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Trek Tech Pass me the quantum flux regulator, will you?

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Old April 6 2014, 10:28 PM   #1
ProwlAlpha
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Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

While looking at the model of the Constitution, I was wondering, would it be easier to have built the engineering section in modular form? or rather the conventional way of placing pieces of the hull a few at time would have been more efficient?

I asked this about the engineering section due to the vertical lines on the model.
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Old April 7 2014, 12:01 AM   #2
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Re: Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

Well, the conventional way of building ANYTHING, even today, is modularly. Sub-subassemblies are built into subassemblies, which are combined into assemblies which are put together into the final product.
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Old April 7 2014, 09:09 AM   #3
Robert Comsol
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Re: Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

ProwlAlpha wrote: View Post
While looking at the model of the Constitution...
There is a model of the Constitution? Or are you talking about the VFX model of the TOS Enterprise?

ProwlAlpha wrote: View Post
I asked this about the engineering section due to the vertical lines on the model.
Up to this day it hasn't really been proven that the original VFX TOS Enterprise model ever had vertical lines on the engineering section (it did have pencil lines on the top and bottom of the saucer section, though).

Bob
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Old April 7 2014, 10:37 AM   #4
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Re: Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

^I was always pissed at the initial "restoration" of the model for how they handled it. As someone trained in the heritage sector who worked with conserving artifacts, it just really was disappointing on a professional level, and sad on a fan level. I could never see the same "evidence" they referred to.

Regardless- as to the OP query. I USED to be on the modular construction side, and I would say sections of it have the ability to be modular like saucer, nacelles, pylons, secondary hull, et c. But solid extrusion printing technology today, coupled with transporter/ replication tech of the imagined future, really made me reconsider that would be a more practical approach.

Huge devices extruding metal and synthetic material based Hulls. Replicators making the smaller components, beamed into place, really make sense. None of this physical welding non-sense either.

I can almost see a big ring for a secondary hull, or giant slot like extruder for a saucer, very slowly extruding this big ole starship. And in the case of larger items, in the modular form for assembly.

Of course there may be instances where there was an issue that requires more mechanical and physical hands on corrections and guidance- hence the need for onsite workers overseeing the build.

Of course it is time consuming because energy and matter to make this isn't free. And that's why they don't pump these things out like mad.

It also helps explain the ability to create those giant star bases.
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Old April 7 2014, 11:29 AM   #5
Elvira
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Re: Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post
There is a model of the Constitution?
The decal sheet says there is.

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Old April 7 2014, 11:30 AM   #6
Robert Comsol
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Re: Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

Patrickivan wrote: View Post
None of this physical welding non-sense either.
THIS!

Just came across these latest news regarding our lady in the NASM: http://trekcore.com/blog/2014/04/ori...-exhibit-hall/

(is she going to receive a correct restoration, now? )

Bob
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Old April 7 2014, 01:10 PM   #7
blssdwlf
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Re: Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

ProwlAlpha wrote: View Post
While looking at the model of the Constitution, I was wondering, would it be easier to have built the engineering section in modular form? or rather the conventional way of placing pieces of the hull a few at time would have been more efficient?

I asked this about the engineering section due to the vertical lines on the model.
I suppose they could've assembled it in modular slices like a modern day aircraft carrier or built the framework first and phaser-torched the hull plates on afterwards while nearby there's an industrial-sized replicator building out the pieces. Either way seems reasonable.
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Old April 7 2014, 01:20 PM   #8
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Re: Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

One wonders if these vessels have anything akin to a keel - a strongback onto which other stuff is bolted. We have seen TNG era assembly or repair processes where an internal network of beams is evident beneath the outer hull plates... It might be necessary to construct the strongback in one piece, lest it become a weakback, and there goes your section-by-section modularity.

"Growing" of single-piece starships has the obvious drawback of it being more difficult to repair individual spots: you can't yank out the affected plates and install intact new ones in their place. In the worst case scenario, damage to a section of a single-piece starship might mean having to build an entire ship all anew. (Perhaps that's what sealed the fate of the E-nil and the E-A - the sizeable holes in the outer hull? And perhaps that's why TNG era ships clearly are built piecemeal, and repaired likewise.)

