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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies I-X

Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

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Old May 17 2014, 04:58 AM   #16
LMFAOschwarz
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

Nightowl1701 wrote: View Post
"He may be right, Jim. As I seem to recall, you were put in overall charge of the starship refit program. And considering this particular ship was the guinea pig, I'd have thought you'd be devouring every blueprint and schematic the engineers coughed up. If anybody up there should've known about that whole phaser warp engine thing that almost got us all killed just now besides Decker and Scott, it was you. Or were you even reading the paperwork that crossed your shiny new office desk before you signed it? And another thing..."
I think you're right on the money there. That fits perfectly, and spares us the viewer of having to hear essentially the same information twice. So, cut ti Decker and Ilia standing in front of the orange door, then switch to McCoy and Kirk talking in front of a giant Chekov.
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Old May 17 2014, 01:24 PM   #17
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
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It does seem odd that Kirk uses his quarters for this sort of thing. Did he not have a ready room?
I thought his quarters were divided in half (by the clear door), half of which is a ready room and the other half is where he actually lives.
You could be right (I haven't seen the movie in ages), but shouldn't a "ready room" be closer to the bridge?
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Old May 17 2014, 06:46 PM   #18
J.T.B.
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

LMFAOschwarz wrote: View Post
I've wondered if it's some old tradition/procedure on sailing vessels or something. On the series, there were others who were brought to the Captain's quarters.
Yeah, if you go back to the sailing days, the "cabin" was the captain's combination office, bedroom and dining room and was really big, taking up maybe a fifth of the ship's length. It was divided into the great cabin (dining and entertaining, official business), stateroom (sleeping), and steerage (office space). There might also be a small office for the clerk. (It also had guns in it, so all the interior walls and furniture had to be removed for battle stations, as part of "clearing for action.") It's hard to explain but here's a quick sketch of what I'm talking about:



The captain dined by himself (or with invited guests). The other officers ate in the wardroom, sleeping in small staterooms along both sides. The midshipmen ate in the gunroom.

Anyway, as you can see from where the wheel was, the ship could be controlled from just outside the captain's door. When steel ships became more compartmentalized, the captain's cabin moved further from the bridge, so it became common for him to have a "sea cabin" right adjacent to the bridge, with a bed and minimal furniture, so he could be close to the action when needed, more like the TNG Ready Room. The main captain's quarters on a big ship remained pretty large and more formal, and was often a small suite of rooms with extra dining space that could also be used for conferences and such.

In this shot



the thing on the right looks like a bed. It seems too wide to be useful for anything else.


And then here:



it looks like there is a small table with pull-out stools, which might be usful for small-scale briefings or something like that (as in TWOK). So it seems like maybe the quarters does have "business" as well as living space. What seems odd, though, is that visitors have to walk through the living space before getting to the official space.

That console with the colored lucite wedges... I have no idea what that was supposed to be.

Dennis wrote: View Post
Yep, no "Ready Room" prior to TNG. Also no "Away Teams," just landing/boarding parties.
And midshipmen at the Academy, what happened to them?
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Old May 17 2014, 11:53 PM   #19
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

J.T.B. wrote: View Post
That console with the colored lucite wedges... I have no idea what that was supposed to be.
If I had to hazard a guess, I'd say it was Decker's equivalent of a bookshelf. (Remember, these were Decker's fully customized quarters he'd just been kicked out of.) Those wedges are probably the TMP equivalent of the TOS library computer tapes that Decker could browse from and enjoy on the monitor. (Kirk, of course, preferred real books.)
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Old May 18 2014, 09:16 PM   #20
drt
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

Yeah, I always felt the weird sculpture on the little table next to the blue couch had to be Deckers' too. Since I can't imagine Kirk would have had much in the way of personal effects beamed up, particularly room decorations.

It must have double-sucked for Decker to get dressed down in a room full of his own crap.
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Old May 20 2014, 03:17 AM   #21
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

J.T.B. wrote: View Post
That console with the colored lucite wedges... I have no idea what that was supposed to be.
In TWOK, it seemed to be used as a control console for communications and computer access. Kirk sat there to talk to Carol when she called from Regula I, and I believe he also watched the Genesis proposal video there.

http://movies.trekcore.com/gallery/a...twokhd0330.jpg

http://movies.trekcore.com/gallery/a...twokhd0416.jpg

Of course, as your screenshot shows, in TMP it didn't have a screen or anything that would have made it useful for such a function.
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Old May 23 2014, 02:12 AM   #22
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

There are a few dialogue oddities in the movie that stick out to me. I understand these are just 'move the story along' comments, but still...

McCoy: Humans, Ensign Perez...us.
McCoy was out of starfleet. It seemed odd that he knew the guy's name.

Spock: You did have a...relationship with Lt. Ilia, Commander.
Where did Spock pick up this nugget of fact?

Chapel: She mentioned she wore this.
When was there time for Chapel and Ilia have the time to chit-chat about her leather headband?

It wouldn't do to have characters walking around in a clueless fog, but comments like these make the crew come across as "gossipy".
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Old May 23 2014, 04:24 PM   #23
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

Also, I suppose if there was a more formal "Captain's Office" on board it would still be decked out with all of Decker's stuff as it would surely be a bit of a waste of time to move it out. It would have been really hard to have that conversation sitting at a desk surrounded with reminders of who the captain of the ship is supposed to be, like a photo of Daddy Decker.

If I had to hazard a guess, I'd say it was Decker's equivalent of a bookshelf. (Remember, these were Decker's fully customized quarters he'd just been kicked out of.) Those wedges are probably the TMP equivalent of the TOS library computer tapes that Decker could browse from and enjoy on the monitor. (Kirk, of course, preferred real books.
I don't know, I'd have thought they were just VIP guest quarters, it would have been really dickish of Kirk, during the push to get the ship going on time, to make Decker move rather than just taking up in a vacant room.

