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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies I-X

Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

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Old July 21 2014, 12:11 PM   #61
austen_pierce
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Re: What If V'Ger had destroyed Earth?

Ithekro wrote: View Post
It also depends on how important Earth is to the Federation and just how much of its starship development and engineers are on Earth at that time. As well as how many people of the people being "removed" would harm the Federation on an economic level as well as just on the level of workers for the various shipyards and such in the Sol System.

It seems there were no other major ships in Sol at the time. Or at least none in a condition to intercept V'Ger. So the current Starfleet is intact in terms of ships and non-Earth bases. But how about the command structure, both Starfleet Command and the Federation Council?

Just how important is Earth to the Federation? What does losing all the people on Earth in 2273 do to the Federation?

This could have a similar question for the newer films with the loss of Vulcan, in what does that do to the Federation? The loss of billions of Vulcans and the whole planet.

At least with Earth, it is possible V'Ger leaves all the technology and ecosystem in place...just removed the humans, gets disappointed and is destroyed by a self-destructing USS Enterprise. The wreckage probably will do a number on Earth, though.

Good points!

I hadn't remembered that there were few/no ships near Earth when Enterprise launched. Where the heck were all those other ships? Anywhoo... you're right in that Starfleet, at least the physical fleet, would be short one ship but otherwise unaffected.

Now with the loss of Vulcan in ST09, I think that should slow down advances in technology, since those vast learning centers are gone. Of course, Marcus compensates for this in STID by bringing back Khan and building Vengeance, so YMMV.
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Old July 21 2014, 06:09 PM   #62
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Re: What If V'Ger had destroyed Earth?

For Starfleet and the Federation, one would assume they keep most of their ships operating all over the Federation, with interest in the borders, around Starbases, and probably along trade routes.

V'Ger was moving towards Earth at fairly high warp speed if Enterprise is basically creeping up behind it at Warp 7. There might have been other ships in the area between where Epsilon Nine detected it, but maybe none that were fast enough (the only "Starship" in interception range was Enterprise. V'Ger was already 3 days out from Earth by the time Kirk is asking to get Enterprise back.)

We don't know if any other ships were at Earth just not able to move, nor if there crews were on Earth.
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Old July 21 2014, 07:17 PM   #63
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Re: What If V'Ger had destroyed Earth?

You just get the sense in TMP that there aren't a lot of ships in the fleet and they are all spread out far and wide. In Trek II you get another ship (The Reliant) and in Trek III you have Earth Space Dock which, if retconned to have existed within TMP's timeline, would make it hard to believe no other ships were in the viciniy.
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Old July 22 2014, 02:39 AM   #64
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Re: What If V'Ger had destroyed Earth?

mos6507 wrote: View Post
You just get the sense in TMP that there aren't a lot of ships in the fleet and they are all spread out far and wide. In Trek II you get another ship (The Reliant) and in Trek III you have Earth Space Dock which, if retconned to have existed within TMP's timeline, would make it hard to believe no other ships were in the viciniy.
Yeah, heck it's not until the TNG era that there's any real sense of a fleet.

Then there's TOS The Ultimate Computer, were we see five star fleet ships. We don't get that again until what, First Contact?
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Old July 23 2014, 03:44 AM   #65
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Re: What If V'Ger had destroyed Earth?

In the 'Phase II' TV pilot version of the TMP script, Kirk's role as an Admiral encompasses fleet operations. So when Admiral Nogura asks him which ships are nearest to Earth, Kirk rattles out a list of ships in the wider area, but admits that none of them are in a position advantageous to intercept V'Ger. Of course, in this early version I think the amount of time before V'Ger reaches Earth is actually less time than in the actual movie, so it's more a case of not having the time to create an armada.

Realistically, I can only echo what others have already said: TOS seemed to infer that Starfleet was still relatively small at that point in time, or that the technology was simply such that the ships just couldn't leave their postings en route to Earth quickly enough to form an effective defence. TNG's version of Starfleet was not only much bigger, but also much faster and better equipped.

Let's face it, I think the V'Ger situation was treated as the first time in a long time that Earth had been under direct threat from anything, so it wouldn't surprise me if Starfleet's resources were not devoted to keeping ship's parked in orbit just on the off-chance that somebody attacks the planet. Maybe the V'Ger Incident acted as a kind of 9/11 for those folks, resulting in the construction of the Spacedock we later see in TSFS/TVH/TFF etc. It might have jolted the powers that be back into realising that their little blue planet can come under threat every so often, and they really needed to be ready in case it does.
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Old July 23 2014, 05:58 AM   #66
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Re: What If V'Ger had destroyed Earth?

One wonders if the term "Starship" is something from Archer's time. A ship that can go Warp 5 would be a starship. Maybe Starfleet didn't have all that many ships that could go Warp 5, or they upped the definition of "starship" and the warp factor to warp 8 when the Constitutions came about. This would give a limit to the number of "starships" in the "quadrant" and make it logical even if they had ships in the area they would not be fast enough to catch, let alone intercept, V'Ger.

Could also be why just about every ship in TNG timeframe is a starship...they all go so quickly compared to Archer and Kirk's times.
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Old July 24 2014, 03:14 AM   #67
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Re: What If V'Ger had destroyed Earth?

Shat Happens wrote: View Post
So our heroes don't solve the problem and V'Ger fries Earth.

V'Ger itself is screwed because it never can find its Creator and have nowhere else to go.

What about of the rest of the Federation? Earth is gone. Are the Vulcans, Andorians and Telarites madly scrambling or meh? The enemies, Klingons and Romulans, did they threw a party or are afraid of V'Ger?

Then the Whale Probe comes for its friends and finds the planet scorched and V'Ger still thinking about what to do with itself -- or not.

What
I hear this is the plot for Star Trek 3.
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