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View Poll Results: What did Picard mean by 150+
150+ planets total 6 12.00%
150+ Federation members 29 58.00%
150+ Species homeworlds 12 24.00%
Something else 3 6.00%
Voters: 50. You may not vote on this poll

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Old June 22 2014, 02:06 AM   #1
T'Girl
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What Did Picard Mean?

Lily: "How many planets are in this Federation?"

Picard: "Over one hundred and fifty, spread across eight thousand light years"


The 150+ planets figure isn't exact, but it not overly vague either. Lily didn't ask about members, but she wouldn't have known too. What planets would Picard have been including in the number he stated?

Just 150+ planets total. That's it. The combination of all Federation members and colonies and any other worlds that are a part of the Federation.

150+ Federation members. And then in addition to that number, colonies and any other worlds that are a part of the Federation.

150+ Species homeworlds
. And then there would be more Federation members that aren't homeworlds (former colonies, members from other sources, etc.). Mars is a Federation member, but it isn't a species homeworld and wouldn't have been included in Picard's number. And then in addition to that, colonies and any other worlds that are a part of the Federation.

Or Picard meant something else by his statement.

From my reading of posts here through the years, most people seem to believe that the number is the total amount of Federation members, and so the number of species homeworlds would be less. Perhaps only a few dozen.

I like the possibility that the number is just species homeworlds, with there being even more members beyond that. The total count of members could be many hundreds.

Captain Kirk referred to the Federation in the twenty-third century as being "vast."

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Old June 22 2014, 02:37 AM   #2
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Re: What Did Picard Mean?

My take is, that he meant, for example, that if he were talking about Earth, and we theoretically "inhabited" Mars, Earth was the main and "official" planet of our system, so Sol would count as one, not two...
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Old June 22 2014, 02:51 AM   #3
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Re: What Did Picard Mean?

I figure he meant 150+ Federation members.
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Old June 22 2014, 02:59 AM   #4
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Re: What Did Picard Mean?

That's a good question. If you gave an 'Undecided/Open to interpretation' option, that would be my choice.
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Old June 22 2014, 03:12 AM   #5
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Re: What Did Picard Mean?

bbjeg wrote: View Post
If you gave an 'Undecided/Open to interpretation' option, that would be my choice.
+1

I think it's vague enough to be open to interpretation, plus I don't believe anything else nails it down. Closest I can think of is the Kirk line from "Metamorphosis":

Metamorphosis wrote:
We're on a thousand planets and spreading out. We cross fantastic distances and everything's alive, Cochrane.
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Old June 22 2014, 03:22 AM   #6
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Re: What Did Picard Mean?

bbjeg wrote: View Post
That's a good question. If you gave an 'Undecided/Open to interpretation' option, that would be my choice.
I kind'a did, that would be option four on the poll.

BillJ wrote: View Post
the Kirk line from "Metamorphosis":
I've alway took that to be Humanity, and not the Federation.




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Old June 22 2014, 03:26 AM   #7
TheSubCommander
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Re: What Did Picard Mean?

T'Girl wrote: View Post
Lily: "How many planets are in this Federation?"

Picard: "Over one hundred and fifty, spread across eight thousand light years"


The 150+ planets figure isn't exact, but it not overly vague either. Lily didn't ask about members, but she wouldn't have known too. What planets would Picard have been including in the number he stated?

Just 150+ planets total. That's it. The combination of all Federation members and colonies and any other worlds that are a part of the Federation.

150+ Federation members. And then in addition to that number, colonies and any other worlds that are a part of the Federation.

150+ Species homeworlds
. And then there would be more Federation members that aren't homeworlds (former colonies, members from other sources, etc.). Mars is a Federation member, but it isn't a species homeworld and wouldn't have been included in Picard's number. And then in addition to that, colonies and any other worlds that are a part of the Federation.

Or Picard meant something else by his statement.

From my reading of posts here through the years, most people seem to believe that the number is the total amount of Federation members, and so the number of species homeworlds would be less. Perhaps only a few dozen.

I like the possibility that the number is just species homeworlds, with there being even more members beyond that. The total count of members could be many hundreds.

Captain Kirk referred to the Federation in the twenty-third century as being "vast."

If you take it literally, Lilly is asking how many planets there are, and Picard answers the question directly, and gives her a number. Humans alone have a number of colony worlds, as do the Vulcans, Andorians, and I am sure pretty much every founding member had at least a colony world, even if in their own star system. After all, the prerequisite is to be Warp capable, and many warp capable civilizations are going to be exploring even before they encounter the Feds. It's not as though the feds find a world, watch secretly for decades until that world develops a rudimentary warp drive so the technicality is met, reveal themselves, and say "Hey wanna join our club?"

I think that 150 planet figure could also include planets claimed by the federation, but not necessarily Class M. Remember the Regula 1, for example, was a rock in space, they hollowed out for testing Genesis. But it was in Federation space. So, it could very well be that while there might be 150+ planets in the federation, that doesn't necessarily mean there are 150 species.
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Old June 22 2014, 03:40 AM   #8
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Re: What Did Picard Mean?

I assumed 150 member polities. I'm not sure if that include colonies or not; in the case of Alpha Centauri, yes, in the case of Starname Latin-number IV, no.
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Old June 22 2014, 03:50 AM   #9
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Re: What Did Picard Mean?

I think that he was talking about total member states although his wording was somewhat inaccurate. Think about it. If most solar systems are somewhat like the Sol System, having 8 planets each, then the Federation would only have to have 19 member solar systems for at least 150 total planets. I suppose there isn't anything that definitely makes that impossible, but only 19 members in 2373? That would be a letdown.

Star Trek usually refers to capital planets of the Federation as Federation members. It bugs me so much.
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Old June 22 2014, 04:03 AM   #10
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Re: What Did Picard Mean?

The dialogue in the scene seems to suggest that there are 150 planets that are Federation members.
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Old June 22 2014, 04:36 AM   #11
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Re: What Did Picard Mean?

I took it too mean 150+ members.
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Old June 22 2014, 04:39 AM   #12
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Re: What Did Picard Mean?

I took it as Federation members, and it was either a vague statement or a slip-up of words on Picard's part.
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Old June 22 2014, 05:01 AM   #13
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Re: What Did Picard Mean?

T'Girl wrote: View Post
bbjeg wrote: View Post
That's a good question. If you gave an 'Undecided/Open to interpretation' option, that would be my choice.
I kind'a did, that would be option four on the poll.
Then four it is. I was hesitant to choose it because any of the others could be right.
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Old June 22 2014, 07:10 AM   #14
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Re: What Did Picard Mean?

I like to believe its 150+ species homeworlds, once they enter the UFP their colonies are also included--unless a colonial government opts to remain independent.
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Old June 22 2014, 08:36 AM   #15
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Re: What Did Picard Mean?

I assumed it to be members too. "in this Federation" I always took to sort of say "how diverse is the Federation"
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