As he seems to be staying in the same (or at least identical) quarters in Khan when Spock presumably has the captain's suite I would just assume he just got put in visitors accommodation both times.

Unless he booted out Spock as well?
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Old May 23 2014, 06:25 PM   #24
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

inflatabledalek wrote: View Post
As he seems to be staying in the same (or at least identical) quarters in Khan when Spock presumably has the captain's suite I would just assume he just got put in visitors accommodation both times.
It certainly makes sense for there to be quarters for visiting admirals or other VIPs, especially for a ship that gets its fair share of diplomatic missions. Even so, some shuffling of quarters might always be a possibility. When President Roosevelt used USS Iowa to go to the wartime Tehran conference, he took the admiral's cabin, Admiral Leahy took the captain's cabin, General Marshall took the XO's cabin and so on down the line.
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Old May 23 2014, 07:30 PM   #25
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

LMFAOschwarz wrote: View Post
There are a few dialogue oddities in the movie that stick out to me. I understand these are just 'move the story along' comments, but still...

McCoy: Humans, Ensign Perez...us.
McCoy was out of starfleet. It seemed odd that he knew the guy's name.
Perhaps McCoy checked up on the crew's files when he was reinstated to active duty. It helps to know who your patients are even before you treat them.

Spock: You did have a...relationship with Lt. Ilia, Commander.
Where did Spock pick up this nugget of fact?
Decker's service record includes his posting to Ilia's homeworld. And I doubt they felt the need to keep their relationship secret. It was probably common knowledge.

Chapel: She mentioned she wore this.
When was there time for Chapel and Ilia have the time to chit-chat about her leather headband?

It wouldn't do to have characters walking around in a clueless fog, but comments like these make the crew come across as "gossipy".
Not gossipy. Ilia - the real one - seemed friendly enough. I'm sure she was friends with most of the crew, Chapel included.
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Old May 23 2014, 10:02 PM   #26
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

Very sensible ideas, Mr. Laser Beam!

The only one I might quibble with would be the Chapel one. I had taken it that Ilia was all-new on board.

But even if that were so, I suppose there's no reason a few of these people might not already be acquainted with each other.
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Old May 26 2014, 01:17 PM   #27
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

Fun to get new insight into such old things...

Agreed that McCoy would be the one to go for the human touch, finding about people's names and feelings. And Spock should know just about everything about just about everything; he's as good at esoteria as Data in TOS already. Also agreed that the crew mingling would not necessarily happen all that easily - how many of them would have been aboard the ship for any length of time before the launch? 10%? 15%? They'd have little to do when construction crews still worked on the vessel.

As for ready rooms and beds, Picard's E-D room had a bed - it doubled as his sofa. However, we never see it pulled out to the full sleeping position, although some episodes show it (accidentally) pulled part of the way. Archer of course had a room right next to the bridge, complete with a bunk, so if Kirk did not, it's an in-universe hiccup in overall continuity.

As regards cabin shuffling, we saw that happen in, say, "Elaan of Troyius". We could assume it also happened in "Journey to Babel" where Kirk uniquely lives down on Deck 5, rather than on Deck 3 suggested in the movies or Deck 12 mentioned in the earliest episodes. If Kirk's normal cabin is on Deck 3 (as Spock's is in ST2), then there's little need for a separate Ready Room. Pike's cabin might also be on Deck 3, judging by certain set details...

Where is the dressing-down room of ST:TMP located? Supposedly, the corridors in the saucer were color-coded to indicate decks (or at least there is some variation to the lighting of the corridor set in the movie, and Shane Johnson in his semi-fictional guide claims the color-coding was a feature).

FWIW, the room we see could well be Decker's room without being the Captain's Cabin; the scheduled completion of the refit was so far away that Decker might have chosen to live somewhere far away from the noise, or close to the action, instead of at the formally appointed location.

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Old May 26 2014, 05:38 PM   #28
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

inflatabledalek wrote: View Post
I'd have thought they were just VIP guest quarters
That was my first thought, however by Kirk moving into "The Captain's Cabin" it might have been part of his assuming the role of captain in the eyes of the crew. Picking up the reins of control.

There's a psychological aspect to the job of command.

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Old May 28 2014, 08:54 PM   #29
ClayinCA
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

Timo wrote: View Post
As regards cabin shuffling, we saw that happen in, say, "Elaan of Troyius". We could assume it also happened in "Journey to Babel" where Kirk uniquely lives down on Deck 5, rather than on Deck 3 suggested in the movies or Deck 12 mentioned in the earliest episodes. If Kirk's normal cabin is on Deck 3 (as Spock's is in ST2), then there's little need for a separate Ready Room. Pike's cabin might also be on Deck 3, judging by certain set details...
Isn't there a line from Chekov (when the Intruder Alert signals the arrival of the Ilia-probe) where he says, "Deck Five, Captain--Officers' Quarters"...? That would indicate that (at least in the freshly-refurbished Enterprise), all the officers were on Deck 5.
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Old May 28 2014, 09:31 PM   #30
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Re: "...and another thing..."...besides what?

^ Chekov does say that line, yes.

But it doesn't necessarily follow that ALL officers are quartered on Deck 5. Just that the portion of that deck where the probe appeared was one which contained officer quarters.

Although it is indeed the most likely explanation. As we'd later learn in ST VI, ships like this contain few enough officers that they can all be called to the bridge at once. So depending on how big Deck 5 actually is, I suppose it could be where all the officers live.
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