RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 141,354
Posts: 5,502,993
Members: 25,121
Currently online: 496
Newest member: MsMarrielle

TrekToday headlines

IDW Publishing March 2015 Comics
By: T'Bonz on Dec 17

Paramount Star Trek 3 Expectations
By: T'Bonz on Dec 17

Star Trek #39 Sneak Peek
By: T'Bonz on Dec 16

Star Trek 3 Potential Director Shortlist
By: T'Bonz on Dec 16

Official Starships Collection Update
By: T'Bonz on Dec 15

Retro Review: Prodigal Daughter
By: Michelle on Dec 13

Sindicate Lager To Debut In The US Next Week
By: T'Bonz on Dec 12

Rumor Mill: Saldana Gives Birth
By: T'Bonz on Dec 12

New Line of Anovos Enterprise Uniforms
By: T'Bonz on Dec 11

Frakes: Sign Me Up!
By: T'Bonz on Dec 11


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Welcome to the Trek BBS! > General Trek Discussion

General Trek Discussion Trek TV and cinema subjects not related to any specific series or movie.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old April 2 2014, 03:22 PM   #1
Robert Comsol
Commodore
 
Robert Comsol's Avatar
 
Location: USS Berlin
TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

Prior to "Assignment: Earth" we had seen magic devices that could create things out of thin air (e.g. "The Squire of Gothos"), yet I think we saw the first true replicator (in the TNG sense) in the last episode of TOS' Season Two: http://tos.trekcore.com/hd/albums/2x...arthhd0458.jpg

Gene Roddenberry participated in the screenplay writing, is there any backstory that he rethought the concept of these TOS "food synthesizers" when he realized he could have such replicators instead?

Bob
__________________
"The first duty of every Starfleet officer is to the truth" Jean-Luc Picard
"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."
Albert Einstein
Robert Comsol is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 2 2014, 03:26 PM   #2
Merry Christmas
Vice Admiral
 
Merry Christmas's Avatar
 
Location: tantalizing t'girl's techno temenos
Re: TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

While never explained on air, what (supposedly) TOS had was machines that produced the food and transferred it via high speed mini-turbo-lifts to the serving location.

Not a "replicator."

According to McCoy in the episode Arena, the food aboard the ship was in some fashion "reconstituted," which could in part explain the speed at which it is produced. The ship also had (Charlie X) a kitchen and and at least one cook (voiced by Gene Roddenberry).

The transporters in TOS were seen to be relatively slow, it would have taken longer for the food in TOS too appear if what they were employing were replicators.

Merry Christmas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 2 2014, 04:26 PM   #3
Redfern
Commodore
 
Redfern's Avatar
 
Location: Georgia, USA
Re: TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

Basically, a high tech "dumbwaiter" system.

If it were a replicator type device, generating "syntho meat" from a bank of base protein sludge, we wouldn't have had tribbles in Kirk's "chicken sandwich and coffee".

Sincerely,

Bill
__________________
Tempt the Hand of Fate and it'll give you the "finger"!

Freighter Tails: the Misadventures of Mzzkiti
Redfern is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 2 2014, 04:39 PM   #4
Robert Comsol
Commodore
 
Robert Comsol's Avatar
 
Location: USS Berlin
Re: TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

^^ I rememember (courtesy of Greg Stone?) a reprint in a TNG fan magazine of the menu from the "Café des Artistes" from "We'll Always Have Paris" and one course was "tribble sautée".

So maybe the chef of the TOS Enterprise was merely a hundred years ahead of gourmet taste and felt the tribble would be an extra treat next to Kirk's chicken sandwhich?

Bob
__________________
"The first duty of every Starfleet officer is to the truth" Jean-Luc Picard
"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."
Albert Einstein
Robert Comsol is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 2 2014, 04:55 PM   #5
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

It's worth remembering that, despite Roddenberry's credit-hogging, TNG was a joint creation of Roddenberry, David Gerrold, D.C. Fontana, and Bob Justman. Now, in Gerrold's only original Star Trek novel, Bantam's The Galactic Whirlpool from 1980, there is a scene in the rec room in which the tables are equipped with transporter-based food synthesizers. A visitor to the ship from a long-lost human generation vessel is amazed to see food materializing out of thin air in the center of the tables. So it seems highly likely that the transporter-based replicators of TNG were one of the many ideas Gerrold contributed to the series, although they ended up being alcoves in the wall instead. (Although we did see tabletop replicators eventually, in the alien automated repair station in ENT: "Dead Stop.")
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 11/16/14 including annotations for "The Caress of a Butterfly's Wing" and overview for DTI: The Collectors

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 2 2014, 05:32 PM   #6
F. King Daniel
Admiral
 
F. King Daniel's Avatar
 
Location: King Daniel Into Darkness
Re: TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

I think it's murky enough that one could look back at TOS and assume those slots in the walls were replicators, just like TNG.
__________________
Star Trek Imponderables, fun mashups of Trek's biggest continuity errors! Ep1, Ep2 and Ep3
F. King Daniel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 2 2014, 05:44 PM   #7
Sleigh Ride
Commodore
 
Sleigh Ride's Avatar
 
Location: A Circle Has No End; HIjol
Re: TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post
^^ I rememember (courtesy of Greg Stone?) a reprint in a TNG fan magazine of the menu from the "Café des Artistes" from "We'll Always Have Paris" and one course was "tribble sautée".

So maybe the chef of the TOS Enterprise was merely a hundred years ahead of gourmet taste and felt the tribble would be an extra treat next to Kirk's chicken sandwhich?

Bob
Ah, Jesu...I have not had a decent Tribbleè de Sauteé since I cannot remember...



