice her principles in order to get home.

"Principles, principles. That’s what it comes down to. Do I compromise my almighty principles?
"

The mini-mutiny in engineering is believable, and I even accept Tuvok's logic in helping them out. In the end there is a lot of technobabble, but it is okay because the solution to the problem is to pull out a phaser and shoot the illegally obtained device. Cut the BS, that's what I like to see!

It is like Eye of the Needle in that it builds up hope only to find that it was never going to pay off, but this time some of the main characters have to own up and pay the price. The final scene is fantastic and Janeway comes across really well, but so too do B'Elanna and Tuvok. My only real problem with this episode is that there is no lasting consequences (unless you count the wardrobe malfunction involving Tuvok's rank) but the final scene overpowers that to make this my first five-star episode of Voyager.
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Old February 16 2009, 06:45 PM   #79
leola
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

GodBen wrote: View Post
leola wrote: View Post
Are we adding Harry Death Count to the Torpedo Count and Shuttle Count?
May as well. It would be great if Harry dies in a shuttle crash caused by Voyager shooting at him with a torpedo!
Write that, please, somebody!
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Old February 16 2009, 06:55 PM   #80
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

I'm liking the love for Prime Factors. I just saw that episode a few weeks ago for the second time since getting the DVDs and I'm not sure why I didn't like it before then. I think it had something to do with the people with the "Homer Simpson Wires" and how they seemed a little creepy with the hospitality. The plot though, was really really good.
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Old February 16 2009, 07:03 PM   #81
Tachyon
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

Ultimate LOL @ "Homer Simpson Wires".
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Old February 16 2009, 08:32 PM   #82
Praetor
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

I've always thought 'Prime Factors' was one of Voyager's early gems too.
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Old February 16 2009, 11:06 PM   #83
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

"Prime Factors" is a good one. I like that "reversed Prime Directive" thing and the whole story is good with some interesting twists in the tale. The Sikarians for example, their hospitality turned out to be rather ego-centric.

Not to mention that Gathorel Labin was a rather slimey character.

"Emanations" is the weakest episode in season 1. I didn't like the way Braga was ramming his atheism down our throats in this one, the same for episodes like "Coda" and the horrible "Mortal Coil".

As for poor Harry, well, he's the whipping boy of the series. The poor guy who can't fetch a bucket of water on some remote planet farm without getting into trouble.

He's actually better in the books where he's more involved in action and does meaningful things but then he ends up in sickbay badly injured in many of them.
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Old February 16 2009, 11:48 PM   #84
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

Lynx wrote: View Post
As for poor Harry, well, he's the whipping boy of the series. The poor guy who can't fetch a bucket of water on some remote planet farm without getting into trouble.
He's not exactly a "favorite son", is he?

Sorry, couldn't resist...
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Old February 17 2009, 02:40 AM   #85
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

Ouch, kimc, ouch.
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Old February 17 2009, 03:35 AM   #86
leola
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

That one hurts! Kinda like a poke in the back with a dull stick...
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Old February 18 2009, 01:43 AM   #87
kimc
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

^ I saw an opening and went for it. I'm kind of weak that way.
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Old February 18 2009, 09:30 AM   #88
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

Bad moderator...bad! No caffeine for you!:P
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Old February 18 2009, 03:23 PM   #89
kimc
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

Kirk1980 wrote: View Post
Bad moderator...bad! No caffeine for you!:P
Are you sure you want to do that?
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Old February 21 2009, 10:48 PM   #90
Dane_Whitman
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

I was enjoying this thread. Hope you get back it, GodBen.
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