RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 135,847
Posts: 5,220,866
Members: 24,232
Currently online: 708
Newest member: glasssplashback

TrekToday headlines

Kurtzman And Orci Go Solo
By: T'Bonz on Apr 22

Star Trek #32 Preview
By: T'Bonz on Apr 22

Voyager Bridge Via The Oculus Rift
By: T'Bonz on Apr 21

Miles Away Glyph Award Nominations
By: T'Bonz on Apr 21

Q Meets NuTrek Crew
By: T'Bonz on Apr 18

Pine In Talks For Drama
By: T'Bonz on Apr 18

New X-Men: Days of Future Past Trailer
By: T'Bonz on Apr 17

Nimoy to Receive Award
By: T'Bonz on Apr 17

Star Trek Special: Flesh and Stone Comic
By: T'Bonz on Apr 16

These Are The Voyages TOS Season Two Book Review
By: T'Bonz on Apr 16


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies I-X

Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old March 23 2008, 09:47 AM   #1
MicahBrack
Lieutenant Commander
 
MicahBrack's Avatar
 
Location: USA
TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

Ronald D. Moore recently "decried how the Trek movies were always about Picard and Data, with little for the other characters to do, and he doesn't want that to happen to BSG."

Upon reading that, I immediately thought...Oh my God, that's true!

Generations, First Contact, Insurrection, and Nemesis...all focused on the two as the two main characters. To the point where the other so-called main characters hardly had any lines. It was all about Picard and his family's legacy, Data and his new emotions, Picard and the Borg, Data and the Borg, Picard and his protecting the Ba'ku, Data being involuntarily used in the conspiracy against the Ba'ku, Picard and Shinzon, and Data and B-4.

It's a real shame the other characters got so little attention. Especially Dr. Crusher. She barely did anything in the movies. At least Geordi had some influence in the plot of Generations, Riker and Troi got married, and Worf is always noticeable. They could have at least made some references to the attraction between Crusher and Picard.

Does anyone else have any opinions of the focus on Picard and Data at the expense of the others?
MicahBrack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23 2008, 11:55 AM   #2
captcalhoun
Admiral
 
Location: everywhere
Re: TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

yeah, i agree, but when Stewart became a producer, it's hardly surprising he got lionised and Data was supposedly the most popular character... it's like Wolverine in the X-Men movies, he dominates proceedings and overshadows the other X-Men...
captcalhoun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23 2008, 01:31 PM   #3
Keith1701
Rear Admiral
 
Keith1701's Avatar
 
Location: Warner Robins Georgia
Re: TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

captcalhoun wrote: View Post
yeah, i agree, but when Stewart became a producer, it's hardly surprising he got lionised and Data was supposedly the most popular character... it's like Wolverine in the X-Men movies, he dominates proceedings and overshadows the other X-Men...
Yes, I agree.......It would have been nice to see more of a story around Riker as well.
__________________
Keith1701
Live Long, and Prosper....
"Make It So" -- ENGAGE!!!!
Keith1701 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23 2008, 02:16 PM   #4
Dane_Whitman
Fleet Captain
 
Dane_Whitman's Avatar
 
Location: Dinner to bug.
Re: TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

Yep, it's one of my biggest beefs with the TNG movies, it became the Data & Picard show and characters such as Worf and Crusher were reduced to the status of talking furniture.
__________________
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves,
but wiser people so full of doubts."

- Bertrand Russell
Dane_Whitman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23 2008, 02:21 PM   #5
StolenThunder
Poster
 
StolenThunder's Avatar
 
Location: Scotland
Re: TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

Moving to Trek Movies.
StolenThunder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23 2008, 03:35 PM   #6
EyalM
Captain
 
Location: Haifa
Re: TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

MicahBrack wrote: View Post
Ronald D. Moore recently "decried how the Trek movies were always about Picard and Data, with little for the other characters to do...
Too bad Ron Moore had nothing to do with any of the TNG movies...
EyalM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23 2008, 03:48 PM   #7
ialfan
Fleet Captain
 
Re: TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

EyalM wrote: View Post
MicahBrack wrote: View Post
Ronald D. Moore recently "decried how the Trek movies were always about Picard and Data, with little for the other characters to do...
Too bad Ron Moore had nothing to do with any of the TNG movies...
...Except Generations and First Contact.

Last edited by ialfan; March 23 2008 at 04:08 PM.
ialfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23 2008, 04:28 PM   #8
Lord Garth
Guest
 
Re: TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

What I like about Ron Moore is that he's learned and grown from his experiences on Star Trek. Ron Moore today would not write GEN or FC the same way.
  Reply With Quote
Old March 23 2008, 04:30 PM   #9
billcosby
Commodore
 
billcosby's Avatar
 
Location: billcosby
Re: TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

Some of the best and most memorable TNG episodes featured Geordi, Beverly, Riker etc. So I agree with the Picard/Data travesty. It was shoved down our throats in Insurrection/Nemesis. TNG was at its best, an ensemble cast.

Although... to play devil's advocate, TOS films focused pretty much on Kirk Spock McCoy. And there's no problems there.