King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
I think it's murky enough that one could look back at TOS and assume those slots in the walls were replicators, just like TNG.
Agree, and kinda miss those grey, Teflon-looking coffee cups...mmmm...good to the last drop...



__________________
"If man is to survive, he will delight in the essential differences between men and between cultures. He will learn that differences in ideas and attitudes are a part of life's exciting variety, not something to fear" Gene Roddenberry
Sleigh Ride is online now   Reply With Quote
Old April 2 2014, 06:03 PM   #8
Shawnster
Fleet Captain
 
Shawnster's Avatar
 
Location: Clinton, OH
Re: TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

I think the first TOS (sorta) appearance of a true TNG style replicator was the animated series episode "Practical Joker." The food slot starts spewing sandwiches and fruits and vegetables Far more food and faster than any dumbwaiter system would deliver.
Shawnster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 2 2014, 06:13 PM   #9
Merry Christmas
Vice Admiral
 
Merry Christmas's Avatar
 
Location: tantalizing t'girl's techno temenos
Re: TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

Shawnster wrote: View Post
Far more food and faster than any dumbwaiter system would deliver.
Or replicator?

Even in the 24th century the food materializes over the course of a few seconds.

I think it makes more sense that a numorious series of mini-turbo lifts kept arriving and quickly getting out of the way, their arrivial speed acounting for the food being "launched" out of the opening.

Merry Christmas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 2 2014, 06:53 PM   #10
Nebusj
Rear Admiral
 
Nebusj's Avatar
 
View Nebusj's Twitter Profile
Re: TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

Shawnster wrote: View Post
I think the first TOS (sorta) appearance of a true TNG style replicator was the animated series episode "Practical Joker." The food slot starts spewing sandwiches and fruits and vegetables Far more food and faster than any dumbwaiter system would deliver.
Something replicator-like is implicit in ``Patterns of Force'', however, unless the Enterprise keeps plenty of 20th century military uniforms around in stock just in case they happen to pop in on Space Nazi World this week.
Nebusj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 2 2014, 06:58 PM   #11
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

The Making of Star Trek did establish that they had clothing fabricators that broke down clothing into its constituent fibers and reconstituted it on demand. But they weren't transporter-based. The only transporter-based technology in the 23rd century was the transporter. They did have other kinds of synthesizers that functioned similarly to replicators, but they weren't actual replicators any more than a phonograph was a CD player.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 11/16/14 including annotations for "The Caress of a Butterfly's Wing" and overview for DTI: The Collectors

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 2 2014, 07:26 PM   #12
Vandervecken
Commander
 
Vandervecken's Avatar
 
Location: Kobold
Re: TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

Christopher wrote: View Post
It's worth remembering that, despite Roddenberry's credit-hogging, TNG was a joint creation of Roddenberry, David Gerrold
For the love of Q, Gerrold, FINISH THE WAR AGAINST THE CHTORR!!

CHTORRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!

Ok, back to the thread.
__________________
"Mu hah hah ha! And when they give me Battlestar Galactica that'll be the trifecta! My red matter and action movie scripts are unstoppable!"--JJ "Destroyer of Worlds" Abrams
Vandervecken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 2 2014, 07:38 PM   #13
Timo
Admiral
 
Re: TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

The only transporter-based technology in the 23rd century was the transporter.
Which is a bit unrealistic, really. There might well have been plenty of, if not transporter-based, then at least transporter-related technologies at the time. We could even interpret most of the magic of treknology in terms of a single unreal breakthrough, or a handful, applied in a number of ways (say, phasers are weaponized transporters, warp drive is propulsionized antigravity, etc.).

Or then we could say that TOS food and uniform and flintlock production was based on just a smidgen of transporter technology and 99% of something else, and things developed from there. Declaring the TOS technology completely unrelated seems unduly harsh to me.

As for why replicators are open alcoves rather than tabletop units... Technological reasons are difficult to postulate, as the alcoves aren't more shielded, there's no obvious requirement for surrounding the process from multiple sides, etc. So we might be talking about sheer tradition here. People just won't accept a food replicator that doesn't look like a 23rd century auto-chef! And Starfleet goes with the flow, using replicators that look almost exactly like the auto-chefs they had aboard late 23rd century ships such as the Enterprise-A.

Timo Saloniemi
Timo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 2 2014, 08:17 PM   #14
davidant32
Commodore
 
davidant32's Avatar
 
Re: TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

Rather than a bunch of mini-dumbwaiters, I'm thinking more like a ship-wide pneumatic tube system.
__________________
Space, time, and thought are not the separate things they appear to be.
davidant32 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 2 2014, 09:35 PM   #15
Robert Comsol
Commodore
 
Robert Comsol's Avatar
 
Location: USS Berlin
Re: TNG replicators first seen in "Assignment: Earth"?

According to "Charlie X" the Enterprise must have had a chef and a galley in the beginning, at least.

KIRK: On Earth today, it's Thanksgiving. If the crew has to eat synthetic meat loaf, I want it to look like turkey.

CHEF [OC]: Captain Kirk from ship's Galley. Sir, I put meat loaf in the ovens. There's turkeys in there now. Real turkeys.

It would seem to me that you could have (synthetic) meals and prepared to-go sandwiches. The icecream in "And the Children..." was probably easy and fast to create for the food synthesizers.

Interesting story about David Gerrold, but is it possible he was inspired by Gary 7's replicator? As it stands that replicator still looks like a genuine Roddenberry invention.

Bob
__________________
"The first duty of every Starfleet officer is to the truth" Jean-Luc Picard
"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."
Albert Einstein
Robert Comsol is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
assignment: earth, food, replicator

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 08:21 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.