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Old February 8 2008, 02:26 AM   #556
blue_one
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Location: Lower New York
Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

aridas sofia said:
Cary L. Brown said:
...I think it's more debatable than some of you guys do... it really really looks like the back of the 1701(r)... in form and in size... more than it does like any nacelle detail I've ever seen (including the one seen here). But as I've said... we'll all know soon enough, won't we?
You make a good point here. Perhaps the comparison worth making is not to a photo of the aft secondary hull of a 1701 model, but rather to a photo of the aft secondary hull of a 1701 refit model.

Though I think it's a nacelle, the lack of any radiating screen on the intercoolers makes them look like... well, to quote somebody, wings.
I don't post here much anymore, but this comment made me think (dangerous, I know...).

We've been hearing for some time that this film may involve time travel and/or alternate universes. And we've probably all noticed the distinct similarities between the teaser Enterprise and the E-refit. So my (dangerous) thought is, what if the Enterprise we see in the teaser actually is the refit?

I know it doesn't make a whole lot of sense from a publicity point of view, but it makes some twisted sort of sense in my head...
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Old February 8 2008, 09:26 AM   #557
ST-One
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Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

ThomastheCat said:
I don't think they're the same. The angle for the intercooler is steeper than the angle on the other area. Plus the curve along the top of the piece in the right photo doesn't appear consistent with the straight perspective seen on the intercooler.
You are just going to ignor that in both pictures there is this very dark bulge encircling the nacelles hull (at the end of the Körner-hoodswhatever)?
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Old February 8 2008, 09:27 AM   #558
ST-One
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Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

Arlo said:
Cary L. Brown said:
Arlo said:I'll personally print out this forum page and eat it if that isn't a nacelle.
That only counts if you promise to take a picture of you doing it and post it here!
Cary -

Tell ya what-- and I'm serious-- Instead of putting possibly dangerous inkjet chemicals and paper product in my mouth, I'll put money there instead:

If what is shown in the teaser trailer is *not* a nacelle, I will personally donate $75 to the charity of your choice. And yes, I will scan the check/paypal receipt/whatever and post it here as proofination.

Deal?
I'm in.
But let us make that just 25 €.
It is just a CG-model
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Old February 8 2008, 12:28 PM   #559
therealfoxbat
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Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

Cary L. Brown said:
therealfoxbat said:
I believe that's a nacelle and not the secondary hull, because there are two of them in the scene, both at just about the proper places for the nacelles to be.
I think you're thinking of a different shot.

This is the shot I'm referring to (click to see full-sized).
[image]http://img352.imageshack.us/img352/1571/secondaryhullbackup0.th.jpg[/image]

I believe that's the back of the secondary hull, not the nacelle... as I was originally thinking. As such, the size is MUCH closer to what it ought to be.
You're right, Cary. This is the shot I was talking about. (Took me a while to figure out a way to do this...)

Professor Moriarty said:
AOL/Moviefone has released an authentic image of the new Enterprise, and here she is in all her full-size (1828x778) glory!
If the image Cary posted is really going to be in the movie, this bodes ill for Gabe's Enterprise being in the movie. I can't see this view being possible anywhere on Gabe's model.

I don't believe this is a view of the nacelle looking forward. (The cooling fins are ***WAY*** too close to the dome. There should be about half the length of the nacelle between the cooling fins and that dome if it's on the front.) If this is a view of the nacelle, it's much more likely a view looking aft, with a raised dome on the rear of the nacelle (again, looking bad for the odds of being Gabe's Enterprise).

Another idea that makes me feel kind of ooky in my stomach is the center dome might be the rear of the bridge dome and the raised sections on either side might lead into the impulse engine...

(Shudder with fear and loathing...)
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Old February 8 2008, 06:01 PM   #560
Irishman
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Location: Charlotte, NC
Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

aridas sofia said:
Cary L. Brown said:
...I think it's more debatable than some of you guys do... it really really looks like the back of the 1701(r)... in form and in size... more than it does like any nacelle detail I've ever seen (including the one seen here). But as I've said... we'll all know soon enough, won't we?
You make a good point here. Perhaps the comparison worth making is not to a photo of the aft secondary hull of a 1701 model, but rather to a photo of the aft secondary hull of a 1701 refit model.

