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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies I-X

Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

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Old June 26 2014, 01:36 AM   #76
arch101
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

I've successfully used First Contact to introduce people to Trek on several occasions. It seems to play pretty well with the uninitiated. Stewart is fairly well known and the story does a good job of explaining things. The movie has enough action and drama without going too overboard with the sci-fi or Trek centric stuff to throw someone who's never seen Trek before. Also, none of it really seems silly.
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Old June 26 2014, 02:16 AM   #77
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

BillJ wrote: View Post
lee249 wrote: View Post
Always start with the beginning

What's FC? First Contact? The Borg queen is the same actress in Voyager (never knew this previously) except for 'Endgame' i believe another actress portrayed her in the previous cliffhangers.
I think Alice Krige played the Borg Queen in "Endgame" and Susanna Thompson played her in the other Voyager episodes. Though I may have that reversed...
That's right. Krige played the Borg Queen in First Contact and Endgame, Susannah Thomson played the Borg Queen in the other Voyager episodes.
It really depends on the person. An older sci fi fan, I'd go with WOK. For some people I know, younger, not sci fi hard core people, I'd go with the first JJ movie. It's not as strong a movie as TWOK, but I know some people who I think would prefer the newer slicker style and pretty boy cast.
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Old June 26 2014, 09:48 PM   #78
James T Kirk
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

First Contact.
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Old July 1 2014, 05:22 AM   #79
wulfio
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

Mage wrote: View Post
First off....

Let's NOT turn this into a bash Insurrection, or any other movie, topic. We have plenty of this, that's NOT what this about.

Now...

A while ago, my girlfriend wanted to introduce a friend of hers into Star Trek. This friend has seen the JJ Abrams movies, but was curious about the other movies aswell.
My girlfriend has a fondness for Insurrection and thought it would be the perfect movie for this.
However, she quickly noticed her friend wasn't into, and she realized herself it wasn't the best movie to use.

It made me wonder what I would choose.

Personally, I think either The Wrath Of Khan of First Contact would be the best choice. Although I feel both movies are more removed from what Star Trek is at its core, they are actionpacked, fun movies with witty dialogue and good editing and directing, meaning someone who isn't into Star Trek could still enjoy them, and perhaps become more curious about the entire thing.

What movie would you pick?

Personally, I feel that for the non Star Trek fan, any TOS movies will be extremely dated. I think First Contact is the one and only movie you could play as an introduction to trek because of all the films, it`s the one for me that the casual movie goer can enjoy. But really, if someone wants to check out pre Abrams Trek, they need to get in to the series in my opinion. If they like that, and get attached to the characters, then they can get in to the films.
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Old July 1 2014, 01:50 PM   #80
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

wulfio wrote: View Post

Personally, I feel that for the non Star Trek fan, any TOS movies will be extremely dated. I think First Contact is the one and only movie you could play as an introduction to trek because of all the films, it`s the one for me that the casual movie goer can enjoy. But really, if someone wants to check out pre Abrams Trek, they need to get in to the series in my opinion. If they like that, and get attached to the characters, then they can get in to the films.
Actually, The Wrath of Khan is perfect as an introduction to the films and Star Trek in general. What exactly is dated about it?
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Old July 1 2014, 09:52 PM   #81
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

BillJ wrote: View Post
wulfio wrote: View Post

Personally, I feel that for the non Star Trek fan, any TOS movies will be extremely dated. I think First Contact is the one and only movie you could play as an introduction to trek because of all the films, it`s the one for me that the casual movie goer can enjoy. But really, if someone wants to check out pre Abrams Trek, they need to get in to the series in my opinion. If they like that, and get attached to the characters, then they can get in to the films.
Actually, The Wrath of Khan is perfect as an introduction to the films and Star Trek in general. What exactly is dated about it?
It`s not dated for me. But for today`s movie going audience, which can be very fickle, I can see the effects being a major deterrent.

Star Wars for example, is one of my favourite movie franchises, and many young movie goers who grew up with jar jar binks and so on dislike the original trilogy because of the effects.

Unfortunately, for lots of casual movie goers, old means bad. The sort of people that can appreciate a Logans Run, or even movies like Monty Python and the Holy Grail, History of the World Part 1, etc. are the 1%ers.

