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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > Star Trek - Original Series

Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

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Old May 3 2014, 02:09 AM   #16
BillJ
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

ZapBrannigan wrote: View Post

For a long time it was Spock and the Enterprise, but then ST III came along, and of the two entities, only Spock was still standing when the closing fanfare played.
But like Spock, at the end of the next film after being destroyed, the Enterprise was back.
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Old May 3 2014, 02:42 AM   #17
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

Spock is the main character of TOS.

You're just fooling yourselves if you think otherwise
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Old May 3 2014, 03:15 AM   #18
Nerys Myk
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

CommishSleer wrote: View Post
Spock is the main character of TOS.

You're just fooling yourselves if you think otherwise
And Servalan is the main character of Blake's Seven.
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Old May 3 2014, 03:26 AM   #19
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

Nerys Myk wrote: View Post
CommishSleer wrote: View Post
Spock is the main character of TOS.

You're just fooling yourselves if you think otherwise
And Servalan is the main character of Blake's Seven.
Who is this Servalan you're talking of? Sounds like a wonderful, clever, gorgeous ,powerful person.
I'm Commishioner Sleer. I've never heard of her.

And Avon was star of Blake's Seven. Everyone knows that too.
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Old May 3 2014, 03:31 AM   #20
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

Please, everyone knows it's Vila.
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Old May 3 2014, 04:59 AM   #21
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

albion432 wrote: View Post
True the network eventually wanted more Spock, but not initially. When the series was still in the pilot stage Roddenberry had to fight the network to keep Spock in the series. Eventually the network gave in to Roddenberry, under the condition that he "keep the guy with the ears in the background", a demand which Roddenberry mostly ignored. So, even if Roddenberry had wanted Spock as the main character (and I'm not implying that he did) there's no way the network was going to allow it.
I know that perfectly well. My point is that it was fan reaction that made Spock the breakout character. Once the network saw how hugely popular Spock was with the fans, then of course they dropped their resistance.

Just because Roddenberry insisted on keeping the character, that doesn't mean that he was always meant to be the central character. It just means that Roddenberry didn't want to give up on having an alien character in his show set in outer space. He wanted that alien to be an important part of the show, but not the core of the show.



"By November 4, the first two actors were set for the pilot as Gene sent the following memo: Please make a deal on Magel (sic) Barrett to play "Number One" and Leonard Nimoy to play "Mister Spock". . .The role of "Number One" . . . had been written for Majel. . . no other actresses were considered for the part."-Star Trek Creator by David Alexander, pg. 210
Said memo was issued after the pitch document I mentioned before, which is dated March 11, 1964 and already includes the entire cast I listed above. Therefore, it does not reveal anything whatsoever about the order in which the characters were created. I think everyone knows that Number One was written for Majel, but that tells us nothing about when the character was created relative to the others, or when Spock was created.


I realize Spock was not initially intended to be the main character of Star Trek, it just seems like his importance to the series grew to the point where he became the main character.
That's a better way of putting it. As I said, that's certainly what the network and the fans wanted. But there was always an effort made (by the producers and definitely by Shatner) to ensure that Kirk remained on a par with Spock. I'd say Spock became more "the de facto star" than "the main character" per se.
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Old May 3 2014, 05:07 AM   #22
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

BillJ wrote: View Post
Marsden wrote: View Post
I thought the Enterprise was the main character
+1
And 2

Marsden and Bill are correct...especially in TOS, it is was much about something the ship "did" or "did not do", and/or about how the crew had to react when things went wrong...

The Lady Enterprise was and always will be the main character...
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Old May 3 2014, 06:19 AM   #23
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

Said memo was issued after the pitch document I mentioned before, which is dated March 11, 1964 and already includes the entire cast I listed above. Therefore, it does not reveal anything whatsoever about the order in which the characters were created. I think everyone knows that Number One was written for Majel, but that tells us nothing about when the character was created relative to the others, or when Spock was created.
I may have to concede this point to you, I have looked and relooked for the source for where I read Number One and Spock were the first two characters conceived of for Star Trek and have not been able to find it. I may have at some point mistaken first cast for first conceived. If I do come across the source I will post it asap.
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Old May 3 2014, 06:46 AM   #24
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

To me, Spock MADE Trek.
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Old May 3 2014, 08:58 AM   #25
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

HIjol wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post
Marsden wrote: View Post
I thought the Enterprise was the main character
+1
And 2

Marsden and Bill are correct...especially in TOS, it is was much about something the ship "did" or "did not do", and/or about how the crew had to react when things went wrong...

The Lady Enterprise was and always will be the main character...

