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Old March 23 2008, 10:55 PM   #16
Bak_and_Blue
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

Someone above made a good point. Spartan culture (if I'm not mistaken) and all of pre-Hellenistic greek culture had a strong homosexual element. I don't see Klingons as so far removed from a warrior ethos that would encourage a closeness where lovers would fight fiercely for one another in battle.
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Old March 23 2008, 11:16 PM   #17
EnsignRicky
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

Well, this was a big dissapointment. And here I thought this was going to be a thread about people who like to have sex with houses; Alas, I guess I'm still the only person I know who keeps a few copies of 'Better Homes And Gardens' under his matress.
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Old March 23 2008, 11:30 PM   #18
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

I don't think Brokeback Mountain style sex scenes could make Klingons interesting.
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Old March 23 2008, 11:42 PM   #19
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

Deks wrote: View Post
Plecostomus wrote: View Post
Having a well-liked alien race handle the subject is the best way to go about it, agreed. If they can do that, then we can refine from there and make a major CHARACTER homo/bi.

I'm leaning twords bi myself simply because it can be handled with humor, like how I handle my "bi-ness" in real life.

CAPTAIN: "So, bringing Commander Swarth to the dance, Number One?
XO: "Naah, we broke up. Stupid women, they're all the same."
CAPTAIN: "So you're not going after all?
XO: "Depends if Lt. Hoark makes up his mind or not.
CAPTAIN: (deadpan) "Oh that would be nice you two make such a cute couple."

...see? Not so hard, and it's silly.
True, but I'm personally tired of homosexuality/bisexuality/trans/other being equated on TV with 'happy'/'comedic' ... or even worse, with a 'joke'.
It's getting tiresome and sometimes it's insulting even.
Not to mention that some people could think of such a scene as 'silly' indeed (translation: 'that's all?', 'why do they bother?' etc ...).
I mean, I like the idea, but I was thinking with something that has more ... substance and detail.

Good point.

The trick would be to balance it just like any charater. Light moments like this, along with normal moments and dramatic moments. H

THIS REQUIRES MORE THOUGHT however Easter Wine has caused a distinct disruption in normal cognitive processes at the moment.
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Old March 24 2008, 12:23 AM   #20
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

Cyke101 wrote: View Post
[
If anything, I would think that, with the Klingons being the most Spartan or most Samurai-like of Trek cultures, they'd probably engage on some level of socially acceptable homosexual practices, just as certain Earth warrior cultures practiced hundreds of years ago.
You know, that makes perfect sense. I can see that. Totally. It would have been a bold move, one that Star Trek should not have been afraid of taking. Could have made a great episode.

Trek hasn't taken a risk in years. All we got were action episodes, which were fine - but the "issue" episodes of Trek died out years. I remember the Q episode about Euthanasia in Voyager, but I don't remember too much since then.

NuBSG confronts issues more than Enterprise never did.

Did Enterprise tackle any issues?
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Old March 24 2008, 12:37 AM   #21
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

With the Klingons, it'd be a bit problematic, considering that any attempt to initiate a mating ritual would be interpreted as an attack by another male Klingon—unless, of course, it was delivered with a bit of that far-famed Klingon love poetry.

Perhaps that's the only time it's acceptable to flee from battle, eh?

"Huhr?!"

Other than the Dax/Khan kiss (which could be dismissed as residual affection derived from a heterosexual relationship), we have little overt evidence of homosexual behavior in Star Trek, which could mean any number of things, in universe, such as:
  • It's entirely a non-issue and completely acceptable under IDIC, but not particularly widespread
  • It was a uniquely human genetic aberration that died out as man began to tinker with his genome—subtly (or not-so-subtly) discouraged so as to aid children in avoiding a still-prevalent stigma; in addition, I certainly think gays might have been targeted during the Eugenics Wars, and those of Colonel Green
  • It proved correctible with advanced medical and/or psychological techniques
I'm not espousing any of the above, by the way. Each of them, though, is a logical outgrowth of a particular perspective on the origins of/motivations for homosexuality.

I do think various undercurrents of homoeroticism were subtly woven into the Trek tapestry, though: The Seven of Nine/Janeway, Reed/Hayes and Garak/Bashir relationships seemed to possess certain elements that could be interpreted as sexual interplay or tension—though that's certainly not the only way to interpret various of these interactions.
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Old March 24 2008, 12:40 AM   #22
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

JM1776 wrote: View Post
I do think various undercurrents of homoeroticism were subtly woven into the Trek tapestry, though: The Seven of Nine/Janeway, Reed/Hayes and Garak/Bashir [...]
Not to mention Kirk/Spock.
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Old March 24 2008, 01:09 AM   #23
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

Your avatar is a good estimation of Kirk's reaction when such is insinuated.
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Old March 24 2008, 01:48 AM   #24
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

There hasn't been an actual homosexual relationship on Trek yet. There's been some 'titilation' moments for 'lesbian' moments, but that's it.
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Old March 24 2008, 02:46 AM   #25
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

I'm sure the enlightened cultures would have no problem with it, and the small-minded, backwards ones would.

Just like on Earth today.
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Old March 24 2008, 03:40 AM   #26
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

jon1701 wrote: View Post
Cyke101 wrote: View Post
[
If anything, I would think that, with the Klingons being the most Spartan or most Samurai-like of Trek cultures, they'd probably engage on some level of socially acceptable homosexual practices, just as certain Earth warrior cultures practiced hundreds of years ago.
You know, that makes perfect sense. I can see that. Totally. It would have been a bold move, one that Star Trek should not have been afraid of taking. Could have made a great episode.

Trek hasn't taken a risk in years. All we got were action episodes, which were fine - but the "issue" episodes of Trek died out years. I remember the Q episode about Euthanasia in Voyager, but I don't remember too much since then.

NuBSG confronts issues more than Enterprise never did.

Did Enterprise tackle any issues?
Yep, See Cogenitor for one example, Observer Effect for another
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Last edited by Bak_and_Blue; March 24 2008 at 03:45 AM.
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Old March 24 2008, 06:34 AM   #27
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

Non-Trekkie Trekkie wrote: View Post
JiNX-01 wrote: View Post
Non-Trekkie Trekkie wrote: View Post
Klingon Ferries?
What's wrong with a Klingon Ferry? It's just takes people and cargo from one side of a river to the other.

Hey, I'm cool with it! Just as long as it doesn't prance to the other side of the river.
Have you met Koloth?
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Old March 24 2008, 06:49 AM   #28
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

EnsignRicky wrote: View Post
Well, this was a big dissapointment. And here I thought this was going to be a thread about people who like to have sex with houses; Alas, I guess I'm still the only person I know who keeps a few copies of 'Better Homes And Gardens' under his matress.

Uh oh, it all comes out now....
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Old March 24 2008, 07:43 AM   #29
Maurice
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

JM1776 wrote: View Post
  • It was a uniquely human genetic aberration that died out as man began to tinker with his genome—subtly (or not-so-subtly) discouraged so as to aid children in avoiding a still-prevalent stigma; in addition, I certainly think gays might have been targeted during the Eugenics Wars, and those of Colonel Green
Except it's not restricted to humans...it's been observed in species ranging from whiptail lizards to bottlenose dolphins, flamingoes, vampire bats and giraffes.
  • It proved correctible with advanced medical and/or psychological techniques
"Correctable" implies defect, which I take issue with.
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Old March 24 2008, 08:22 AM   #30
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Re: Universal Homesexuals?

jon1701 wrote: View Post
Did Enterprise tackle any issues?
9/11. Their position was that it was bad.
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