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Old April 7 2014, 02:59 AM   #31
Emperor-Tiberius
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

Turtletrekker wrote: View Post
Eduardo wrote: View Post

And there is a big contradiction coming up on Agents of SHIELD, but I am not sure I can mention it due to the thread rules (but there have been promos for it).
And it is something that has been openly discussed in the AoS thread. OK, it's just a casting spoiler. I'll break protocol.

The irreconcilable difference between Ang Lee's Hulk and the MCU is...

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Old April 7 2014, 03:01 AM   #32
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

If the algorithm could predict future threats of a magical nature...that's stretching things a bit, but....

(Also, they wouldn't have to bother if they were capable of knocking off the Ancient One....)
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Old April 7 2014, 03:18 AM   #33
Alidar Jarok
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

Emperor-Tiberius wrote: View Post
Turtletrekker wrote: View Post
Eduardo wrote: View Post

And there is a big contradiction coming up on Agents of SHIELD, but I am not sure I can mention it due to the thread rules (but there have been promos for it).
And it is something that has been openly discussed in the AoS thread. OK, it's just a casting spoiler. I'll break protocol.

The irreconcilable difference between Ang Lee's Hulk and the MCU is...

Either way, I don't think we should assume a movie done without any input from the current Marvel creative team is in the same universe as one that is unless it's clear they are (certainly, it's not worth bending over backwards to paper over inconsistencies). Although, I'm sure Daredevil will be quickly established as not consistent with Affleck's movie so this debate is one that will be limited solely to the Hulk.

The Old Mixer wrote: View Post
If the algorithm could predict future threats of a magical nature...that's stretching things a bit, but....
Link


Another major reference made in Captain America: The Winter Soldier is Doctor Stephen Strange, who is mentioned by name as one of the targets of Project Insight. When asked if it implies that the Sorcerer Supreme is active somewhere in the Marvel Cinematic Universe, Feige teased: “Well, we know what it means and where we want to head with it, but we were comfortable with keeping it in there and leaving it in there because there are a few different ways to interpret it. The whole thing, what Sitwell’s saying is, this algorithm is going to predict if you’re going to become a problem for Hydra or not. So you don’t have to just be Tony Stark, actively plotting to save the world. You could be a kid whose SAT scores and whose essays have indicated that you’re going to be a problem one day. So is Stephen Strange the Sorcerer Supreme? Probably not at that point. Is he an unbelievably talented neurosurgeon who’s opinionated and kind of arrogant? Probably. That might put him on the list.”


My take on the quote is it means, "We didn't really want it to mean much besides be a cool little tease to lay the groundwork for that movie."
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Old April 7 2014, 12:15 PM   #34
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

Alidar Jarok wrote: View Post
Either way, I don't think we should assume a movie done without any input from the current Marvel creative team is in the same universe as one that is unless it's clear they are (certainly, it's not worth bending over backwards to paper over inconsistencies). Although, I'm sure Daredevil will be quickly established as not consistent with Affleck's movie so this debate is one that will be limited solely to the Hulk.
We should not assume that, either. And yes I think its worth to consider because the film portrays a full image of the guy who, by Avengers, has come completely in peace with his anger. And what does Daredevil have to do with anything?
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Old April 7 2014, 01:02 PM   #35
Alidar Jarok
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

Daredevil is going to be a Marvel production on Netflix, I don't think many will assume that it's supposed to be the same story as the Affleck version. However, people are arguing both Hulk versions are connected despite, like Daredevil, being by different creative groups.

There are too many differences in the origin to fit neatly and reconciling them is more trouble than it's worth. I just think, given this, there's no reason to think they're the same universe. The burden should be on showing that they're connected, not that they're not connected.
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Old April 7 2014, 02:29 PM   #36
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

Emperor-Tiberius wrote: View Post
by Avengers, has come completely in peace with his anger.
I would be very hesitant to draw this conclusion from the Avengers. He loses it on the helicarrier, and while he's able to trigger a transformation voluntary for the final battle, he doesn't look exactly a 100% in control: He screams at Tony and is twitchy and has trouble standing still.
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Old April 7 2014, 02:37 PM   #37
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

Myko wrote: View Post
Emperor-Tiberius wrote: View Post
by Avengers, has come completely in peace with his anger.
I would be very hesitant to draw this conclusion from the Avengers. He loses it on the helicarrier, and while he's able to trigger a transformation voluntary for the final battle, he doesn't look exactly a 100% in control: He screams at Tony and is twitchy and has trouble standing still.
To be fair, Loki's staff was pushing Banner's buttons.
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Old April 7 2014, 04:44 PM   #38
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

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Daredevil is going to be a Marvel production on Netflix, I don't think many will assume that it's supposed to be the same story as the Affleck version. However, people are arguing both Hulk versions are connected despite, like Daredevil, being by different creative groups.
Thats totally different, though, because Hulk was followed The Incredible Hulk, that unambiguously plays it both ways. Because Letterier did say the longer cut of TIH made more spiritual connections to the first Hulk movie, and the general notion behind the film had been to design it as a loose sequel for fans of Lee's version, but mostly a reboot for fans who didn't like the original at all. And I get that. And because I like Lee's Hulk, I accept that notion, and go ahead by accepting Hulk (2003) as part of the MCU. And believe me, its a lovely viewing experience, if you run them down in a week marathon.