Though I think it's a nacelle, the lack of any radiating screen on the intercoolers makes them look like... well, to quote somebody, wings.
I gotta say, I agree with you on this one. It looks like a nacelle to me.

Can anybody whip one up in Illustrator?

Hmm, who here could do that? :looks around:

And, genius moment, IF it's a nacelle, with those dudes on there working, we should be able to deduce a more accurate idea of scale, yes? Assuming of course that these nacelles are as tall as they are wide, and assuming that those dudes aren't Oompa Loompas.
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Old February 8 2008, 09:39 PM   #561
Captain Robert April
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Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

Obviously, it's being made of something totally kewl, dude! since that appears to have been the primary consideration, how kewl it looks.

This is what happens when you start playing games with these kinds of longstanding assumptions, like the bulk of work on the Enterprise's construction being done in orbit. Ya tend to ignore the reasons why that assumption was made in the first place, like maybe it makes a helluva lot more sense to build a ship of that size in orbit. Never mind that nothing in canon spells out the process explicitly, the logical problems alone should be enough to chuck this notion of building it on the ground out the nearest airlock.
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Old February 8 2008, 10:07 PM   #562
Forbin
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Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

Logic is a pretty flower that smells like a studio executive.
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Old February 8 2008, 10:13 PM   #563
Arlo
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Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

Star trek has time travel and a device that can scramble your molecules and send them to another location intact. I think what makes sense from the standpoint of real physics is a minor quibble.
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Old February 8 2008, 10:14 PM   #564
ancient
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Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

I don't think building it on the ground is a problem. You know what they say about assumptions...

We could do it today if we wanted. I mean, there's a suspension bridge in Japan with towers 6 miles apart. The towers are so far away that they are both vertical, yet lean away from eachother by quite a bit due to the Earth's curvature.

Given the better materials and anti-gravs of the future, it would be a breeze to build a 947 ft ship like the enterprise on the ground. If we did it today it would look like the Statue of Liberty did when they did those renovations on it - it'd be encased in a support frame. But in the future with tractor beams and energy fields, a support framework need not be visible at all.
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Old February 8 2008, 10:45 PM   #565
Aegis
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Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

You know...we are all assuming it's being built on the ground. Could be an enclosed drydock in space. Could be on the moon. Could be we are all going to see the film ANYWAY!
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Old February 8 2008, 10:46 PM   #566
Captain Robert April
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Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

There's still that old adage, why make it harder on yourself? As has been mentioned several times before, with current technology we could build an ocean liner on the top of a mountain and eventually get it to the sea, but why the hell would we? Or, to go back to the Statue of Liberty, they didn't build the whole thing in Paris and haul it to New York in one piece, they sent it over in sections and assembled it on site.

Just citing Trek's technological level doesn't really cut it, either. Folks still walk to the bathroom, they don't beam themselves there.
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Old February 8 2008, 10:47 PM   #567
Captain Robert April
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Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

Aegis said:
You know...we are all assuming it's being built on the ground. Could be an enclosed drydock in space. Could be on the moon. Could be we are all going to see the film ANYWAY!
Orci has already stated several times that what we're seeing is on the ground, and provided, in my opinion, some rather lame justifications.
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Old February 8 2008, 10:55 PM   #568
Arlo
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Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

Captain Robert April said:
they sent it over in sections and assembled it on site.

Isn't that also what Orci suggested? That it's being built in sections on Earth, and being assembled on site--that is, in space?
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Old February 8 2008, 11:41 PM   #569
ancient
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Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

Well, building an ocean liner on a mountain is bad because it will be very difficult to move. It's not the same as building a starship on the ground. A starship can quite easily go from ground dock to orbit. Flying saucers don't have mobility issues.

There's no real advantage to be had from having it built in orbit, unless you are building them in bulk and don't have space on the ground. But Trek ships have never been built in bulk numbers.

I know how strong fan assumptions can be, and how they often override real-world happenings, or even canon itself (NOOOO). But I really don't have a problem with them building it in San Francisco like the plaque says.
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Old February 9 2008, 12:12 AM   #570
Trekker4747
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Re: The OFFICIAL new Enterprise - Let the critiques begin!

I don't think building it on the ground is a problem. You know what they say about assumptions...
They make an ass out of you and Mption?
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