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Old April 7 2014, 02:46 PM   #9
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Re: Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

By 2350s, by how the Galaxy-class was built, using a central skeletal structure was that preferred method of construction and later the class's construction methods were streamlined enough to be built on a planetary surface.

I have figured that it would be a lot easier to replace the warp cores, especially on the older classes, where the modular section was modified to accommodate the need for easy access.
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Old April 7 2014, 03:29 PM   #10
Patrickivan
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Re: Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post
Patrickivan wrote: View Post
None of this physical welding non-sense either.
THIS!

Just came across these latest news regarding our lady in the NASM: http://trekcore.com/blog/2014/04/ori...-exhibit-hall/

(is she going to receive a correct restoration, now? )

Bob
Maybe there is hope.

Timo wrote: View Post
One wonders if these vessels have anything akin to a keel - a strongback onto which other stuff is bolted. We have seen TNG era assembly or repair processes where an internal network of beams is evident beneath the outer hull plates... It might be necessary to construct the strongback in one piece, lest it become a weakback, and there goes your section-by-section modularity.

"Growing" of single-piece starships has the obvious drawback of it being more difficult to repair individual spots: you can't yank out the affected plates and install intact new ones in their place. In the worst case scenario, damage to a section of a single-piece starship might mean having to build an entire ship all anew. (Perhaps that's what sealed the fate of the E-nil and the E-A - the sizeable holes in the outer hull? And perhaps that's why TNG era ships clearly are built piecemeal, and repaired likewise.)

Timo Saloniemi
Building through extrusion doesn't rule out the components being build with modular capabilities.

ProwlAlpha wrote: View Post
By 2350s, by how the Galaxy-class was built, using a central skeletal structure was that preferred method of construction and later the class's construction methods were streamlined enough to be built on a planetary surface.

I have figured that it would be a lot easier to replace the warp cores, especially on the older classes, where the modular section was modified to accommodate the need for easy access.
I can still still envision the application for that, but the episode showing the E-D under constuction would certainly curtail my idea. I remember at the time thinking that it was had an odd patchwork application of hull plating. Seemed to be one of those scenes where they wanted to show that a ship was unequivically under construction, and the only way to equate that with our contemporary viewership was to make it look like a ship being build from the 1920's.
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Old April 7 2014, 03:48 PM   #11
Robert Comsol
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Re: Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

Patrickivan wrote: View Post
Seemed to be one of those scenes where they wanted to show that a ship was unequivically under construction, and the only way to equate that with our contemporary viewership was to make it look like a ship being build from the 1920's.
I felt inspired to take another look at the scene from "Booby Trap" (looks like a drydock in space, according to the background starfield).

I only hope that closer inspection of the Galaxy Class hull wouldn't reveal riveted joints.

Bob
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Old April 7 2014, 04:23 PM   #12
B.J.
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Re: Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post
I felt inspired to take another look at the scene from "Booby Trap" (looks like a drydock in space, according to the background starfield).
What starfield? I see lights on the far wall of the spacedock, but no stars.
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Old April 7 2014, 05:19 PM   #13
Robert Comsol
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Re: Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

You are right, looks like my monitor wasn't properly adjusted and created a false impression. Thanks for the correction.

Yes, the background is apparently a spacedock, orbiting over Utopia Planitia.

Bob
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Old April 7 2014, 06:32 PM   #14
Elvira
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Re: Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

Timo wrote: View Post
"Growing" of single-piece starships has the obvious drawback of it being more difficult to repair
Maybe less "repair," and more "grafting on" of replacement sections?

Like a skin or bone graft.

The novel Wounded Sky depicted the TOS Enterprise with (iirc) a woven crystalline hull, when a section was damaged Scotty said they had the equipment to reweave the split.



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Old April 7 2014, 08:44 PM   #15
ProwlAlpha
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Re: Constitution Class Engineering Hull Construction

For smaller, more manageable hull breeches, I always envisioned pieces of hull being welded or lasered into place as a quick fix.

Yet, the weaving of the hull together does seem more futuristic, almost magical from our standpoint.
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