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Old October 19 2008, 01:54 AM   #46
Lyon_Wonder
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Re: ST XI ships

I think it's a secondary hull on the upper pylon with a deflector dish, and not a warp a nacelle. The Kelvin's likely a single warp nacelle design, suggesting it wasn’t Starfleet’s largest, most top-of-the line ship. The upper hull could probably hold extra censors and instrumentation too. It frees up saucer space by not having an NX class-style dish.
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Old October 19 2008, 02:31 AM   #47
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Re: ST XI ships

Lyon_Wonder wrote: View Post
I think it's a secondary hull on the upper pylon with a deflector dish, and not a warp a nacelle. The Kelvin's likely a single warp nacelle design, suggesting it wasn’t Starfleet’s largest, most top-of-the line ship. The upper hull could probably hold extra censors and instrumentation too. It frees up saucer space by not having an NX class-style dish.
I agree. I think this is also probably the beginning of Starfleet utilizing a secondary hull to house main engineering. It actually makes the most logical sense from a safety standpoint - If there is a catastrophic event within engineering, it can minimize damage to the primary hull (or to even jettison the secondary hull).

There is where I think it was a major design flaw in the NX designs - To have the warp core buried deep within the ship. Perhaps there was an "incident" on an NX ship that forced the configuration layout to change to the Kelvin's design.
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Old October 19 2008, 03:16 AM   #48
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Re: ST XI ships

Ronald Held wrote: View Post
After the 0514 was destroyed, that number(minus the 0) was free to be reassigned?
I sometimes wonder about that. Personally, I've always preferred the idea that each class has a series number, and all ships built or converted to that class use that numerical series (unless there is an exception, as might have been true with the Constellation in TOS). Registries from lost vessels generally are not reassigned to avoid confusion, although it's possible that another class might use a similar series number (in which case the vessels would probably be referred to by a combination of their registry and their vessel class).

Thus if you have a frigate class that has a 2600 registry series, and you also have a cruiser class that happens to have a 2600 series, then an individual vessel from on of those classes would show up as USS Something FR26xx.

This works for most registries, though others are more difficult. FJ had all of his cruisers with 1700 and early 1800 registries, with the later 1800 numbers being given to the transports. But the scouts and destroyers had sequential registries, with the destroyers starting at 500 and the scouts picking up at 585 and going into the 600s.
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Old October 19 2008, 03:56 AM   #49
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Re: ST XI ships

The thing that's always annoyed me was the slavish adherence to NCC for registry.

Ships don't *all* have the same prefix code in real life -- it's how we avoid insane registry numbers like "NCC-15432".

For example, CVN is a "nuclear aircraft carrier" -- CVN 76 is the Ronald Reagan, CVN 73 is the George Washington, etc. FF are frigates -- FF 1041 is the Davidson, FF 1052 is the Knox, FF 168 is the Amick. DDG are guided missile destroyers -- the DDG 14 is the Buchanan, the DDG 16 is the Joseph Strauss, etc.

IMO, NCC should be restricted to ships of the Enterprise's class ("heavy cruiser") and Mirandas, Novas, Intrepids, etc. should have different registry prefixes.

But, again, people who write for TV seem to lack a real grasp of how military things work.


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Old October 19 2008, 02:27 PM   #50
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Re: ST XI ships

^^Well, the model wasn't necessarily military; as I recall, Roddenberry and Jefferies chose "NCC" based on civilian aircraft call letters.
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Old October 19 2008, 04:47 PM   #51
Captain Robert April
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Re: ST XI ships

Loosely based, and never clearly defined, either.
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Old October 19 2008, 05:08 PM   #52
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Re: ST XI ships

AJBryant wrote: View Post
it's how we avoid insane registry numbers like "NCC-15432".
Why is that insane?
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Old October 19 2008, 06:04 PM   #53
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Re: ST XI ships

Especially since we DO have numbers like that, and much higher.
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Old October 19 2008, 06:31 PM   #54
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Re: ST XI ships

EJD1984 wrote: View Post
I've just noticed a possible new design astetic with the Kelvin (and possibility the Enterprise as well).

There doesn't appear to be any windows along the saucer's edge.


This shot is in motion (look at the stars) so some details are blurred, but there are some windows on the rim, and probably more of them hidden behind that green ship. From their position it almost looks like the rim might be more like 3 or 4 decks thick!