Note that Nimoy directed ST III. In the very film where he brought Spock back, he also took pains to kill off his rival for "main character" status, namely the Enterprise.

The 1701-A then had the thankless task of filling in for a fan favorite, much like Priscilla Barnes replacing Suzanne Somers on Three's Company or Cheryl Ladd coming into Charlie's Angels for Farrah Fawcett. It's never quite the same, which was Nimoy's plan all along.
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Old May 3 2014, 12:25 PM   #26
HIjol
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

Now THAT is what I call cold Vulcan logic...wow!
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Old May 3 2014, 04:47 PM   #27
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

BillJ wrote: View Post
ZapBrannigan wrote: View Post

For a long time it was Spock and the Enterprise, but then ST III came along, and of the two entities, only Spock was still standing when the closing fanfare played.
But like Spock, at the end of the next film after being destroyed, the Enterprise was back.
Note that Nimoy directed ST III. In the very film where he brought Spock back, he also took pains to kill off his rival for "main character" status, namely the Enterprise.
thank you ZapBrannigan for supplying the most insightful post in this thread so far. It is indeed interesting how the death and "rebirth" of the Enterprise mirrors that of Spock. Although Spock seems like he's physically the same man, he too, like 1701-A, is actually a replacement of the former. It is also interesting when considering the Enterprise metaphorically as the "Starship Earth", which is how Roddenberry described it on a metaphorical level. With that perspective in mind, the Enterprise being consumed by fire only to become new again is not unlike the new Earth at the end of Revelation. The scene on the bridge at the end of ST:IV looks rather "heavenly" does it not? Is this meant to be symbolic of a "glorified" Enterprise/Earth? Perhaps. But it wouldn't due to have the recently resurrected Spock, or, metaphorically the "glorified" "world savior", "ascend" into anything less than a "New Earth", ie 1701-A, would it?
The 1701-A then had the thankless task of filling in for a fan favorite, much like Priscilla Barnes replacing Suzanne Somers on Three's Company or Cheryl Ladd coming into Charlie's Angels for Farrah Fawcett. It's never quite the same, which was Nimoy's plan all along.
One can see what Shatner thought of the 1701-A, he turned it into a joke, and a growner at that. He mentioned missing his old chair for the first time in 5 movies. To which chair does he refer? He hadn't been sitting in the original one for 20 years. But point taken anyway- refit or not, this isn't the original Enterprise.
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Old May 3 2014, 04:59 PM   #28
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

Christopher wrote: View Post
Kirk was meant to be the main character of TOS. But Spock was the breakout star, proving hugely popular with viewers (especially female viewers) and getting more fan mail than the rest of the cast combined. So the network kept pushing for more Spock, wanting to elevate him to the main character. If Roddenberry hadn't resisted that pressure, Spock might've ended up following a similar route to Dr. Smith in Lost in Space or Fonzie in Happy Days, completely dominating the show to the expense of its nominal leads. But Roddenberry and Shatner both strove to keep Kirk central as he was intended to be. At Isaac Asimov's suggestion, Roddenberry played up the friendship and partnership between Kirk and Spock, making them inseparable and equal. McCoy was also able to stay central due to his friendly rivalry with Spock.
An interesting example of the Vulcan idiom "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one" in action. Here "the many" are the audience/network, "the few" are Star Trek's producers, and "the one" is Shatner. Star Trek, and Spock in particular, is an interesting case study in how a creation can take on a life of its own despite the initial intent of its creator.
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Old May 3 2014, 05:58 PM   #29
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

I never saw Spock as the main character, more of a co-main character in TOS with Kirk. But I think it can be argued that Spock is the glue that held TOS together more than Kirk did. The fact that Pike was replaced by Kirk proves that for me, at least.

As for the TOS movies, more or less follow the same pattern.


Now when you examine Star Trek as a whole, I think it could be argued Spock is a more important character than Kirk. Spock and his father appear in TNG. Spock is central to the reboot. Nimoy spans the 1960s, 70s, 80s, 90s, 2009, and 2012 as Spock.

Kirk finally does appear in TNG in generations, but Kirk's story comes to a close in 1994 with his death, at least until the 2009 reboot.

So I think to TOS and its movies, maybe Spock may be equally important as Kirk, but to Star Trek as a franchise, Spock is more important.
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Old May 3 2014, 06:08 PM   #30
Nerys Myk
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Re: Is Spock the main character of TOS?

The fact that Pike was replaced by Kirk proves that for me, at least.
All they did was change the name and actor, they didn't change the character. The captain's name was in a constant state of flux during the development process.
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