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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies I-X

Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

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Old June 3 2014, 02:21 AM   #16
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

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Script aside, I think it was a good move to go ahead and start shooting the first TNG movie right after the series finale.
I don't. I think part of the reason TMP was successful was because people had an opportunity to "miss" the characters. There was no "absence makes the heart grow fonder" with the TNG gang. Not to mention that there were a hundred more episodes and many were available on VHS and in syndication.

Of course, it could have been completely different if Generations hadn't been such a let down. But I'm not sure.

I think those years should be the first lesson in How Not to Manage a Franchise Property 101.
I don't think that making fans wait for a TNG movie would have had the same effect as the gap between TOS and TMP. It's possible, though I have no evidence, that there was concern that fans would lose interest in the TNG cast since there would be two series on the air.

Overall, I like GEN. I don't care for the way they killed Kirk, but hey. Whatcha gonna do?
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Old June 3 2014, 02:40 AM   #17
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

diankra wrote: View Post
Worth remembering that, after the initial two year break, the original Planet of the Apes movie franchise came out at yearly intervals.
Those were heady days. When Battle for... came out in '73, you could go to theaters and see all 5 films in Ape-0-Rama marathons on weekend matinees.
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Old June 3 2014, 03:34 AM   #18
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

Those Apes sequels were also done on the cheap and made at a time when sequels were frowned upon. To make Trek films in that fashion, Paramount would have had to probably produce them like glorified TV episodes with lesser effects. That wasn't going to happen, not after THE GODFATHER, PART II changed how everyone looks at sequels and how STAR WARS made sci-fi a very popular genre in film.
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Old June 3 2014, 04:09 AM   #19
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

urbandefault wrote: View Post
As I remember, they wanted to do it while they still had the standing sets. Production on Voyager was set to start after GEN wrapped, so the TNG sets would have to be taken down to make room for the new VOY sets.

I may be remembering wrong, but that's how I remember it.
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I almost forgot of VOY, but that makes a lot of sense. And of course Paramount wanted to have UPN debut with a new Trek show, so Berman wasn't going to be able get the time for either production to breathe. So much pressure on Trek in 94.
It definitely seems clear to me that this was the answer.

VOY was going to be using TNG's floor-plan for their new sets (so it matched the lighting rigs etc), and production was moving forward very quickly. I suspect that Berman and co simply had no choice. TNG the movie had to go in front of the cameras as quickly as possible, so that they could scratch the sets, and start building Voyager's.

DS9 was unaffected, because their sets stood on a completely different soundstage.

An interesting fact that often gets lost in the shuffle of these discussions: while people remember that the TNG portions of the movie were shot a mere matter of weeks after TNG the series wrapped, the movie in fact actually overlapped the production of "All Good Things"... but it was all the Kirk/Scotty/Chekov/Enterprise-B material, which was all being shot at the same time as TNG's finale.
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Old June 3 2014, 04:27 AM   #20
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

urbandefault wrote: View Post
As I remember, they wanted to do it while they still had the standing sets. Production on Voyager was set to start after GEN wrapped, so the TNG sets would have to be taken down to make room for the new VOY sets.

I may be remembering wrong, but that's how I remember it.
In retrospect, it might have been better had they waited and used new sets. As it is, the TV sets didn't stand up to scrutiny on the theatre screen, resulting in everything on board the Enterprise D being so damn dark. The ship had obviously been refitted (changes to the bridge, new stellar cartography) so they could get away with other changes to the interior. Of course, they wouldn't want to sink so much money on new sets since the plan was to destroy the D anyway, but they could get around this by not destroying the D.
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Old June 3 2014, 04:38 AM   #21
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

arch101 wrote: View Post
94 was practically billed as a "year of Trek" by the Paramount marketing machine. TNG ended with high ratings, a new series on the way on a new network in the fall, AND a movie by Christmas. If the internet had been bigger then they'd have had something all over that, too.
Am I misremembering, or do I seem to recall reading somewhere that the website for Star Trek: Generations was actually the first ever time that a movie studio had created a website specifically for the promotion of a movie? It happens all the time *now* of course, but I'm sure I remember seeing somewhere that they were the first...

I don't doubt that it was still a niche market at that time, though.
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Old June 3 2014, 04:50 AM   #22
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
In retrospect, it might have been better had they waited and used new sets. As it is, the TV sets didn't stand up to scrutiny on the theatre screen, resulting in everything on board the Enterprise D being so damn dark. The ship had obviously been refitted (changes to the bridge, new stellar cartography) so they could get away with other changes to the interior.
Yeah, I'd have to agree with this too. The interior sets of the Ent-D looked like shit (the worst offender being Riker walking out of Picard's ready room into pitch blackness). But we can all say that "I wish Generations had come out a year or two or three after TNG ended," but that wasn't Paramount's plan. They gave three TV producers the reigns to make a feature film, they wanted it done yesterday, and they wanted all kinds of specific things done in the film (Kirk MUST die, the Enterprise MUST be destroyed, etc.) To top it all off, dumb decisions were made by people like Jeri Taylor that resulted in a lot of the budget being spent on a pointless holodeck scene, most of the other budget on a pointless stellar cartography scene which was just an attempt to show some "cool," and Shatner's and McDowell's exorbitant salaries.

Yes, the set factor and the intermediate period between TNG and VOY definitely had something to do with the timing of the film, but those weren't the only factors contributing to its mediocre performance.

