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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > The Next Generation

The Next Generation All Good Things come to an end...but not here.

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Old May 8 2014, 12:51 AM   #16
Trekker4747
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

Again, more Roddenberry utopian bullshit.
Yeah, hope for the future and mankind, the very basis and foundation of the entire franchise.

What bullshit!
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Old May 8 2014, 01:20 AM   #17
jimbotron
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

It's bullshit when presenting in sanctimonious, naive and hypocritical ways. So basically during Roddenberry's reign.

"We're so advanced, so evolved. Oh, that alien race who will die because their planet is destroying itself? (Pen Pals). It's a good thing we're so evolved that we don't have to give in to our emotions, which can compromise us into helping those who are beneath us. Oh, a little girl called out to Data, ugh.... fiiiiiine. I guess that entire planet will never realize we only saved their entire future because a girl was at her radio at just the right time."
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Old May 8 2014, 01:26 AM   #18
Trekker4747
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

The idea is the "butterfly effect" where small changes can have bigger impacts over time. There's good reason to not get involved in the natural development of a planet.
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Old May 8 2014, 02:55 AM   #19
JirinPanthosa
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

Good point, a mantra to live by.

For example, there was this young kid I saw wander out in the street, with a car barreling toward him obviously not seeing him. I could have pulled him out of the street, saving his life, but I thought I'd better not interfere. If I saved his life and he grew up to be the next Hitler, it would be totally my fault!

No, just no. You don't let people die by the millions over butterfly effect anxiety. That was just a bad episode.

I agree early TNG could be a bit preachy and unrealistic in the extent of it's utopian nature. But I like that better than the cynical self-serving bullshit you have to put up with today from kids who took one economics class and came to the conclusion that not giving a shit about anything is super-righteous.
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Old May 8 2014, 05:37 AM   #20
PhoenixClass
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

Smellincoffee wrote: View Post
The scholars, artists, and philosophers all seem to be flying Starships.

With the technology they have, what 'housework' remains to be done, other than rearing children? There are no dishes to clean, because replicators vaporize them, and they produce the food. I wouldn't be surprised if children were largely raised by the state in 24th-century Earth, with children sent to nurseries and daycares shortly after birth. Parents would spend their days at work and children at school, presumably. I imagine most families consisted of one child, at least on Earth. In that case, "family" doesn't mean much: do it for a generation or two, and there are no cousins nor siblings for many, so the familial experience is just...sleeping in the same house as your parent(s).
Ugh, what a depressing vision.

I don't recall anything in the show indicating that children were raised by the state. To the contrary, parents were shown interacting with their children repeatedly on TNG.

By the way, could anyone point me to the episode about people not feeling emotions, like grief?
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Old May 8 2014, 08:00 AM   #21
Vanyel
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

Everyone works, yes they do. Raising a child or children IS work even with replicators a baby needs watching 24/7. With the technology available in the future, one parent can indeed stay home with the children. Taking a sabbatical from Starfleet or other job to raise a child would not be a problem.
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Old May 8 2014, 09:16 AM   #22
MacLeod
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

It's not a problem today either, with parents granted maternal and/or parental leave for X weeks, of course the length and entilements of that leave can vary from country to country.
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Old May 8 2014, 09:29 AM   #23
jimbotron
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

Vanyel wrote: View Post
Taking a sabbatical from Starfleet or other job to raise a child would not be a problem.
A couple in Starfleet went on sabbatical in Brothers. They ditched their children on the Enterprise. Don't people usually take sabbaticals to spend time with family or something? They were dumped on Riker, one kid nearly killed himself, and the other was told it was all his fault. Parenting fail.
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Old May 8 2014, 03:26 PM   #24
Smellincoffee
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

PhoenixClass wrote: View Post
Smellincoffee wrote: View Post
The scholars, artists, and philosophers all seem to be flying Starships.

