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Old March 25 2014, 11:58 PM   #1
Enterprise1701
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Sphere Builders' native time period?

Something about Enterprise's 3rd season that confuses me is the Sphere Builders' relation to normal spacetime. The whole point of the 3rd season is that the Builders were trying to eliminate Earth and humans so that they wouldn't be defeated by the Federation at Procyon V in the 26th century. But I'm confused as to when the Builders depicted on the show are from. I've assumed for a long time that the Builders were contemporary 22nd century beings on Enterprise. However, I noticed that the episode "The Expanse" said that a component from the Xindi probe was from the 26th century, presumably a gift from the Builders to the Xindi. In the episode "Carpenter Street", the Builders transport Xindi-Reptilians from 2153 to 2004. And if you follow the novels in DTI: Watching the Clock, it is revealed that it was the Builders who gave the Borg the temporal vortex generator in Star Trek: First Contact. It then occurred to me that if the Builders have time travel capabilities then they would not need to sit around for over 200 years after the failure of the Xindi superweapon to wait for the right moment to contact the Borg.


So does all this that mean that it is the 26th century Builders who reach out to the Xindi from the 21st century to the 22nd century? Or were the Builders a contemporary species who contacted the Xindi in real-time? Or is the Builders' transdimensional realm a nonlinear one like the Celestial Temple of the Bajoran Prophets?
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Old March 26 2014, 12:13 AM   #2
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Re: Sphere Builders' native time period?

You can disregard the novel since it doesn't qualify as "canon".

I've presumed the Sphere Builders (not sure why they're never given a more precise name) were from the future and are trying to prevent their destruction. But since they're always seen against a white background when in their realm, they may be some sort of trans-dimensional beings like the Prophets.
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Old March 26 2014, 04:01 AM   #3
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Re: Sphere Builders' native time period?

I disagree. In the absence of new prime reality works, the DTI series and other novels are just too good. Plus, it's Christopher L. Bennett.
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Old March 26 2014, 04:37 AM   #4
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Re: Sphere Builders' native time period?

Christopher maintains a presence here, so I'll allow for that. But it's still not canon.
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Old March 26 2014, 04:40 AM   #5
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Re: Sphere Builders' native time period?

^And Mr. Bennett (and any other ST novel author) would probably be the first to tell you that the novels aren't canon. That's not to say they aren't good or that you shouldn't feel that they enrich your personal feelings of what you believe. But as far as the show is concerned, they are not authoritative.

Now to answer your question: The Sphere Builders were from the 26th century of an alternate future where the Expanse had grown from the 22nd century to envelop the entire quadrant (or something like that). But in reality, they were nothing more than a plot device. That's why there was little to no character development for them in the show.
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Old March 26 2014, 10:32 AM   #6
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Re: Sphere Builders' native time period?

The novels aren't canon, but they're part of a bewilderingly intricate continuity which began in 1996 (with ties to novels further back in the 80's) and runs parallel to the canon Trek 'verse. And of course bits and pieces have worked their way into canon over the years (Uhura and Sulu's first names, the names of Kirk's parents, lots of Vulcan lore/katra stuff, the Vanguard station design etc.)
That in the novelverse they armed the Borg with time travel is somewhat silly, IMO, but it was an attempt to explain why the Borg didn't just keep trying the time travel thing until they succeeded.

Back on topic, I figured the Sphere Builders were native to the 22nd century. But existing in another dimension (or whatever it was) and having the ability to examine possible future timelines opens all kinds of doors for future iterations of them to lend a hand whenever necessary. We know from "Carpenter Steet" that they or future iterations of themselves have time travel abilities enough to be a threat to Daniels' people.

I liked that they were kept mysterious, that they were all female and had super powers (giving the impression they were witches). It's just a bit of a shame that they reused the protohumanoid (TNG: "The Chase")/Founder makeup again.
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Old March 26 2014, 03:17 PM   #7
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Re: Sphere Builders' native time period?

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
I liked that they were kept mysterious, that they were all female and had super powers (giving the impression they were witches). It's just a bit of a shame that they reused the protohumanoid (TNG: "The Chase")/Founder makeup again.
So do I- not everything has to be spelled out and spoon fed, there are something which simply remain undefined.

The Protohumanoid look got me to thinking the two races might be the same, just a different faction. Yes, the PHs were the origin of most of the bipeds in the Trek universe, but they might have just removed themselves from there and moved on somewhere else, someplace strange...
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Old March 26 2014, 10:57 PM   #8
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Re: Sphere Builders' native time period?

Guys, I already know that the novels aren't canon.
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Old March 27 2014, 11:35 PM   #9
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Re: Sphere Builders' native time period?

They werent all female were they? what about the one brought onto the Enterprise in the pod. Maybe their society was a martiarchy, or women are dominant, like the Skrreeaa (sp) from DS9
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Old March 28 2014, 10:26 PM   #10
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Re: Sphere Builders' native time period?

vulcan redshirt wrote: View Post
They werent all female were they? what about the one brought onto the Enterprise in the pod. Maybe their society was a martiarchy, or women are dominant, like the Skrreeaa (sp) from DS9
You are correct. The only male Sphere Builder seen was the test subject captured by the Enterprise. That is, if this species does have typical humanoid gender. I don't believe it was ever specified.
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Old March 29 2014, 09:45 AM   #11
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Re: Sphere Builders' native time period?

Melakon wrote: View Post
You can disregard the novel since it doesn't qualify as "canon".
Enterprise1701 wrote: View Post
I disagree. In the absence of new prime reality works, the DTI series and other novels are just too good. Plus, it's Christopher L. Bennett.
Enterprise1701 wrote: View Post
Guys, I already know that the novels aren't canon.
Your reply to Melakon implied that you believed the novels were canon. It's not that big a deal, but I thought I'd point it out.
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Old March 29 2014, 10:21 PM   #12
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Re: Sphere Builders' native time period?

Dukhat wrote: View Post
Melakon wrote: View Post
You can disregard the novel since it doesn't qualify as "canon".
Enterprise1701 wrote: View Post
I disagree. In the absence of new prime reality works, the DTI series and other novels are just too good. Plus, it's Christopher L. Bennett.
Enterprise1701 wrote: View Post
Guys, I already know that the novels aren't canon.
Your reply to Melakon implied that you believed the novels were canon. It's not that big a deal, but I thought I'd point it out.
I guess so, but what I meant was that I disagreed with the "disregard" part. Not the "canon" part.
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Old March 29 2014, 11:46 PM   #13
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Re: Sphere Builders' native time period?

Enterprise1701 wrote: View Post
I disagree. In the absence of new prime reality works, the DTI series and other novels are just too good. Plus, it's Christopher L. Bennett.
And nobody really cares what's "canon" anyway. Doesn't mean we can't still enjoy the novels and use them to fill in the blanks when we so choose.
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Old March 30 2014, 08:49 PM   #14
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Re: Sphere Builders' native time period?

Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
Enterprise1701 wrote: View Post
I disagree. In the absence of new prime reality works, the DTI series and other novels are just too good. Plus, it's Christopher L. Bennett.
And nobody really cares what's "canon" anyway. Doesn't mean we can't still enjoy the novels and use them to fill in the blanks when we so choose.
Retweet/Like/Thumbs up.
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Old March 30 2014, 08:59 PM   #15
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Re: Sphere Builders' native time period?

As for the Sphere Builders: I don't think they have a 'native' time period. They come from a completely alien environment. Time may not even exist, as we know it, where they're from.
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