RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 140,197
Posts: 5,436,770
Members: 24,950
Currently online: 510
Newest member: TedCarchidi

TrekToday headlines

Trek Screenwriter Washington D.C. Appearance
By: T'Bonz on Oct 23

Two Official Starships Collection Ships
By: T'Bonz on Oct 22

Pine In New Skit
By: T'Bonz on Oct 21

Stewart In Holiday Film
By: T'Bonz on Oct 21

The Red Shirt Diaries #8
By: T'Bonz on Oct 20

IDW Publishing January Comics
By: T'Bonz on Oct 20

Retro Review: Chrysalis
By: Michelle on Oct 18

The Next Generation Season Seven Blu-ray Details
By: T'Bonz on Oct 17

CBS Launches Streaming Service
By: T'Bonz on Oct 17

Yelchin In New Indie Thriller
By: T'Bonz on Oct 17


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > Voyager

Voyager There's coffee in this forum!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old December 8 2009, 05:06 PM   #2611
rahullak
Fleet Captain
 
rahullak's Avatar
 
Location: India
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

TheGodBen, you shoulda had more faith in yourself. You coulda made your reviews into a book and sold it. Now its all in the public domain and you can't make money from it.

Or can you?
rahullak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8 2009, 07:53 PM   #2612
kimc
Coffee Mod
 
Location: Minneapolis, MN USA
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

TheGodBen wrote: View Post
Even the medal?
It bounced real nice for a game of quarters - a drinking game probably called something else in other parts.

Anyway, this is all based on heresay...
__________________
I'm certainly less inclined to bash Voyager now, it is not nearly as bad a show as many people make it out to be. - TheGodBen

Avatar by B'Elanna.
kimc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 9 2009, 02:57 AM   #2613
TheGodBen
Rear Admiral
 
TheGodBen's Avatar
 
Location: Ireland
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

Damn that T'Bonz! She doesn't like me just because I'm Praetor's sock-puppet.
__________________
...so many different suns...
TheGodBen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 9 2009, 04:24 AM   #2614
Praetor
Vice Admiral
 
Praetor's Avatar
 
Location: The fine line between continuity and fanwank.
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

^

Quiet, you.
__________________
"If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross; but it's not for the timid." - Q
Praetor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 10 2009, 02:11 PM   #2615
Tomalak
Vice Admiral
 
Tomalak's Avatar
 
Location: Liverpool
View Tomalak's Twitter Profile
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

TheGodBen wrote: View Post
Oh I'd strongly disagree with that, season 3 made me want to give up. It had some good episodes, but I think that was the season where the show went in completely the wrong direction and was content to be a TNG clone.
Yeah, pretty much. I think their attempted reboot in season 4 improved the show in the short term, but the damage had already been done. It was impossible to make it into a genuinely excellent TV programme because of the way the characters and the set-up had been established.
__________________
She bought her first new car and you hit her with a drunk driver. What, is that supposed to be funny?
Tomalak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 10 2009, 10:11 PM   #2616
Anwar
Vice Admiral
 
Anwar's Avatar
 
Location: Regina, SK, Canada
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

What, that they had decided not to let petty politics tear them apart and that it was more important they work together to survive?
Anwar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 11 2009, 12:35 AM   #2617
TheGodBen
Rear Admiral
 
TheGodBen's Avatar
 
Location: Ireland
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

Anwar wrote: View Post
What, that they had decided not to let petty politics tear them apart and that it was more important they work together to survive?
Why is it that whenever people say that Voyager missed its potential you immediately assume that they mean they wanted the show to be a goth-fest that ended with a mass suicide cult?

Here's the way that a devilishly handsome semi-hater whose name I can't quite remember felt that season 3 should have played out:
TheGoatBell wrote: View Post
Well I like my story arcs, so Basics part 2 would have been expanded over three or four episodes. The way I see it, Tom begins hearing rumours about Voyager attacking innocent vessels and he convinces the Talaxians to investigate. When they catch up with Voyager, Tom finds out that the Kazon have control of it and he is forced to flee because the Talaxian ship isn't powerful enough to take on Voyager. Tom realises that they need to form a powerful fleet to take on Voyager and the other Nistrim ships so he convinces various races including the Talaxians, the Trabe and maybe even the Vidiians to put together enough ships to take on the Nistrim before they destroy the little stability which exists in that region of space.

They retake the ship in an epic battle, the crew is rescued from wherever they are, and Voyager leaves the region which is now a little more united thanks to Tom's efforts. He could either stay behind and try to help the region on the path towards its own Federation, or he could do the "safe" thing and rejoin the crew on the journey towards Earth.

