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Retro Review: The Emperor’s New Cloak
By: Michelle on Dec 20

Star Trek Opera
By: T'Bonz on Dec 19

New Abrams Project
By: T'Bonz on Dec 18

IDW Publishing March 2015 Comics
By: T'Bonz on Dec 17

Paramount Star Trek 3 Expectations
By: T'Bonz on Dec 17

Star Trek #39 Sneak Peek
By: T'Bonz on Dec 16

Star Trek 3 Potential Director Shortlist
By: T'Bonz on Dec 16

Official Starships Collection Update
By: T'Bonz on Dec 15

Retro Review: Prodigal Daughter
By: Michelle on Dec 13

Sindicate Lager To Debut In The US Next Week
By: T'Bonz on Dec 12


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Old September 3 2008, 01:58 AM   #46
Brutal Strudel
Rear Admiral
 
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Location: Here, frozen between time and place, not even the brightest lights escape...
Re: 'Star Trek' Needed A Reboot

Temis the Vorta wrote: View Post
Nah, it didn't need a reboot, and focusing on trivial details was not the problem with VOY and the first three seasons of ENT anyway. Lack of new ideas was the problem, but those new ideas could easily have been merged with existing canon, just as DS9 took a new and invigorating approach without doing any serious damage to canon.
DS9 was perhaps the most overtly worshipful of TOS (and TAS) of any spin-off and yet it took trek further into new ground than VOY and ENT, which were essentially TNG re-treads.

Gotta disagree with tthe post that said that ENT is viewed as a greater fiasco than the Schumacher Batman movies. I have made so secret of my disdain for ENT but it was--even at its stereotypically Bermagian worst*--heads and shoulders above those two abominations.

*Well, not countin TATV--that was Schumacher level bad.

EDIT TO ADD: In response to original gist of this thread, a TOS movie could be made that respected canon and still had tons of freedom so long as the only canon it referenced was the very little laid down (and often contradicted) in the original 79 episodes. Re-boot Trek? Sure, all the way back to 1969 (or 1982, maybe).
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Old September 3 2008, 04:56 AM   #47
TJinPgh
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Re: 'Star Trek' Needed A Reboot

The things I find most entertaining about Enterprise is that the very people who are claiming that the franchise needs a reboot now are the ones who were bitching the most that Enterprise wasn't contributing enough to canon.

I, personally, thought the Xindi season was, by and large, pretty well done. But, week after week, all we got was the SAME complaint.

We've never neard of the Xindi, so this story line sucks.

At any rate, the comments about this movie needing to appeal to the mainstream public to succeed is well taken.

The problem, once again, is that Star Trek, like it or not, has NEVER been mainstream.

And, for the last 40 years, most of us have liked it that way.

Unfortunately, there are 150 million reasons why they no longer care what we think.

Even more unfortunate, is that we are the only ones who will care.
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Old September 3 2008, 06:19 PM   #48
TJinPgh
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Re: 'Star Trek' Needed A Reboot

Temis the Vorta wrote: View Post
And reactions like this is the reason Lindlof and others involved in the movie don't dare confess that they are doing a TOS recasting for very solid business reasons - its the approach most likely to work in reviving Star Trek.

It's idiotic to hold this against them. They work in a business where they are expected to be financially successful. The fact that Star Trek is a franchise plays a large part in its financial success. That's just the way it is, regardless of how anyone feels about it, so why not just accept it and move on?
I don't hold the need to make money against them. I do, however, reject the notion that the franchise needed to move in this direction to do it.

I further reject the notion that it wasn't possible to work within the existing "Star Trek Universe" and make money, also.

Any time I hear something like that, it suggests to me that the people involved aren't nearly as creative as they think they are.

From a purely financial standpoint, I've maintained that this entire project was ill conceived from the start.

It has NOTHING to do with whether or not I think the movie, itself, will be any good. It's everything else about it that makes it bad business-wise.

It's over-budgeted. It's ill-timed. And chocked full of actors that the average person on the street has no clue who they are.

This would have been a better direction for a direct to DVD film or, perhaps a syndicated series than a $150m movie.

But then, as I've said before, if it were anybody other than JJ Abrams connected with it, this exact same movie would have had a budget of less than $50m and would have BEEN a direct to DVD feature.

As for moving on, to an extent, I have. Star Trek, for me, ended with Nemesis and the cancellation of Enterprise.

I will watch New Voyages/Phase II because it costs me nothing to do so, and I recognize the effort they've gone to to get it as close to the original as possible, along with the help of people who helped make Trek possible over the years.

But, sadly, I will no longer support the franchise financially. I will not see this movie in the theater. I will not rent the video. I will not netflix it.

Best case scenerio is that I happen to see it on TV at some point, or maybe pick up the DVD at a yard sale.

That's my personal choice. It was made before I knew anything about this project after years of throwing my hard earned money after things that have ruined the shows they were rebooting.

I neither expect nor care if anybody agrees with my reasons. Nor am I so arrogant as to believe that my personal decision will have any impact on the financial success of this movie... or lack thereof.

Charlie Kelly wrote: View Post
I'm not saying you can't get an excellent film with a reboot but I'm saying you can get an excellent film without rebooting as well.

I just want to see them continue the Star Trek Universe I've grown up with, not start a new one. That's just my personal preference of cause, I'm not saying either option is 'wrong'.
I am.

I think there's something to be said for leaving some things alone.

If you need to change things about the original in order to return to it, you've not returned to the original. At best, you've returned to a variation on a theme.

If you're as creative as you believe yourself to be, create something new.

A new ship. A new cast and crew. Just as they did with TNG, DS9, VOY and ENT.

Or, heaven forbid, create something entirely new from scratch and abandon the crutch all together.
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Old September 4 2008, 05:49 PM   #49
Saxman1
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Re: 'Star Trek' Needed A Reboot

I am sure some author will jump all over me for saying this, but I'm looking forward to the Abrams movie even if it's a re-vist/re-imagining/whatever with TOS characters. Why?

I have tried and tried to get into the relaunch/continuing voyages/adventures of the DS9, ENT, TNG and VOY crews and they all pretty much fall flat for me. I know the fault lies with yours truly. But for me:

- VOY relaunch: the Borg are back and this time, BOY are they mad!

- TNG relaunch: the Borg are back and this time, BOY are they mad! Most novels end with the Borg defeated. Not quite. Read the next novel and see what Picard has to face THIS TIME from THE BORG!

I for one am sick to death of the Borg. I, my wife and many of our friends who love Trek wish to God the Borg had gone away after TBOBW. We have been Borged to death at this point.

The Titan novels spend all their time talking about how diverse, diverse, diverse the crew is and then Troi agonizing over whether to have a baby or not. That has now spread to the TNG novels as well with another character...

Seeing our old friend Mr. Nimoy as Spock one last time is a lot more appealing than yet another battle with the Borg or baby agonizations (I have two kids I adore, BTW), at least to me. Again, my bad.

To answer what one poster will no doubt ask, "Why don't you just stop reading the novels, then?"

I have.
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