Are there???
__________________
My 1st Edition TrekCCG virtual expansion: http://billcosbytrekccg.blogspot.com/

billcosby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23 2008, 04:35 PM   #10
Sir Rhosis
Commodore
 
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Re: TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

Well, I think one of the reasons was that Picard and Data were certainly the most recognizable to the general public. TOS had the triumvirate of Kirk, Spock and McCoy, and many people recalled them as a unit almost. TNG did not have this type of well-known iconic bond amongst its characters. So in a way, I can understand why the writers chose to emphasize Picard and Data. Many casual viewers knew the show only as being about the "bald captain and the robot."

But, honestly, look at the TOS movies. Chekov, Uhura and Sulu rarely got any subplots of substance. Scotty got a few good scenes here and there, but mostly the films were about Kirk and Spock, with a strong supporting performance each time by Kelley as McCoy.

Sir Rhosis

EDIT: To add that billcosby posted while I was composing. I do agree with him, though.
__________________
Read my Star Trek script reviews at http://www.orionpressfanzines.com/articles/unseen.htm


Read "Origins" at http://www.orionpressfanzines.com/articles/origins.htm

Last edited by Sir Rhosis; March 23 2008 at 04:37 PM. Reason: acknowledge another poster who made the same point as I did
Sir Rhosis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23 2008, 05:04 PM   #11
Kegek
Rear Admiral
 
Kegek's Avatar
 
Location: Somewhere You're Not
Re: TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

billcosby wrote: View Post
Although... to play devil's advocate, TOS films focused pretty much on Kirk Spock McCoy. And there's no problems there.

Are there???
Nope. That accurately reflected the dynamic of the series. Scotty, Uhura Chekov and Sulu weren't terribly important. They did have their moments; but they had their moments in the movies as well. While Picard and Data were easily two of TNG's most interesting and compelling characters, the show was more of an ensemble than TOS. Not as much of an ensemble as DS9, true, it's somewhere in the middle.

By itself, I don't have a problem with the films focusing on these two characters. But I do think it was part of a wider problem: The films were ignoring a lot of what made the series work and trying to turn it into something it wasn't. This was hardly the most erroneous example (and could have worked); but it's one of them.
__________________
"Tell me this, do they have auditions for television?"
"That's all television is, my dear - nothing but auditions."

- All About Eve.
Kegek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 24 2008, 02:30 AM   #12
Peach Wookiee
Cuddly Mod of Doom
 
Peach Wookiee's Avatar
 
Location: Peach Wookiee
Re: TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

I think that's true.
Peach Wookiee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 24 2008, 03:44 AM   #13
Opus
Commodore
 
Opus's Avatar
 
Location: Bloom County
Re: TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

Dane_Whitman wrote: View Post
Yep, it's one of my biggest beefs with the TNG movies, it became the Data & Picard show and characters such as Worf and Crusher were reduced to the status of talking furniture.
That's not true! Furniture serves a purpose in a scene...
__________________
Now that I've seen it, and have also had time to mellow, to really think about it, I now find it absolutely, unbearably repulsive in every way except for some of the acting. - about The Wrath of Khan. Interstat, Issue 62: 1982
Opus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 24 2008, 03:49 AM   #14
Opus
Commodore
 
Opus's Avatar
 
Location: Bloom County
Re: TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

billcosby wrote: View Post
Some of the best and most memorable TNG episodes featured Geordi, Beverly, Riker etc. So I agree with the Picard/Data travesty. It was shoved down our throats in Insurrection/Nemesis. TNG was at its best, an ensemble cast.

Although... to play devil's advocate, TOS films focused pretty much on Kirk Spock McCoy. And there's no problems there.

Are there???
Check the credits for TOS: Shatner, Nimoy, and (for the second and third seasons) Kelly were the only stars of the show. Even in the TOS movies, Doohan, Takei, Koenig and Nichols are only co-stars.

TNG was a true ensemble show, but the movies destroyed that dynamic. I do see it as one reason why TNG's movies weren't as successful.
__________________
Now that I've seen it, and have also had time to mellow, to really think about it, I now find it absolutely, unbearably repulsive in every way except for some of the acting. - about The Wrath of Khan. Interstat, Issue 62: 1982
Opus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 24 2008, 04:52 AM   #15
Manticore
Rear Admiral
 
Location: Manticore
Re: TNG movies: Always about Picard and Data!

To be fair, First Contact managed to break this mold a fair bit, by giving Riker, Troi, and Geordi their own significant subplot. Well, Riker and Geordi. Mostly Riker, now that I think about it.

And back up on the Enterprise, even Crusher had a couple of good scenes, one in sickbay, and on the bridge when she tries to convince Picard to destroy the Enterprise, and then follows his orders when he refuses. Likewise with Worf.

Honestly, now that I think about it, I'd argue that the main characters in First Contact were Picard, Cochrane, and Riker, with Data, the Queen, Lily, and Geordi essentially 'tied' in a second tier, and Troi, Crusher, and Worf in a third tier--not much of an arc, but still having memorable scenes.

I'm forced to wonder how Treks 9 and 10 would have worked had Braga and Moore kept writing them (and not had their little feud that broke that generally-amazing team up).
__________________
Lord Vorkosigan does not always get what he wants.
WWJAD
Manticore is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:52 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.