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Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

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Old July 20 2014, 02:40 AM   #316
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Re: Connie - TOS canon nomenclature

Nerys Myk wrote: View Post
I can't view an old ad like this without thinking of Mad Men.
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Old July 20 2014, 06:44 AM   #317
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Re: Connie - TOS canon nomenclature

I was going to do a listing of a British ship class that changed names, but it is probably better that I do something else.

The Royal Navy's ship class designation is sort of all over the place. Kind of like Starfleet for its first 100 or so years. Ships are generally named after the first ship finishes of the class. But sometimes the class is called by what all the ships are named after. If all the ships are named after river, the class is called the "River" class. If all the ships are named after battles, the class is called the "Battle" class. Same for weapons, lochs, counties, admirals. In fact one of the hardest to interpret for me is the Admiralty type Destroyer Leaders of the First World War. There are a lot of them, and they don't conform to each other, yet only a few have a separation by type or class, since they only used one per destroyer flotilla.

Then they had destroyer classes named after the first letter of all the ships of that class (which matched the letter) such as the V-class destroyers all started with the letter V. There were sometimes exceptions, but that was usually because someone decided to name a ship after someone that died recently.

They also, more recently have the Type # frigates, that usually are also given a class name Currently the Royal Navy has the Type 23 frigate (Duke-class) and the Type 45 guided missile destroyer (Daring-class).
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Old July 20 2014, 02:42 PM   #318
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Re: Connie - TOS canon nomenclature

Ithekro wrote: View Post
I was going to do a listing of a British ship class that changed names, but it is probably better that I do something else...
You know, that makes a lot of rational or rationale sense in regards Trek, especially Pike being injured on an old Class J starship.

There have been some interesting ideas or retcons or whatever come out of all these discussions, some even backed up by either real life or on-screen evidence. Thanks.
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Old July 20 2014, 07:22 PM   #319
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Re: Connie - TOS canon nomenclature

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post


^^ And this canon image tells us that the bridge of the refit Enterprise belongs to starships of the “Enterprise Class”.

Considering the obvious discrepancies / differences, the truly unbiased viewer and 1984 canon disciple has to admit that it stands to reason that one Enterprise belonged to the Enterprise Class (NCC-1701) while the other Enterprise (NCC-1701-A) belonged to the Constitution Class.

If you think that shows I “believe the wildest, wackiest chain of events” I’d say it would be about darn time for you to elaborate why.

Bob
Um, I could also argue that the plaque indicated the class of cadets assigned to the starship U.S.S. Enterprise was assigned to use that simulator; and it was there to indicate that fact to academy staff (and in the 23rd century, yes, they could quickly make temporary signs that would be posted for people to easily see.)
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Old July 20 2014, 09:02 PM   #320
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Re: Connie - TOS canon nomenclature

With a mixed British-American ship class naming structure, the USS Enterprise (NCC-1701) could have been all three generally accepted names at different (or even the same) time.

The class could be named after the first ship ordered (likely USS Constitution), but in some publications named after the first ships finished (likely USS Enterprise). But if all the ships in the class (at first) were all named after famous starships, it could be called the "Starship" class. This would assume that all the ships in the class are named after ships that served in Earth's Starfleet or the early days of the Federation Starfleet and were famous enough to be notable.

This would mean there was an older ship named USS Constitution in or after the Enterprise era, but was decommissioned or destroyed prior to the construction of the Constitution-class vessel with the same name.

Alternately, the ship class could have been "Starship" class, then via refits been given the other names to keep then separate from ships that had not been refit. Or they had started out as Constitution-class and Enterprise and a few others that happened to have famous starships names (like Republic and Intrepid) were labeled "Starship" class after a refit. Then when Enterprise is refit again in the 2270s she'd get labeled as Enterprise-class to keep her separate from her unconverted sister ships. However, by the end of their existence, when USS Enterprise-A was around, there were no other types left, so the class defaults back to its original class ships name....Constitution-class. Rather than back to "Starship" class, as with all the additions, that name had no functional meaning (if several ships were not named after older starships).


A sidenote: The Alternate NuTrek USS Enterprise is known to be a Constitution-class ship, but its dedication plaque still says "Starship class".
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Old July 23 2014, 12:02 AM   #321
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Re: Connie - TOS canon nomenclature

To me, my idea of the Constitution class is that it started as the three footer, but with the nacelle placement as Jefferies wanted, with the rectangular things on the back of the nacelle cap on the trailing edge of the nacelle--with the flat saucer (as designed) and Masao's sketch as built,
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Old July 24 2014, 07:29 AM   #322
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Re: Connie - TOS canon nomenclature

There's an interesting discussion on similiar (but distinct) ship designs of that nature over on this thread.
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Old August 7 2014, 03:46 AM   #323
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Re: Connie - TOS canon nomenclature

Related somewhat I suppose:

What defines a "heavy cruiser" in Starfleet? What makes it any different from any other cruiser or starship?

The term itself is a relic from an arms limitation treaty (Washington Treaty) that defines two different classes of cruiser by the size of their gun barrels only. A light cruiser could be much larger than a heavy cruiser (within the tonnage restrictions of the treaty) just it would have up to 155mm guns or smaller. A heavy cruiser was limited up to 210mm guns.

Both were limited by treaty to 10,000 tons. The reason there are even a light cruiser is because the later London Treaty required an even stricter reduction in the number of cruisers with up to 210mm guns so the major powers switched to making around 155mm guns light cruisers that were just as big or bigger than the up to 210mm armed heavy cruisers.

After the war and the last of the heavy and light cruisers were finished, the term started to be used less as countries build guided missile cruisers and then just cruisers instead. And then just no cruisers, since the difference between a cruiser and a destroyer today is minimal.
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