With the technology they have, what 'housework' remains to be done, other than rearing children? There are no dishes to clean, because replicators vaporize them, and they produce the food. I wouldn't be surprised if children were largely raised by the state in 24th-century Earth, with children sent to nurseries and daycares shortly after birth. Parents would spend their days at work and children at school, presumably. I imagine most families consisted of one child, at least on Earth. In that case, "family" doesn't mean much: do it for a generation or two, and there are no cousins nor siblings for many, so the familial experience is just...sleeping in the same house as your parent(s).
Ugh, what a depressing vision.

I don't recall anything in the show indicating that children were raised by the state. To the contrary, parents were shown interacting with their children repeatedly on TNG.
It's not my vision, but it seems to be the way the modern world is going. I took partial inspiration from the French childcare system, since the state is so strong in daily life there.
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Old May 8 2014, 03:31 PM   #25
T'Girl
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

Trekker4747 wrote: View Post
the very basis and foundation of the entire franchise.
The core of the franchise is adventure in outer space. The "utopian" future is a relatively small side plot within the show.

If any of the series actually devoted itself to the depiction and exploration of a utopian society as it's primary focus, it would be doubtful such a series would remain in production for very long.

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Old May 8 2014, 06:19 PM   #26
T'Girl
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

(yeah i know, two in a row)

Did any of the main characters have parents who were pointed out as not being wed?

With some of the character it was make clear that the parents were a married couple, both having the same family name, or were referred to a husband or wife.

In some cases it wasn't spelled out.

But were any of the character's parents made clear to be unmarried? None immediately come to mind, this would indicate that the traditional family unit was alive and well.

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Old May 9 2014, 04:18 AM   #27
PhoenixClass
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

Smellincoffee wrote: View Post
PhoenixClass wrote: View Post
Smellincoffee wrote: View Post
The scholars, artists, and philosophers all seem to be flying Starships.

With the technology they have, what 'housework' remains to be done, other than rearing children? There are no dishes to clean, because replicators vaporize them, and they produce the food. I wouldn't be surprised if children were largely raised by the state in 24th-century Earth, with children sent to nurseries and daycares shortly after birth. Parents would spend their days at work and children at school, presumably. I imagine most families consisted of one child, at least on Earth. In that case, "family" doesn't mean much: do it for a generation or two, and there are no cousins nor siblings for many, so the familial experience is just...sleeping in the same house as your parent(s).
Ugh, what a depressing vision.

I don't recall anything in the show indicating that children were raised by the state. To the contrary, parents were shown interacting with their children repeatedly on TNG.
It's not my vision, but it seems to be the way the modern world is going. I took partial inspiration from the French childcare system, since the state is so strong in daily life there.
Fair enough, but 24th century society is very different from ours, so the comparison is limited by what is shown on the show, whether explicitly or implicitly.
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Old May 9 2014, 04:33 AM   #28
scotpens
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

T'Girl wrote: View Post
(yeah i know, two in a row)
Sorry if I'm stating the obvious, but you know there's a 24-hour window to edit or add to your own posts, right?

Did any of the main characters have parents who were pointed out as not being wed?
Well, in TWOK there was David Marcus. But not that I recall in TNG.
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Old May 9 2014, 11:44 AM   #29
T'Girl
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

PhoenixClass wrote: View Post
Fair enough, but 24th century society is very different from ours, so the comparison is limited by what is shown on the show, whether explicitly or implicitly.
While the technology is of course different, the society, the social forms, don't seem really too awful different.

scotpens wrote: View Post
Sorry if I'm stating the obvious, but you know there's a 24-hour window to edit or add to your own posts, right?
And the two posts were less than three hours apart. Occasionally I don't get a EDIT button at the bottom of my postings, usually it's when I'm using a tablet in a wifi environment.

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Old May 9 2014, 03:39 PM   #30
Makarov
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Re: The Neutral Zone, end of the Family unit?

The typical family unit seems intact to me, judging by Picard's brother Robert and his wife & kid. Just ignore what happens to them in Generations.
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