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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies I-X

Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

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Old June 20 2014, 09:01 PM   #16
MacLeod
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

Grant wrote: View Post
MacLeod wrote: View Post
One simple reason as to why a new set might come out in 2016, is simply to try and cash in on the 50th Anniversary.
And One simple was they can do that is ......

by rereleasing the same set with "ALL NEW 50th ANNIVERSARY PACKAGING"..............

which they will do.

Either they will redo the set or they will re-release the current set all spiffed up.

question is how much money do they make with choice 1 or choice 2.

Choice 1 has a lot of production cost but may attract repeat sales from folks who bought the first set.

Choice 2 costs next to nothing but will mostly attract folks who held out all this time and would then realize there won't be a better set.
And maybe chuck in an extra disc witha few bonus features. Just to see if they can tempt some who already own the set.
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Old June 20 2014, 09:28 PM   #17
Grant
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

MacLeod wrote: View Post
Grant wrote: View Post
MacLeod wrote: View Post
One simple reason as to why a new set might come out in 2016, is simply to try and cash in on the 50th Anniversary.
And One simple was they can do that is ......

by rereleasing the same set with "ALL NEW 50th ANNIVERSARY PACKAGING"..............

which they will do.

Either they will redo the set or they will re-release the current set all spiffed up.

question is how much money do they make with choice 1 or choice 2.

Choice 1 has a lot of production cost but may attract repeat sales from folks who bought the first set.

Choice 2 costs next to nothing but will mostly attract folks who held out all this time and would then realize there won't be a better set.
And maybe chuck in an extra disc witha few bonus features. Just to see if they can tempt some who already own the set.
Absolutely right.

A bonus disc with a few new features and interviews and retrospectives.

Still a lot cheaper than getting the original negatives for 1, 3-6 and rescanning and restoring them the way they deserve. and digging up deleted scenes/upgrading the Fx for TMP.
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Old June 20 2014, 11:33 PM   #18
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

I'm up for an uber-edition of The Motion Picture, but I'm pretty happy with the Blu-ray versions of the other movies.

Give me a TMP Blu-ray with seamless branching of the theatrical, director's and special longer versions (cleaned-up with all effects in HD). Stuff it full of special features, especially of the other attempts at bringing Trek to the big screen in the 70's (maybe a Planet of the Titans story treatment and artwork) and on Phase II. Maybe a table reading of one of the scripts by the remaining living members of the cast, including David Gautreaux and Stephen Collins. Or, hell, create an animated episode out of it.

Give it some kick-ass steel book packaging and I'll be there day one to get it.
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Old June 20 2014, 11:53 PM   #19
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

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I can only see CBS Digital work on the Director's Edition of TMP since a lot of those 2001 additions would have to be redone and they've proven to do good with TNG.
From what I've heard, it's Daren Dochterman and his team who saved the CGI project files for TMP: DE, not paramount. If anyone should lead that project, it should be Daren and his team, they would be able to import the project files into the latest versions of maya or lightwave and get them looking just as perfect. The effects were created to be hi-def ready, so the models and textures should hold up.
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Old June 22 2014, 01:32 PM   #20
austen_pierce
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

BillJ wrote: View Post
I'm up for an uber-edition of The Motion Picture, but I'm pretty happy with the Blu-ray versions of the other movies.

Give me a TMP Blu-ray with seamless branching of the theatrical, director's and special longer versions (cleaned-up with all effects in HD). Stuff it full of special features, especially of the other attempts at bringing Trek to the big screen in the 70's (maybe a Planet of the Titans story treatment and artwork) and on Phase II. Maybe a table reading of one of the scripts by the remaining living members of the cast, including David Gautreaux and Stephen Collins. Or, hell, create an animated episode out of it.

Give it some kick-ass steel book packaging and I'll be there day one to get it.
THIS! Why we don't already have this, I will never understand. TMP and TWOK desperately need this, IMO. Giving this treatment to the rest of the films, honestly, would be nice, and (don't get me wrong) Paramount should make this happen regardless of why does the actual work, but I'm not chomping at the bit for super treatments of the remaining films.

What I don't want to see... an attempt by Paramount to transform TMP through NEM into action-adventure blockbusters through CGI, aggressive edits, and misleading marketing in service of duping new fans of 09 and ID into buying the older movies.