Also, it almost looks like there might be 3 forward ports like on the TOS ENT, but they are not lit.

And call me crazy, but that really looks like a row of windows on the front of the bridge. Though, if the ship is big enough there might be a ready room or lounge in front of the bridge. This is supported by the bridge cieling dome being so tiny in comparison to the bridge structure itself.

If this ship is supposed to be older/smaller than the Enterprise, the ENT herself could end up being...kinda way way bigger than 947 feet.
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Old October 20 2008, 12:41 AM   #55
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Re: ST XI ships

Lyon_Wonder wrote: View Post
I think it's a secondary hull on the upper pylon with a deflector dish, and not a warp a nacelle. The Kelvin's likely a single warp nacelle design, suggesting it wasn’t Starfleet’s largest, most top-of-the line ship. The upper hull could probably hold extra censors and instrumentation too. It frees up saucer space by not having an NX class-style dish.
I actually think the Kelvin is an over/under nacelle ship as per the flip side of this reasoning. Over/under designs, like the Akula class, tend to be more combat oriented ships (at least in fandom). The Kelvin seems to be packing a fair number of gun turrets ahead of the bridge for a surveyor type. It would provide more dramatic tension if one of the toughest ships starfleet had at the time got it's ass kicked (by post Nemesis/TNG romulans, which isn't exactly a fair fight) so the subsequent "victory" of young Kirk, old Spock et al would be that much more exciting and satisfying.

I 'd rather have Kirk's dad posted as XO to a ship with some cajones. It looks to me so far that the Kelvin related plot point would involve Nero's attack causing the premature death of the elder Kirk and subsequent efforts by our heros to set things right. I admit that young Kirk being a central character in the film is at odds with a scenario where his birth was prevented, but I guess that's why I'm not a script writer.

Last edited by shipfisher; October 20 2008 at 12:58 AM.
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Old October 20 2008, 02:49 AM   #56
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Re: ST XI ships

^ Unless Kirk the second was already born by the time of the Kelvin's plot involvement. Maybe this was Kirk the first's first deployment after the birth of his son. Could have easily been given a year or two leave to care for his wife and kid. Of course, we don't know when exactly the Kelvin enters the story, so what I've just said could have no truth whatsoever...
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Old October 20 2008, 03:06 AM   #57
Captain Robert April
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Re: ST XI ships

ancient wrote: View Post
EJD1984 wrote: View Post
I've just noticed a possible new design astetic with the Kelvin (and possibility the Enterprise as well).

There doesn't appear to be any windows along the saucer's edge.


This shot is in motion (look at the stars) so some details are blurred, but there are some windows on the rim, and probably more of them hidden behind that green ship. From their position it almost looks like the rim might be more like 3 or 4 decks thick!

Also, it almost looks like there might be 3 forward ports like on the TOS ENT, but they are not lit.

And call me crazy, but that really looks like a row of windows on the front of the bridge. Though, if the ship is big enough there might be a ready room or lounge in front of the bridge. This is supported by the bridge cieling dome being so tiny in comparison to the bridge structure itself.

If this ship is supposed to be older/smaller than the Enterprise, the ENT herself could end up being...kinda way way bigger than 947 feet.
And the hits just keep on coming....
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Old October 20 2008, 03:32 AM   #58
ancient
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Re: ST XI ships

Hmm, huge ships with windows on the bridge, bumpy hull detail, and lots of weapon turrets...getting attacked by lots of small fighter-like thingies...

Where have I seen that before...

WAITER! THERE'S A STAR WARS IN MY TREK!

And the hits just keep on coming....
It's not what I would've expected say, last year. But I'm generally too laid back about this sort of thing to get worked up over it. Heck, I don't even care if they rotate the bridge!

I'm pretty sure the size of the ships has to be significantly bigger than the originals. The trailer and large bridge size seem to suggest that, anyway. I sure as heck don't think the new bridge could fit in the old ship, it's too wide.
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Old October 20 2008, 04:00 AM   #59
Captain Robert April
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Re: ST XI ships

My guesstimation at this point is that we could be looking at a 1500 foot long ship.
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Old October 20 2008, 04:03 AM   #60
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Re: ST XI ships

I agree. At least.
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