While I like a lot of classic films, I can understand that the majority of the movie going audience will not because they can`t look past certain things like modern day production values. And if Abrams trek was their introduction in to the Roddenberry universe, it`s going to be an uphill battle to introduce them to the TOS movies right off the bat.
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Old July 1 2014, 09:57 PM   #82
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

Honestly, I wouldn't start someone with a Star Trek film that is new to Trek. I would start them with TOS. However, to answer your question I would probably start with TWOK or ST09.
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Old July 2 2014, 12:45 AM   #83
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

Find out, first, what would interest them about Star Trek? What was it that would pique their interest to find out what Star Trek was about? (I'm going to go on the premise that they had seen ST09, or STID initially, got hooked, and now they want to know more.)

Exploration?
Space Battles?
Interpersonal relations?


If they answered all of the above: Star Trek The Motion Picture. It's pretty much got it all. It has the best opening of any of the TOS or GEN movies, with a space sorta-battle. It has interpersonal relations for those who like to know how the crew get along. And it has exploration...the Enterprise encountering and exploring the V'ger vessel.

Space battles and interpersonal relations: Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan, or Star Trek First Contact (although FC blows its action wad in the first ten minutes).

Space battles alone: Star Trek Nemesis (The battle took up practically the entire second half of the movie, and did so with as many external shots as there were internal shots).

Interpersonal relations alone: Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home. (Or Star Trek V: The Final Frontier if you're feeling sadistic. )

I remember earlier in this thread, someone had mentioned that Leonard Rosenman's score of STIV was perfect Star Trek. (It may have fit the movie, but it certainly wasn't my favorite score.) It was re-purposed music from Ralph Bakshi's animated movie adaptation of The Lord of the Rings (also composed by Rosenman). Just listen to the end titles of LotR Animated, and you'll hear almost precisely what would later become the themes for Star Trek IV. (And you thought James Horner was bad about repurposing his themes across multiple films?)

My personal favorite scores for Star Trek are:
Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country (Cliff Eidelmann)
Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan (James Horner)
Star Trek Nemesis (Jerry Goldsmith)
Star Trek The Motion Picture (Jerry Goldsmith)
Star Trek Into Darkness (Michael Giachino)
Star Trek 09 (Michael Giachino)
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Old July 2 2014, 06:18 AM   #84
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

I've got a mate who saw First Contact without ever seeing any Trek prior to that and it completely turned him- he is now a comprehensive Trekkie.
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Old July 6 2014, 01:40 AM   #85
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

CaptPapa wrote: View Post
gottacook wrote: View Post
TWoK, in part because it's been the best-known Trek film for the longest period; even a casual reader of a review of the most recent JJTrek film would likely come across a reference to Khan. Even before Nemesis (the first of X number of films emulating it - maybe the next one will too?), TWoK had already been the best known, in part because it was the first affordable home-video release of a theatrical movie.

I would avoid TVH primarily because Leonard Rosenman's music doesn't hold a candle to that of Goldsmith, Horner, Eidelman, et al., either on its own terms or as a good fit for the movie. To take one example: The music that begins just as the title card "Music by Leonard Rosenman" appears on screen - all wrong for any imaginable version of Star Trek. As far as I know, Rosenman was a neighbor of Nimoy's, and Nimoy gave him the work as a friend. And indeed Rosenman had done respectable work earlier. But even his great contemporary Henry Mancini's best days were long behind him by the 1980s (both born 1924). Goldsmith (born 1929) was one of the very few of his generation to keep composing memorably for screen.

Wow . . . way harsh.
But, as I'm nearing senility myself, I'm afraid I can no longer compose a memorable retort for this post - unfortunately those days are long behind me.

I hear ya, sir!

If you are not using the plethora of "lol"s, YMMV and substituting "then" for "than" and don't know your "to", "too" and "two"s from one another then you're just not "down" with the trendy, funky, happn'n kids these days.

Personally, I side with Mama Fratelli on the subject of kids.

As for the notes that appear when the "Music by....." title card appears during the opening credits of TVH, I LOVE that melody. The OP probably wasn't even a twinkle in his parents' eyes when Majel Barrett was touring around the convention circuit in 1986, promising us a wonderful joint twentieth anniversary present and Christmas present in "Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home".