NewHorizon wrote: View Post
MakeshiftPython wrote: View Post
I can only see CBS Digital work on the Director's Edition of TMP since a lot of those 2001 additions would have to be redone and they've proven to do good with TNG.
From what I've heard, it's Daren Dochterman and his team who saved the CGI project files for TMP: DE, not paramount. If anyone should lead that project, it should be Daren and his team, they would be able to import the project files into the latest versions of maya or lightwave and get them looking just as perfect. The effects were created to be hi-def ready, so the models and textures should hold up.
I've read numerous post to the contrary, indicating that the DE effects were standard def only and would have to be completely redone for HD. Do you have a source for this? I hope you are right... one less reason to hold back on that TMP Uber Edition.
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Old June 22 2014, 06:23 PM   #21
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

austen_pierce wrote: View Post
NewHorizon wrote: View Post
From what I've heard, it's Daren Dochterman and his team who saved the CGI project files for TMP: DE, not paramount. If anyone should lead that project, it should be Daren and his team, they would be able to import the project files into the latest versions of maya or lightwave and get them looking just as perfect. The effects were created to be hi-def ready, so the models and textures should hold up.
I've read numerous post to the contrary, indicating that the DE effects were standard def only and would have to be completely redone for HD. Do you have a source for this?
Daren himself, from what I recall; I think it was somewhere buried on Trekmovie?
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Old June 22 2014, 09:12 PM   #22
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

What he means is, the models/textures COULD hold up if rendered at 1080p, but at the time, for the DVD, they only rendered them in 480. Apparently nobody at Paramount thought ahead and asked/paid for a 1080p rendering as well.
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Old June 23 2014, 02:07 AM   #23
Grant
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

Nightowl1701 wrote: View Post
What he means is, the models/textures COULD hold up if rendered at 1080p, but at the time, for the DVD, they only rendered them in 480. Apparently nobody at Paramount thought ahead and asked/paid for a 1080p rendering as well.

I'd be curious what it would have cost back then to render them in 1080p.

No doubt a lot less than they'd make now if they could put a TMP DC on Blu-ray
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Old June 23 2014, 07:38 AM   #24
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

jefferiestubes8 wrote: View Post
Many purchased the sets of the Trek movies on Blu-ray.

the amount of digital noise reduction on those video masters for Blu-ray left the HD image with waxy faces and little grain. Entirely too much DNR processing.

This article shows why Paramount needs to cash in and re-release on Blu-ray the Trek movies while the format still has some weight behind it.
Is the end near for physical media?
2 specific quotes: PricewaterhouseCoopers
the latest study saying that streaming video will surpass DVD rental by 2018 as on-demand takes off and DVD sales crater.
PricewaterhouseCoopers, predicts that electronic home video, which includes subscription video-on-demand services and cable on-demand offerings, will overtake the box office by 2017
All the films Original Camera Negatives can be rescanned to 4k (except ST:TMP was already mastered to 4k).
The 2009 & 2013 films were done digital intermediate at 2k so it is moot to remaster these at 4k but they may upscale the digital intermediate masters.
The new 4k masters will be good for 4 future new releases:
A new Blu-ray set, the standalone Blu-ray movies, and a future 4k streaming & 4k unknown future physical media set.
I believe that 2016 will be the year they get released so the sets can sell through 2018.


related:
this older thread discussed the Blu-ray sets:
Movies on BluRay: Worth it?
I'm interested in the whole "Is Physical Media Doomed?" debate more than anything, and its the end of that article that I agree the most with:

If UHD TVs come down in price – and they have already plunged from over $10,000 to about $3,000 in one year – then people will want content. There are some initial moves at 4k streaming, like Netflix's proposed 4k service, and the BBC is broadcasting the World Cup in UHD in England. They say users need speeds of around 20Mbps to watch 4K content without glitches. How many people have that?

So UHD might help revive Blu-ray DVD. And I don't believe DVD will ever fully go away. The advent of DVD has created a whole class of people who build libraries of movies so they can pull them out and watch when their whim hits. Netflix is often knocked for having a less-than-stellar selection of movies on-demand. If I want to watch some favorite old TV shows like "E.R." or "Star Trek: Deep Space Nine," my only option is DVD.

As for music media, there will likely be a return to CD or some kind of physical media, perhaps Blu-ray, which would be harder to rip. It's finally dawning on musicians that the promise of digital media and streaming audio is a load of bull. Nobody is making money right now, and the industry is going to react one way or another to make money.

I don't consider physical media doomed. The makers of it just need to lift a finger and make it special and thus worth the money. A lot of people are buying the Led Zeppelin album reissues because they come as a collection with a lot of content for the money. More and more DVDs come with the UltraViolet streaming option.
I think there's a genuine different in customer base between people who just want the product NOW and with no strings attached (which is what internet media gives you) and don't care about a trade-off in quality, versus those who wish to have movies in a good a presentation as is practicably possible. Only physical media can provide the latter at the moment. And as much as we talk about everyone being on the internet these days, the fact is this ISN'T true, there are large sections of the world and social classes where internet connectivity is patchy (sometimes even only dial-up) and that hasn't been solved, so any industry willing to let physical media die is basically cutting out a potential profit base in people who can't rely on internet streaming to provide them with entertainment. That Microsoft backtracked on their original plan to make XBone a console with games only available via download, something trumpeted in early press releases but quietly dropped before it went to market, indicates to me that someone had a thought-bubble about the future of media, but then saw market research on the subject and realized that the market simply isn't in a position (at the moment at least) to sustain it.