There are too many differences in the origin to fit neatly and reconciling them is more trouble than it's worth. I just think, given this, there's no reason to think they're the same universe. The burden should be on showing that they're connected, not that they're not connected.
I seriously don't think the differences are either as enormous or as plentiful as you mention. Especially when you look at them in order.
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"Spock...?" Kirk said, whispering.
"I am... most pleased to see again, Captain" Spock formally replied.
McCoy shook his head in disgust. "Oh, for crying out loud, Spock. Its been eighty years!"
"Seventy eight point four years, Doctor."

The Holy Three meet again, in The Return
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Old April 7 2014, 04:48 PM   #39
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

Emperor-Tiberius wrote: View Post
Alidar Jarok wrote: View Post
Either way, I don't think we should assume a movie done without any input from the current Marvel creative team is in the same universe as one that is unless it's clear they are (certainly, it's not worth bending over backwards to paper over inconsistencies). Although, I'm sure Daredevil will be quickly established as not consistent with Affleck's movie so this debate is one that will be limited solely to the Hulk.
We should not assume that, either. And yes I think its worth to consider because the film portrays a full image of the guy who, by Avengers, has come completely in peace with his anger. And what does Daredevil have to do with anything?
This is getting farcical. I understand that you like the first HULK movie, but you can't force it to fit in the MCU when it is not intended to.

For example:

The credits sequence in TIH can be easily explained as a quick what-happened-inbetween-Hulk-and-TIH -- Bruce came back, started working on the serom, tried to experiment again, to remove it, but unfortunately didn't succeed resulting to Betty's accident and him going away again. Its not that radical a thinking, unless you want it to be.
Seriously, we just had a TV special that went over the entire components of the MCU, that even went to the trouble of mentioning every bluray short film, and HULK is not there.
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Old April 7 2014, 04:52 PM   #40
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

I couldn't find a legit source placing Ang Lee's Hulk in the MCU but the Wiki Page dis-includes it.

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Old April 7 2014, 06:21 PM   #41
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

Yeah, you have to stretch like Reed Richards to make Ang Lee's film fit. To each, their own.
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Old April 7 2014, 06:21 PM   #42
Alidar Jarok
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

Eduardo wrote: View Post
Emperor-Tiberius wrote: View Post
Alidar Jarok wrote: View Post
Either way, I don't think we should assume a movie done without any input from the current Marvel creative team is in the same universe as one that is unless it's clear they are (certainly, it's not worth bending over backwards to paper over inconsistencies). Although, I'm sure Daredevil will be quickly established as not consistent with Affleck's movie so this debate is one that will be limited solely to the Hulk.
We should not assume that, either. And yes I think its worth to consider because the film portrays a full image of the guy who, by Avengers, has come completely in peace with his anger. And what does Daredevil have to do with anything?
This is getting farcical. I understand that you like the first HULK movie, but you can't force it to fit in the MCU when it is not intended to.

For example:

The credits sequence in TIH can be easily explained as a quick what-happened-inbetween-Hulk-and-TIH -- Bruce came back, started working on the serom, tried to experiment again, to remove it, but unfortunately didn't succeed resulting to Betty's accident and him going away again. Its not that radical a thinking, unless you want it to be.
Seriously, we just had a TV special that went over the entire components of the MCU, that even went to the trouble of mentioning every bluray short film, and HULK is not there.
Yeah, that change is the big one. The origin of the Hulk as shown in that scene is different and I'm not at all sympathetic to the idea of a very convoluted theory of "going back" and doing it a second time in order to explain it. Nor does the first Hulk movie at all talk about super soldier or anything like that. The differences there are not small or insignificant and the gap between the movies is growing as more material is added.
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Old April 7 2014, 08:23 PM   #43
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

I just don't find myself convolutedness on Banner experimenting on an official capacity to extract the radiation out of him, because its not nearly as convoluted as many, many other things that populate the superhero genre. The entire idea of superheroes is convoluted, so the idea to go back and experiment to get the Hulk out of him is not nearly as extravagant.

Really, you guys need to loosen up. I understand most if not all of you don't like Lee's Hulk, but don't preclude others from considering it in the MCU.
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"I am... most pleased to see again, Captain" Spock formally replied.
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Old April 7 2014, 08:24 PM   #44
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

It's not.
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Old April 7 2014, 08:39 PM   #45
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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

I'll tell you what, I'll table this discussion until a week from Tuesday.
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