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Star Trek: Prelude to Axanar Online Debut
By: T'Bonz on Jul 31

Warp 5.0: Trek Toward Sci-Fi’s Golden Anniversary
By: T'Bonz on Jul 31

Takei To Host Pittsburgh Symphony PNC Pops’ Sci-Fi Spectacular
By: T'Bonz on Jul 31

Kurtzman In Mummy Talks
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The Gene Roddenberry Project Kickstarter
By: T'Bonz on Jul 30

Moore: No Deep Space Nine Regrets
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Pegg Star Wars Rumor
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Borg Cube Fridge
By: T'Bonz on Jul 29

Free Enterprise Kickstarter
By: T'Bonz on Jul 29

Siddig To Join Game Of Thrones
By: T'Bonz on Jul 29


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Old April 15 2005, 11:09 PM   #136
number6
Vice Admiral
 
Location: number6 has left the village through some inexpicable hole in the ground to head the corporation.
Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

Posted by Kurgan:
It truely proves to those that doubted them that TU were acting in Enterprise's best interest, unfortunately, i seriously doubt this will do anything to sway Paramount's decision.They have taken great joy and gone to great length to make sure they've pounded the "IT'S CANCELED, AND THAT IS THAT!" idea into our skulls and hearts.T o go back on all they've said and done would require them to "eat crow", and that's just not gonna happen.Are they losing out and will they be sorry they did this in the long run? I'd say YES, especially after Trek 11 bombs ion a year or two.

Hat's off to the gents and ladies at TU.You did all you could do and MORE, but Paramount/Viacom has resigned themselves to not cooperate, right or wrong.They'll be crying in a year when they realize they f**ked up all the profit potential of the 40TH Anniversary.We can all have a good laugh when they do, but i am afraid that's all we're gonna get in the near future.
I don't see it that way. Paramount didn't realize what a hot property TOS was until they finally listened to the fans and started the ball rolling on PhaseII which became the film franchise.
If the execs are made to realize that they can capitalize on the fan support and propel Trek into the 40th anniversary and make a profit, they'll realize soon enough how much crow tastes like chicken. Remember these are corporate execs who work in LA!!! Surely if this succeeds there'll be ads that go something like "the fans spoke and we listened" and they'll all capitalize on it and perhaps even strenghten the franchise by bringing it from the brink of oblivion, raising the awareness to new fans, and all that. Paramount has an opportunity here, thanks to TU and the fans, to turn this into something positive.
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Old April 15 2005, 11:09 PM   #137
CeeWulf
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Location: Middle Village, NY
Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

Posted by Mogh:
We want more information!
And sadly, it can't come. We've already taken a big chance with this. Anyone who tells me they don't see why we can't release details has never worked with big companies on a deal of this scale. As I mentioned last week (and sod it, I'll name names) we were in discussions with the Space Channel and we posted something to that effect on our forums. You kind of assume that execs never read forums.
Nice post, really, but I had to address this one point.

How can you say that you're trying to make things better, but then claim that you have just taken a chance by allowing yet more information to leak? Why risk your efforts again? It really disappoints me that TU doesn't seem to learn anything from it's past mistakes, and just keeps making them. If saying anything will endanger whatever it is you guys claim you're doing, then stop!
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Old April 15 2005, 11:11 PM   #138
Mogh
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Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

Posted by CeeWulf:
Posted by Mogh:
We want more information!
And sadly, it can't come. We've already taken a big chance with this. Anyone who tells me they don't see why we can't release details has never worked with big companies on a deal of this scale. As I mentioned last week (and sod it, I'll name names) we were in discussions with the Space Channel and we posted something to that effect on our forums. You kind of assume that execs never read forums.
Nice post, really, but I had to address this one point.

How can you say that you're trying to make things better, but then claim that you have just taken a chance by allowing yet more information to leak? Why risk your efforts again? It really disappoints me that TU doesn't seem to learn anything from it's past mistakes, and just keeps making them. If saying anything will endanger whatever it is you guys claim you're doing, then stop!
Because it's dead with Space Channel. Not much to risk any more is there? At this point, renewing relations with them is *bottom* of my todo list. I'd sooner place explaining to the fans what needs to be said over a company that's already fallen out with us.
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Old April 15 2005, 11:13 PM   #139
Kurgan
Fleet Captain
 
Location: Looking for my Horgon
Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

Posted by Number6:
Posted by Conundrum:
Posted by Number6:
I can see that this development has changed nothing in the eyes and the minds of the sceptics and ENT haters. Big surprise there!!