So while everybody proclaims doom and gloom about physical media, I feel the truth is that it still has a part to play.
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Old June 23 2014, 06:31 PM   #25
trevanian
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

The other aspect with physical media is that you have the version of a film that you want, and it isn't subject to any revision that should happen to get implemented, be it colorization, CG or a different sound mix, or even editorial censorship. If you look at VIDEO WATCHDOG it is easy to see that lots of films have various versions, many of which diminish the original significantly. I'm very happy now to have a version of CLOSE ENCOUNTERS that actually shows Roy & Jilllian and the other guy push out of the copter and escape towards Devil's Tower, as opposed to the 'they're just free and nobody is chasing them' version we've had to live with since 1980 (even the supposedly 'original' version on CAV laserdisc didn't put that back in.)

These things aren't a factor for most casual viewing (netflix doesn't have to lose any sleep over this unless they start editing films wholesale), but certainly on films that are important in some fashion, this will be a factor for some.
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Old June 23 2014, 09:01 PM   #26
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

That's one of the advantages of Blu ray, having the ability to seamlessly branch and vastly more GB storage capacity.

Including the Director's Edition with the theatricals, shouldn't take up any more room than that previously devoted to Special Features transferred over from the earlier DVDs.
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Old June 23 2014, 09:45 PM   #27
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

trevanian wrote: View Post
The other aspect with physical media is that you have the version of a film that you want, and it isn't subject to any revision that should happen to get implemented, be it colorization, CG or a different sound mix, or even editorial censorship. If you look at VIDEO WATCHDOG it is easy to see that lots of films have various versions, many of which diminish the original significantly.
I'm pretty much resigned to the fact that we'll never get a properly colored version of The Good, The Bad and the Ugly -- I think it's doomed to live forever on DVD. All the Blu-rays have been horrific.
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Old June 23 2014, 11:58 PM   #28
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

[QUOTE=Grant;9733153]
MikeS wrote: View Post

They are pretty cheap, but it seems the last best chance for a better release of the movies is in 2016 for the 50th anniversary. If you can hold out till then---you can avoid buying them twice.
At this point, i'm so used to buying multiple formats of the same content, that if the mother of all TOS-movie blu-rays was on the horizon, I would be there.

After plunking down the dollars for TOS on Beta, VHS, laserdisc, standard DVD and blu-ray, I would have no problem doing the same for the TOS movies....if that video effect was not present.
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Old June 24 2014, 12:40 AM   #29
Grant
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

Bill Hunt from the Digitalbits talked to the PHV people and advised them that demand exists for better editions of the original 6 movies.

The main focus of the article is how after he complained about the screwed-up release for STID they decided to come out with a set of both the JJ movies with all the various features combined into one set along with some new features.

It's not any kind of a big boost in the likelihood but at least they have been made aware and are "considering it".

http://www.thedigitalbits.com/column...ts/062314_0600
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Old June 24 2014, 12:44 AM   #30
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Re: why another blu-ray of all Trek movies by 2016 will happen

Timby wrote: View Post
trevanian wrote: View Post
The other aspect with physical media is that you have the version of a film that you want, and it isn't subject to any revision that should happen to get implemented, be it colorization, CG or a different sound mix, or even editorial censorship. If you look at VIDEO WATCHDOG it is easy to see that lots of films have various versions, many of which diminish the original significantly.
I'm pretty much resigned to the fact that we'll never get a properly colored version of The Good, The Bad and the Ugly -- I think it's doomed to live forever on DVD. All the Blu-rays have been horrific.
That's good to know. I usually look at blu-ray.com for their reviews before upgrading (which is why I still don't own the DePalma M:I, have been waiting for a BR after skipping the DVD) and they seem to think highly of two different versions of TGTB&TU, but I'll defer to you on this and just hang onto my DVD for now (wonder what color version is on the netflix streaming version?)

I don't know if this is a sign of my faculties eroding or not, but I actually watched about a half-hour of 5thELEMENT on netflix today without turning off the no-blur ... something about that movie actually seems to work better with the crazy clear look, though I think I'd rather go back to watching movies on AUDIO than ever watching ALIEN with the no-blur turned on (especially now that I really love it, after decades of rewatching it only for the art direction.)
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