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Old March 25 2014, 10:54 PM   #31
Starbreaker
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

I was underwhelmed by Prometheus in the theaters. I've watched it at least three other times and I FREAKING LOVE this movie now. I've gotten used to the fact that all the scientists are idiot lowlifes who probably only took the job for the money.

Some of the biggest questions raised in the first film are pretty evident upon rewatches. David is pretty obsessed with Shaw. He's watching her dreams, kills her boyfriend, and wants to impregnate her. He's ambivalent to the rest of the crew but feels some kind of attraction to her, even if he just wants her to be the mother of an alien baby.

As far as Charlize not running to the side, I imagine it's hard to predict the way a freaking spaceship is going to roll. I'm over that too.

I'm really excited about Prometheus Part II if it's really happening. I'll be there opening night at the IMAX.
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Old March 25 2014, 11:29 PM   #32
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

crookeddy wrote: View Post
So are the AVP movies officially thrown out of Alien canon with Prometheus?
I don't recall anything irreconcilable between them. Then again, I haven't seen any of these three movies since they were in theaters.
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Old March 25 2014, 11:46 PM   #33
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

Sure Prometheus isn't without it's issues but many films have issues. Was it as good as the likes of Alien and Aliens I would say not but it wasn't as bad as Alien 3 and Alien: Resuurection.

Sure you can critise Theron's character for not running to the side, but in real life do people always do the sensible thing? You could the say the same thing about freaking out about finding an alien sure it's one thing to concepetually grasp the context of alien life another thing to have it right in front of you.

You could also say that Shaw was in some pain after the removal of the alien but as part of the medical process a drug was entered into her system which took some time to take full effect to reduce her pain. I would also imagine during the end that Shaw was producing a fiar amount of adrenaline.

Sure it could have done a better job of explaining things like the black goo, and you could argue that a film should explain most if not all plot points, but if it's planned to be a series of film you might want to leave some plot points unexplained so as to leave them open for future films in the series.
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Old March 25 2014, 11:51 PM   #34
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

Shaw is shown reacting in pain and holding her stomach after the abortion. And... it's sci-fi medicine

As for Theron not running the right way, in a true panic situation you're not necessarily going to think coherently...
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Old March 26 2014, 12:50 AM   #35
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

Sorry man, not meaning to target you alone with this but rather all of fandom because I see comments like this all the time and it really puzzles me.

JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
I was terribly underwhelmed by the first Prometheus movie, however the fact that Damon Lindelof (who I blame for the lackluster quality of the first movie) is not writing the sequel instills me with a little hope the sequel can actually be good.
I fail to understand this consistent and everpresent (seemingly) need to bust Lindelof's balls for Prometheus. Feature films are a director's medium; if anyone is to be "blamed" would it not be Ridley Scott?

I can understand people taking Lindelof and Cuse to task for how they ran LOST -- even if I don't agree with it. But here, surely, Sir Ridley was the guy calling the shots, n'est-ce pas? Why would Lindelof be the sole target of the nerd-rage and blame and not Ridley himself?


Lastly: I was underwhelmed by Prometheus when I saw it, but I also saw some things in it that I appreciated. Much as with Superman Returns, even though neither are perfect films by any stretch of the imagination, each had enough in the way of "good bones!" to keep me interested, and I'm glad at least Prometheus will be getting the chance to expand further in a sequel what it began in the first film. Having re-watched it now a few times, I find I like it more and more. Sue me.
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Old March 26 2014, 01:02 AM   #36
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

^But don't directors/actors shoot/perform what's in the script? That isn't to say they can't make a mess of what's in the script but equally that doesn't mean they can save something which has a week script.

There are many people involved in making a film, you can't always single out flaws to one person. i.e. Sometimes the studios financing the film will insits on certain things or they won't finance the film.
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Old March 26 2014, 01:28 AM   #37
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

Yes and no. But Scott was the auteur here, not Lindelof. And as I said, features are a director's medium. Scott was the man at the top of the food chain and the one everyone had to report to. His was the prevailing vision that would be guiding everyone else on the crew.

