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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy

Science Fiction & Fantasy Farscape, Babylon 5, Star Wars, Firefly, vampires, genre books and film.

View Poll Results: Grading
A+ 13 24.07%
A 13 24.07%
A- 10 18.52%
B+ 8 14.81%
B 5 9.26%
B- 2 3.70%
C+ 0 0%
C 1 1.85%
C- 1 1.85%
D+ 0 0%
D 0 0%
D- 1 1.85%
E 0 0%
F 0 0%
Voters: 54. You may not vote on this poll

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Old August 13 2014, 06:29 PM   #151
Dennis
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Re: Dawn of the Planet of the Apes - Grading & Discussion

AvBaur wrote: View Post
Dennis wrote: View Post
Examples?
This article features a number of examples from the Lord of the Rings movies: http://www.cartoonbrew.com/motion-ca...kis-99439.html

You should also keep in mind that a human's face and body look very different from an ape's. This means a lot of the captured performance can't be translated 1:1 and is open to interpretation by the animators.
I know all of that and know it very well. I also know that what was done on Lord Of The Rings has very little bearing on what's being done now in movies like the Planet Of The Apes films - it's the difference between "motion capture" and "performance capture."

I do think some of these performances deserve some kind of award, but one that should be shared by the actor and the animation team.
Nope.

Yes, animators have to figure out the coding to translate, oh, the motion of human mouth or neck muscles to a different geometry. Traditional prosthetic make-up work requires the design of appliances of particular materials at specific densities, thicknesses and shapes and utilizing whatever mechanical supports are required in order to best communicate the actor's performance. The craft of make-up is no less technical and demanding and requires no less artistry than digital make-up, and awards are given to recognize that.

So give the animators awards for animation or effects or whatever, but these actors deserve to be recognized and nominated as actors, for their performances alone - no different from playing characters under heavy make-up and costuming.

It'll happen, but frankly it'll happen not for a relatively little-known but brilliant character actor like Sirkis but rather because a big studio is pushing some A-lister for an Oscar in a movie where he/she is assisted by digital make-up.
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Old August 14 2014, 01:43 AM   #152
AvBaur
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Re: Dawn of the Planet of the Apes - Grading & Discussion

I don't agree. When looking at side-by-side comparisons of Andy Serkis on set and Caesar in the movie, it's pretty clear to me that there are subtle differences in expression that come down to acting choices made by the animators. The actors' contribution may be greater than the animators', but it's still a co-authored performance, not just "digital make-up."

It's even clearer with a case like "Avatar," where some of the Na'vi characters' emotions are illustrated by movements of their ears and tails, on which the actors had no influence.
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Old August 14 2014, 03:32 AM   #153
Christopher
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Re: Dawn of the Planet of the Apes - Grading & Discussion

AvBaur wrote: View Post
The actors' contribution may be greater than the animators', but it's still a co-authored performance, not just "digital make-up."
Yes. Think of it like a more mobile equivalent of a painting based on a live model, like, say, Alex Ross's photorealistic paintings of DC or Marvel superheroes based on live models for reference. Ross uses the appearance and expression and pose of the models as the starting point of his work, but adds his own artistic style and interpretation to it as well as alterations to give the characters their exotic attributes or superpowers or to depict them in flight or other impossible actions. In the same way, performance-capture animators are creating an artwork that's modeled on a live actor's performance. Yes, the digital motion capture is an important tool in the process, but so is the still camera that a painter may use to take reference photos of a model. It, along with the footage of the actor's facial performance, is just the basic data that the artist uses as a starting point. It would be as wrong to confuse the performance-capture data with the finished digital character animation as it would be to confuse the reference photograph of the model with the final painting.
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Old August 14 2014, 06:09 PM   #154
Ryan8bit
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Re: Dawn of the Planet of the Apes - Grading & Discussion

I finally got around to seeing this. I haven't seen the first one in a while, but I think I had a better impression of it. It just seemed like there were a lot more touching character moments, and I'm kind of a sucker for Lithgow and his character's plight.

In this new movie, I didn't feel that as much from the human characters, but more so the apes. But their problems just weren't as relatable to me. I still thought it was a pretty good movie. Very entertaining.

And I realize it's a movie about smart apes fighting humans, but I think the whole ape with dual machine guns blazing riding a horse against the backdrop of fiery explosions was just a little bit too much for me.


Also, I noticed in the ratings that the lowest was given by BigJake. Yet I haven't seen a post from him explaining his position, which is odd considering how, um, articulate he usually is.
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