I think this is great news and I am glad that I stuch with the TU folks in whom I totally believe.

I hope this actually happens.
You can call people haters until you're blue in the face...won't make it true.


btw....too much kool-aid is unhealthy.
I rather like my Kool-aid, despite the connotation you are implying.



I still maintain that those at KE who post here and continue digging through TB's garbage looking for something and those who campaigned for ENT's cancellation from the biginning have a heavy hand in this. Those people and the other TU sceptics seem to have become implaceble foes of this noble effort to keep the show alive. That's all I am saying. Need proof?? Scroll up!

I think he was referring to the kind of KoolAid Jim Jones handed out on one occasion.Mighty nice thing to say to somebody

No reason to get nasty with one another.It's a shot in the dark at best.It still is a great thing that TU was able to work something like this out however and shouldn't be dumped on. NOONE else here could have even dreamed of doing a better job than they have done thus far to try to get Paramount to see the light and potential profitability of a hopeful season 5.Unfortunately for all of us Paramount's most successful ventures of late has been killing people's hope.

They have been playing the "These are the FINAL DAYS OF ENTERPRISE" on Spike almost nonstop all day.I've never seen Paramount promote the show like this.I don't think it's a good thing as some that might glance at it might.I see it as a constant reminder of the slap in the face the fans of the show are getting.There's no need at this point to keep reminding us the ride is almost over. It's to the point that it makes the studio look disgusting.Almost no promotion for three years and now that it's almost over, they decide to try to let EVERYONE know about Enterprise and the fact that they're canning it.
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Old April 15 2005, 11:15 PM   #140
CeeWulf
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Location: Middle Village, NY
Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

Posted by Number6:
I don't see it that way. Paramount didn't realize what a hot property TOS was until they finally listened to the fans and started the ball rolling on PhaseII which became the film franchise.
They didn't listen to fans, they listened to their pocketbooks. TOS was cancelled before demographics were introduced, and it was only then that they discovered that Trek was popular with the right people - 18-34 year olds. Then synication proved successful, followed by the conventions and so forth.

However, it wasn't until the success of "Star Wars" that Paramount really decided to move forward with Trek movies, and thus gave birth to the resurgence of the franchise. And even that wasn't fully realized until the creation of The Next Generation.

It's really a misrepresentation to give "fans" so much credit. Ultimately if Paramount didn't think that Trek would be worth it financially, it never would have produced it.
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Old April 15 2005, 11:15 PM   #141
Temis the Vorta
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Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

Posted by Jonesy:
Posted by Temis the Vorta:
The bottom line is they gotta get those production costs down.
I think that Paramount's more immediate concern with Star Trek is to make a product that will satisfy the huge build-in audience that they have.
Isn't that what they've been trying to do for years now? They had a built-in audience of 12M who saw the series and bailed. Moving production to Canada and getting Canadian backers isn't going to solve the problem of why they left. Frankly, I think those people are just gone and there's nothing anyone can do to get em back. My solution would be to simply re-organize the finances so that 3M viewers are sufficient.

Scott Bakula will never move to Canada...
I think the article doesn't convey this so well, but the location is not actually mentioned, and that's because it's negotiable. The author writes that Canadian companies are interested and that other productions have been shifted to Canada as an example of cost-cutting. The fact of the matter is that the minute the sets move off the Paramount lot, the price plummets. LA is awash with soundstages and any of them for a start would be a damned sight cheaper.
So it's possible to lower costs and stay in LA? That would be nice if doable. I just wonder why "Canadian" backers in particular would care about investing in Trek in that case. If it's a financially viable franchise staying in LA, why wouldn't there be American money lining up to invest in it?
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Old April 15 2005, 11:16 PM   #142
number6
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Location: number6 has left the village through some inexpicable hole in the ground to head the corporation.
Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

Mogh's quote
Because it's dead with Space Channel. Not much to risk any more is there? At this point, renewing relations with them is *bottom* of my todo list. I'd sooner place explaining to the fans what needs to be said over a company that's already fallen out with us.