No, I'm not saying "One person should be blamed and one person alone," I'm saying that in the world of feature films, the writer (who often has little to do with the final product after a film is made, let alone recognized for their work) is not the person to blame for everything you don't like about the picture, and certainly not before the director. The language I keep seeing and reading about this picture always boils down to the same thing "All the shitty stuff was Lindelof's fault; the stuff I tolerate/like came from Ridley." That's intellectually dishonest and betrays a lack of understanding of how Hollywood works.

Too, I'm well aware too that studio interference can be to blame. I've sat through enough studio and network notes calls myself to be so naive to think they wouldn't be an actual concern. I'm not disputing that that may have occurred here as well. I simply pointed out the very large disparity that there are those who blame Lindelof for the failings of Prometheus but not Ridley Scott. This is patently ridiculous. Nothing Lindelof did for the film would have been in there had Scott not wanted it there so it's kind of stupid to blame one but not the other (if you must take it to that level.)
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Old March 26 2014, 01:58 AM   #38
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

Prometheus was OK, but disappointing to me only because I expected more out of a brand new Ridley Scott scifi film. I'm sure they'll spend a bunch of money on the sequel and it'll be at least fair to middling as well. Hopefully better if we're lucky.
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Old March 26 2014, 02:20 AM   #39
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

Professor Zoom wrote: View Post
Hey, looks like I'm gonna save some money. Pass. I can't imagine a sequel to a shitty movie will be any better than the original.
Hey, it worked for Batman Begins...


(Clarification, I do love Prometheus.)



Mr Light wrote: View Post
I would absolutely love to see Shaw and David make their way to the Engineer Homeworld and see what's there, and why the Engineers changed their minds about humanity.
The Big Bang Theory?




Forbin wrote: View Post
Whose idea was it to have the action heroin get a C-section, then hop up off the operating table and spend the rest of the movie running and jumping like John McClane?
True, that was ludicrous even by sci-fi action standards. In the original script, a traditional chestburster was extracted, and Shaw dozed in and out of consciousness over the eight or so hours it took to grow to a full size xeno, and I assume the machine was healing her that whole time.



Locutus of Bored wrote: View Post
That the chief selling point for the new writer is that he wrote Green Lantern is not a promising sign
Hey, the homey was asked to write a Green Lantern movie. Talk about a no-win scenario! Also, the other two co-writers are now kicking eighteen different flavors of ass on Arrow.

The actual "chief selling point" on the new writer is that he's been writing the Blade Runner follow-up, and apparently Team Scott likes what it sees.
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Old March 26 2014, 02:21 AM   #40
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

It was a tad dull, but I enjoyed it well enough. I'll check out the sequel when it is out.
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Old March 26 2014, 02:27 AM   #41
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

Timby wrote: View Post
Locutus of Bored wrote: View Post

I don't know, the Alien(s)-style xenomorph bas-relief on the temple wall, the bioweapon jars arranged in a similar manner to the xenomorph eggs, the geologist gradually changing into a xenomorph, the giant facehugger, and the modified xenomorph baby at the end are an odd way of showing that he wanted nothing to do with them at all.
Well, that's why Scott kept saying it wasn't an Alien prequel or sequel, it just "shared some of its DNA."

I would have been fine with either a true prequel to Alien that focused more on the Xenomorphs or a story that focused entirely on the Engineers, but what we got was sort of a hybrid of those that seemingly couldn't decide what it wanted to be, and so it ended up giving short shrift to both aspects of the story and was unsatisfying as a result (IMO).

I would have much preferred some greater background be given to the society and objectives of the Engineers rather than the utterly ridiculous action sequences we got toward the end. Or to Tweedledum and Tweedledee meandering through the alien ship that the world's most incompetent geologist mapped himself, while the world's worst biologist pets the hostile space cobra with inevitable results.
It all boils down to how you interpret it. The way I read the film, these people thought they were leaders in their fields, but the only one who actually even remotely was was Shaw. Everyone else was an incompetent hobo hauled off the street by Weyland, because he didn't give a shit about the mission, he just wanted immortality. "Pfft, as long as they get me there, David can do the rest."