She wasn't kidding!

The music fits the lighter-hearted tone that was promised, following the drama of TWOK and TSFS. Many paragraphs were written that year about the pattern as set by TOS where tension was deliberately released by including lighter episodes like "Shore Leave" and "The Trouble With Tribbles" amidst the darker outings. I wonder what the OP would think of the whimsical and light-hearted musical cues from THOSE episodes?

Star Trek has ALWAYS had the lighter, "happier" music and Rosenman was simply following a well precedented tradition while adding a lovely nautical touch that fit with the story's subject matter in a highly appropriate manner.

Personally, I LOVE Horner's two scores and recently purchased the two CD expanded scores for each film(and I NEVER buy physical media anymore - THAT is HOW MUCH I love them!), but Rosenman's score is whimsical and a great flight of fancy befitting a wonderful movie that stands as a highlight from my teenage years.
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Old July 6 2014, 04:10 AM   #86
Last Redshirt
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

Undoubtedly The Wrath of Khan.
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Old July 6 2014, 04:15 AM   #87
gottacook
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

Tulin wrote: View Post
As for the notes that appear when the "Music by....." title card appears during the opening credits of TVH, I LOVE that melody. The OP probably wasn't even a twinkle in his parents' eyes when Majel Barrett was touring around the convention circuit in 1986, promising us a wonderful joint twentieth anniversary present and Christmas present in "Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home".

She wasn't kidding!

The music fits the lighter-hearted tone that was promised, following the drama of TWOK and TSFS. Many paragraphs were written that year about the pattern as set by TOS where tension was deliberately released by including lighter episodes like "Shore Leave" and "The Trouble With Tribbles" amidst the darker outings. I wonder what the OP would think of the whimsical and light-hearted musical cues from THOSE episodes?

Star Trek has ALWAYS had the lighter, "happier" music and Rosenman was simply following a well precedented tradition while adding a lovely nautical touch that fit with the story's subject matter in a highly appropriate manner.

Personally, I LOVE Horner's two scores and recently purchased the two CD expanded scores for each film(and I NEVER buy physical media anymore - THAT is HOW MUCH I love them!), but Rosenman's score is whimsical and a great flight of fancy befitting a wonderful movie that stands as a highlight from my teenage years.
Well, I can't speak for the OP, but some of my favorite cues are from the season 2 outright comedies as well as "Shore Leave" and the comedic parts of "By Any Other Name" (i.e., the several drinking scenes featuring Scotty, with music mostly in 6/8 meter). Why do I regard those cues as musically nutritious, and Rosenman's music of 20 years later not so much? I would need to use many words (and music notation) to describe why I think so, and without at all wishing to seem arrogant about it, I've had a long and thorough music education and can back up my opinions with reasoned argument.

Perhaps if I too had been a teenager (rather than 30) at the time of TVH, I'd have felt an affinity for its music. But y'know, I liked some music when I was a teenager that I would judge to be treacle not many years later...
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Old July 9 2014, 06:01 PM   #88
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

I'd say Wrath of Khan. Its just the best movie all around and provides a good example of the Star Trek ethos with Kirk getting pulled out of his planet-side job and learning to "boldly go" again. The emotional content towards the end will also help newcomers to TOS get attached to the crew.
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Old July 10 2014, 12:37 AM   #89
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

TWOK has the advantage of being one of the best, most popular, and most accessible Trek films in itself, while also being 1/3 of a trilogy that contains another of the best, most popular, and most accessible Trek films; and said trilogy is also a good way to introduce the TOS cast.
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Old July 12 2014, 01:01 AM   #90
TV's Frank
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Re: Which movie would you use to introduce someone with Star Trek?

I gotta go with WRATH OF KHAN as well for the best entry-level movie of the series. It's the only movie of the series that my fiance has seen, she was pretty resistant to exposure to STAR TREK, but wound up really enjoying TWOK greatly. Afterwards, she watched some episodes of both TOS and TNG and found TOS more to her liking. That being said, I'm not sure I'll ever get her to sit down and watch the rest of the TREK movies!
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