^^^ Agreed. You did the right thing because it is what you had to do.

I've been in situations like this where I had to keep quiet about a negotiation for fear of it leaking and falling through many times. It is a risky thing. Unfortunately the TU sceptics digging through your garbage hasn't made any of this easy and there are still those who are bent on destroying TU for mo other reason than their own personal gratification from seeing something or someone totally ruined.

I respect you, Mogh, and the rest of TU for all that you have done, and I will continue to support you!!
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Old April 15 2005, 11:16 PM   #143
AndrewSA
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Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

If I remember correctly Airwolf back in the 80s was resurrected the same way. The original series came to an end, and a Canadian production company continued to then to make episodes with a new Canadian cast. Geraint Wyn Davies, the lead from Forever Knight starred in the Canadian version.
So ... this has been done before!
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Old April 15 2005, 11:17 PM   #144
CeeWulf
Commander
 
Location: Middle Village, NY
Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

Posted by Mogh:
Because it's dead with Space Channel. Not much to risk any more is there? At this point, renewing relations with them is *bottom* of my todo list. I'd sooner place explaining to the fans what needs to be said over a company that's already fallen out with us.
So revealing the stuff about Canadian companies getting involved doesn't violate any kind of trust? I guess that's good. But do you not recognize the concern that this is merely another bit of vague statements, like "secret meetings".
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Old April 15 2005, 11:19 PM   #145
Conundrum
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Location: Waipahu, Hawaii
Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

Posted by Kurgan:

I think he was referring to the kind of KoolAid Jim Jones handed out on one occasion.Mighty nice thing to say to somebody

From Wikipedia:

In 1978, 900 followers of cult leader Jim Jones committed suicide by drinking a grape-flavored drink laced with cyanide at their commune in Jonestown, Guyana. Although the drink was actually Flavor Aid (a Kool-Aid knockoff and competitor), it is often thought to have been Kool-Aid. "Drinking Kool-Aid" is often used as a euphemism for believing someone untrustworthy or dangerous.
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Old April 15 2005, 11:24 PM   #146
number6
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Location: number6 has left the village through some inexpicable hole in the ground to head the corporation.
Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

Posted by Conundrum:
"Drinking Kool-Aid" is often used as a euphemism for believing someone untrustworthy or dangerous.
It is also a drug reference.

I am so glad you're not making this personal.
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Old April 15 2005, 11:26 PM   #147
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Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

Posted by Conundrum:
Although the drink was actually Flavor Aid (a Kool-Aid knockoff and competitor), it is often thought to have been Kool-Aid.
He wouldn't even spring for the good stuff on their last day on Earth? He wasn't just an insane cult leader, he was a chintzy insane cult leader!
 
Old April 15 2005, 11:30 PM   #148
Steven
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Location: Winnipeg
Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

Posted by FleetLord:
I'm sorry, my point was, that companys are willing to fund the show, that is why I said this in the other thread:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted by Arlo:

Advertisers aren't exactly going to line up to back a show with the ratings of Enterprise.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Ah, no that is definetly not true.

You see... that's part of the problem. You make a grand statement like that without anything to back it up. What's more, people asked you for examples to prove your statement.

If you can't provide those examples because they have to be kept secret in order to keep negotiating, fine. Then don't say anything like what you said, because people will demand proof and when you don't provide it, it makes you look worse.
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Old April 15 2005, 11:40 PM   #149
Conundrum
Commodore
 
Location: Waipahu, Hawaii
Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

Posted by Number6:
Posted by Conundrum:
"Drinking Kool-Aid" is often used as a euphemism for believing someone untrustworthy or dangerous.
It is also a drug reference.

I am so glad you're not making this personal.
And accusing everyone not supporting you of having some sort of vendetta and being ENT bashers isn't personal.

right back at you.
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Old April 15 2005, 11:40 PM   #150
Reaperman
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Location: Moving volcanoes
Re: TrekUnited Proposed Season 5 Co-Production Dea

Conundrum and Number6, which part of "knock it off" didnt you understand? If you can't reply to each other civilly, then ignore each other.
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