I know they can (and most likely will) greatly expand on the story of the Engineers in the sequel, and I look forward to it, but when you sell the film as telling their story and then don't adequately deliver on that premise; nor do you effectively set up the events in Alien; nor do you make a well-constructed and self-contained story that stands on its own merits, it's more than just disappointment at the lack of more xenomorphs that's the problem.
I guess it boils down to what you're looking to get out of the film. It is such an unsettling film. I'm a huge fan of Ridley Scott but I don't think he's ever done anything of this magnitude. The attention to detail, as seen in Alien, and the relentlessness of the themes, as seen in Blade Runner, are there. I don't think Prometheus beats either of those films as Scott's "best," but it's definitely one of his smartest films.

Think of how you approached love, relationships, when you were young. You went all-in with this naive, idealistic sensibility, and then you get in over your head, and you wonder to yourself, "What the HELL have I done?" You try to do your best to carry on, soldier forward, and find some meaning in everything ... and, nope. Nothing.

Then you meet "God," your creator, the being responsible for your existence, and you ask God why everything is so incredibly messed up. And God ... gives you no answers, shows nothing but pure hatred and then sets out to express that hate upon your entire race and it's incumbent upon you to prevent that disaster.

Fuck, now I need to go watch it again tonight.

Edit: Time to start talking titles. Prometheus and Prometheur? Prometheus 2: Genetic Boogaloo? 2Pro 2Metheus?

Edit 2: To further clarify, when Ridley Scott goes sci-fi, his films aren't necessarily about telling a compelling story. Blade Runner is boring as hell until you look at the design, the art direction, and the themes, and you realize that it isn't a boring cop movie with pretty pictures, because there's so much going on beneath the surface -- the subtext is ridiculously rich. Even in Alien, too, because that film's about a gigantic penis monster raping the shit out of a crew of ineffective fools and only the woman can repel it.
Well, this spares me a write-up of why I really like this film. Looking forward to a sequel if Scott is directing.
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Old March 26 2014, 04:06 AM   #42
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

Mr Light wrote: View Post
I found the mystery of the Engineers to be absolutely fascinating, and much more interesting than another Xenomorph jumping out of the air ducts, and I would absolutely love to see Shaw and David make their way to the Engineer Homeworld and see what's there, and why the Engineers changed their minds about humanity.
I agree, I liked Prometheus and thought it was great. I liked the first half of the movie with the exploration/ mystery which was very much like the first Alien movie. The second part with Shaw doing surgery and the whole monster movie element. If I had to criticize it, I'd say that the changes that Lindeloff made were unnecessary. I'm glad he won't be back and if I had to guess, I'd say they will deal with the exploration portion more and less focus on the monster movie aspect.
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Old March 26 2014, 12:04 PM   #43
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

Like a lot of people I think, I was disappointed the first time around, but on a second viewing I actually started to like it. The idiot scientists make sense once you realise that they're only there as disposible canaries to verify the find. David was essentially carrying on his actual mission while they were busy arseing around.

It could definitely have done with just a little more character development though (which I gather was originally there, but cut for pacing.) Normally with a Ridley Scott film I like to wait for the DC since he's usually pretty ruthless in his theatrical cuts and lavish on DVD, but in this instance I think he's said he has no intention on doing any extended version, which is a shame really.

Small aside, but one thing I'm still not 100% clear on, but was Theron's character Weyland's biological daughter, or an earlier (Tyrell?) android prototype? It just seemed like her interactions with David gave me a jealous sibling vibe, but that could apply to either scenario.
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Old March 26 2014, 12:16 PM   #44
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

The inexcusably stupid behavior of the characters caused me to bail on the first one before anything interesting happened, assuming it ever did, but I can hardly care whether anything interesting did in fact happen since I was hating the film so much. I'm happy I didn't pay money to see it, so I'll be passing on the sequel.
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Old March 26 2014, 03:01 PM   #45
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Re: Prometheus 2: Apparently it's happening

Good, I think there are some answers out there for tje story.
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