The Voyager-Nistrim incident could have been the event which led to stability in a dangerous region of space, much like the Romulan wars united the various races around Earth. I think that would have been much more fitting for a Star Trek series than having Voyager fly off leaving the problem behind.
__________________
...so many different suns...
TheGodBen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 11 2009, 02:34 AM   #2618
Tomalak
Vice Admiral
 
Tomalak's Avatar
 
Location: Liverpool
View Tomalak's Twitter Profile
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

Anwar wrote: View Post
What, that they had decided not to let petty politics tear them apart and that it was more important they work together to survive?
Not necessarily. What I mean is that they were already set in their ways with inconsistent characterisation and little continuity*. Most characters had effectively been assassinated, stuck with very narrow personalities that pigeon-holed them into various types of story. I'm thinking particularly of poor old Neelix, Harry Kim, Chakotay, and Torres and Paris to an extent. They never knew what to do with Kes. There were examples of excellent episodes featuring all these characters, but they were the exception, and never had any long-term impact.

Chief among them was Janeway, who was an incredibly inconsistent character. This is pretty hard to deny. Her moral outlook changed with the weather, and this is the fault of poor writing. I never had a problem with Kate Mulgrew, but I did with Janeway. Too often characters were bent to fit the plot rather than the story naturally following their actions.


* I mean characters not developing after the events of an episode, not technobabble "canon" things.


TheGodBen wrote: View Post
Why is it that whenever people say that Voyager missed its potential you immediately assume that they mean they wanted the show to be a goth-fest that ended with a mass suicide cult?
Exactly, there's always the assumption that critics of Voyager just wanted it to be written by Ron Moore and be like DS9 or BSG. That's not the case. The show was the unfortunate result of studio politics, and apparently internal politics within the writing staff, which meant it never really developed a consistent style and personality to my mind.

You can be episodic and be good, but you must have someone in control who knows the direction the show is taking. TNG worked brilliantly, because the writers knew what a TNG type story was. I couldn't say the same for Voyager.
__________________
She bought her first new car and you hit her with a drunk driver. What, is that supposed to be funny?
Tomalak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 12 2009, 02:23 AM   #2619
Praetor
Vice Admiral
 
Praetor's Avatar
 
Location: The fine line between continuity and fanwank.
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

Well said, gents.
__________________
"If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross; but it's not for the timid." - Q
Praetor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 1 2010, 11:43 PM   #2620
You_Guyz
Commander
 
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

Collective was such a cheesy episode.
You_Guyz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 3 2010, 04:43 PM   #2621
TheGodBen
Rear Admiral
 
TheGodBen's Avatar
 
Location: Ireland
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

I just posed a question in the Enterprise thread, but I know that many of the people that read this thread decided not to follow along in that thread for various reasons so I'll ask it here too:

TheGodBen wrote: View Post
Advice needed:

This is a rare thing because I'm actually interested in what other people think.

I know that this thread has died down a lot in the last few weeks so I'm not sure if there's any interest in me continuing reviewing episodes after Enterprise, so I'm trying to gauge people's opinions. My original plan was to move onto DS9 after I had finished Enterprise, but over the last few weeks I've been considering trying out Babylon 5 instead. I know I have to watch it some day if I'm to retain my geek membership card (and I need to keep that to get the ladies) and the longer I stay on this board the more likely I am to read spoilers, so it would be better to do it sooner rather than later.

It would be a thread similar to this one and the Voyager thread, except I'd be watching the show "blind" since I've not watched it before and have little idea where the plot is heading beyond something called the Shadow War. I'm sure people have done threads like that on B5 in the past, so is there normally any interest for them? Has there been one recently? Does anybody have any interest in me doing such a thread? Would you prefer that I stick with my plan of reviewing DS9 instead? Am I just wasting my time doing these threads?

Let me know your opinions any time before I finish Enterprise, I'll have to make my decision shortly before then so that I can make arrangements if I need to borrow the B5 DVDs.
So, B5, DS9, or should I stop? I report, you decide.
__________________
...so many different suns...
TheGodBen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 3 2010, 05:01 PM   #2622
apenpaap
Commodore
 
apenpaap's Avatar
 
Location: Cardassia, where only the military metaphors work.
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

DS9.
__________________
The Obsidian Order: Proudly watching you since the 19th century. And looking manly in our purple hats while doing that.
apenpaap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 3 2010, 09:00 PM   #2623
Frazzled
Commander
 
Frazzled's Avatar
 
Location: The mess hall
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

DS9. And then this 'lady' would then be in your queue, if I wasn't already spoken for
Frazzled is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 4 2010, 03:09 AM   #2624
PolloCaballo
Ensign
 
Location: Florida
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

I agree. DS9.
PolloCaballo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 4 2010, 05:41 PM   #2625
seigezunt
Vice Admiral
 
seigezunt's Avatar
 
Location: Splashing on some Tiberius before a night on the town
Re: A Semi-Hater Revisits Voyager

D. S. 9.
__________________
I am constantly surprised by the close-mindedness of some fans...this means change as well as a positive attitude. Without those things, how can we ever achieve that Trek future we enjoyed so much on TV? --Bjo Trimble
seigezunt is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 01:23 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.