Of course, they wouldn't want to sink so much money on new sets since the plan was to destroy the D anyway, but they could get around this by not destroying the D.
Well, if they took my advice, then they would have used the Enterprise-A at its decommissioning ceremony instead of the Ent-B. Both Kirk and the ship would have disappeared into the Nexus, only to have Kirk fly it out in the 24th century to save the Ent-D from crashing onto Veridian III

But again, that's not what they wanted.
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Old June 3 2014, 05:09 AM   #23
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

MakeshiftPython wrote: View Post
You'd think even just going for the money, they'd know that putting some distance between the show and the debut film would build more hype and draw more people in theaters. In the end, it only turned out to be marginally more successful than THE UNDISCOVERED COUNTRY.

Or as they say in the flick: "That's a pretty big margin of error", "TOO BIG".
^^^
Nope. It won't. IF TNG's rating were falling when it was cancelled, you might have a point; but they were following a formula pioneered by 'Batman' (that series first season was so popular with kids, they did and released the 1967 feature film from the series over the summer hiatus and made a bundle.

Since TNG was ending on a high note; they figured they'd get every TNG fan (plus the casual audience) into the theatres before TNG started fade from memory from all but the die hard Trek fans.
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Old June 3 2014, 07:35 AM   #24
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
urbandefault wrote: View Post
As I remember, they wanted to do it while they still had the standing sets. Production on Voyager was set to start after GEN wrapped, so the TNG sets would have to be taken down to make room for the new VOY sets.

I may be remembering wrong, but that's how I remember it.
In retrospect, it might have been better had they waited and used new sets. As it is, the TV sets didn't stand up to scrutiny on the theatre screen, resulting in everything on board the Enterprise D being so damn dark. The ship had obviously been refitted (changes to the bridge, new stellar cartography) so they could get away with other changes to the interior. Of course, they wouldn't want to sink so much money on new sets since the plan was to destroy the D anyway, but they could get around this by not destroying the D.
I always assumed that was just a stylistic choice between the Carson and Alsonzo. I actually prefer how it looks in this film compared to how Rush shot TNG. My favorite being Ten Forward, with the sunlight shining through the windows. It was nice to see the Enterprise D given a much more cinematic look, only rivaled by Rush's great work in "Yesterday's Enterprise".

Noname Given wrote: View Post
MakeshiftPython wrote: View Post
You'd think even just going for the money, they'd know that putting some distance between the show and the debut film would build more hype and draw more people in theaters. In the end, it only turned out to be marginally more successful than THE UNDISCOVERED COUNTRY.

Or as they say in the flick: "That's a pretty big margin of error", "TOO BIG".
^^^
Nope. It won't. IF TNG's rating were falling when it was cancelled, you might have a point; but they were following a formula pioneered by 'Batman' (that series first season was so popular with kids, they did and released the 1967 feature film from the series over the summer hiatus and made a bundle.

Since TNG was ending on a high note; they figured they'd get every TNG fan (plus the casual audience) into the theatres before TNG started fade from memory from all but the die hard Trek fans.
I seriously doubt that, considering that TNG reruns were airing regularly throughout the 90s. It wasn't losing audiences until the quality had sunk so low with INSURRECTION and then NEMESIS being the death knell. In a way, I'm surprised more turned up for FIRST CONTACT, given how GENERATIONS is generally agreed as a disappointment.
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Old June 4 2014, 12:47 AM   #25
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

Generations made me literally ashamed of being a fan.

We went to see it, me (trekker), my gf (trekker), my friend (trekker) and his new gf (non-trekker wanting to know what was all that fuzz about).

She must have thought we were 3 idiots.
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Old June 4 2014, 01:43 AM   #26
urbandefault
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

Lance wrote: View Post
arch101 wrote: View Post
94 was practically billed as a "year of Trek" by the Paramount marketing machine. TNG ended with high ratings, a new series on the way on a new network in the fall, AND a movie by Christmas. If the internet had been bigger then they'd have had something all over that, too.
Am I misremembering, or do I seem to recall reading somewhere that the website for Star Trek: Generations was actually the first ever time that a movie studio had created a website specifically for the promotion of a movie? It happens all the time *now* of course, but I'm sure I remember seeing somewhere that they were the first...

I don't doubt that it was still a niche market at that time, though.
It was mid '96 when I got a computer and went online, so I missed that. But what eventually became startrek.com started out as a pay site. That was disappointing.
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Old June 4 2014, 01:47 AM   #27
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

Confirmed:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Tr...ions#Reception

Generations's marketing included a web site, the first on the internet to officially publicize a motion picture. The site was a success, being viewed millions of times worldwide in the weeks leading to the film's release at a time when fewer than a million Americans had internet access.
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Old June 4 2014, 10:29 PM   #28
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

IMO enough time had passed since TUC. Given that GEN was billed as a captain-crossover, Paramount wanted to make sure Original-Crew fans retained interest and bought tickets.
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Old June 4 2014, 11:21 PM   #29
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

austen_pierce wrote: View Post
...Paramount wanted to make sure Original-Crew fans retained interest and bought tickets.
I don't think so. TOS fans had been reliably buying tickets for fifteen-years at that point. I don't think waiting another year would've affected that in the slightest.
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Old June 7 2014, 04:19 AM   #30
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Re: Why did production on GENERATIONS start so soon after TNG?

GENERATIONS, no matter when it was released, was guaranteed to put butts in seats because of the Kirk/Picard team up alone. Had it been a better movie, I think it would have done much more impressive box office run than simply doing the same business that TUC did, successful at the box office, but nothing to sneeze at.
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