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Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

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Old March 10 2014, 01:53 PM   #16
ssosmcin
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

See? A perfect 60's style goof!

Let me get a rag to wipe the egg off my face....
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Old March 10 2014, 03:16 PM   #17
CommishSleer
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

Well I don't think that WNMHGB has the error. Its the first episode. It establishes the precedence. Warp Factor 1 could be 100 light years a day for all we know (at that stage). 30 years later in VOY they define the max Voyager can travel is 1000 light years per year. Are people saying the TOS writers should have been aware of that?

Or is it the VOY writers you have a problem with? To me the VOY writers wanted the journey to take 75 years and they just set the rules to suit them. That was the whole premise of their series. I can't see the problem with that. Its not that big a stretch to marry the speeds in WNMHGB to that of VOY if you use fanboy logic.
We don't know where the Enterprise was when it made its trip to the 'edge of the galaxy'. For all we know it could have spent 6 months getting there. In "The Paradise Syndrome" the Enterprise was at least 3 months away from help.
And the Enterprise was pretty far from help too in WNMHGB.

And I see a lot of techno-babble, holo-deck 'science' in the series after TOS as well. Not just the Nexus. The episodes where people de-evolved and were restored back to normal, where they deaged and were able to reage or reduce in age using the transporter. All those episodes where Q or the Traveller or the Prophets or the holodeck performed miracles were not 'real science'.
Not that that's what we want. Episodes that are strictly scientific would be extremely boring.
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Old March 10 2014, 06:20 PM   #18
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

YATI, and OLD Star Trek fan term:

Yet Another Trek Inconsistency

Star Trek (starting with TOS and going into TNG, DS9, VOY, ENT, et. al.) was NOT designed to be 'hard' science fiction with everything firmly rooted in factual science. It's a TV show meant to entertain. Yes, every series has had scientific advisors/consultants informing the producers about science/astronomy, and giving them info on whether something may or may not be plausible, etc; but in the end, STORY (and what they want to do to entertain) has ALWAYS trumped 'scientific accuracy' in Star Trek from TOS until today.

As for ship speeds/travel time; Star Trek ships have always traveled at the 'speed of plot' (IE there always where they need to be at the time the story's plot needs them to be there.)

The 'Star Trek Universe' (tm) has never been 100% consistent and was never envisioned to be 100% consistent. Story has always trumped consistency/canon in Star Trek.

The fun for a lot o fans is to try to rationalize away these inconsistencies with ridiculous justifications/explainations
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Old March 10 2014, 06:23 PM   #19
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

Noname Given wrote: View Post
The fun for a lot o fans is to try to rationalize away these inconsistencies with ridiculous justifications/explainations
I once encountered a poster on another board who tried to reconcile the original Highlander II with the rest of the franchise, despite the movie's own producers saying it was so bad, it wasn't canon. The mental gymnastics were horrific but amazing.

This poster kept repeating, "Am I the only one who..." And the response every time was, "Yes, yes you are."
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Old March 10 2014, 06:31 PM   #20
Gary Mitchell
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

Alidar Jarok wrote: View Post
I thought this thread would be about James R. Kirk.
No one's ever going to let me forget that are they?
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Old March 10 2014, 09:39 PM   #21
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

Gary Mitchell wrote: View Post
Alidar Jarok wrote: View Post
I thought this thread would be about James R. Kirk.
No one's ever going to let me forget that are they?
I do not remember that....but did wonder why Kirk left Elizabeth's stinking corpse on my planet. Imagine climbing out of that hole, only to discover...that...
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Old March 11 2014, 02:08 AM   #22
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

Maurice wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
It's explicitly referred to as the "rim of the galaxy" when they return in "By Any Other Name".
"Galaxy edge" in WNMHGB.

None of it makes sense anyway. If you wanted to head to Andromeda that last thing you'd do is fly through the galactic plane to the "rim", because that's the wrong direction. It's inane...by any other name.
Not to mention that the idea of a definable "edge" to the galaxy is a load of rubbish in the first place. To quote David Gerrold, it's like trying to bisect a sneeze.
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Old March 11 2014, 04:44 AM   #23
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

scotpens wrote: View Post
Not to mention that the idea of a definable "edge" to the galaxy is a load of rubbish in the first place. To quote David Gerrold, it's like trying to bisect a sneeze.
...said the guy who invented Tribbles.

The barrier needs no hard scientific basis--it was a striking, threatening creation holding much mystery (not to mention its effects on humans after contact). The shot of the Enterprise approaching the barrier is one of the defining images in all Star Trek.
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Old March 11 2014, 09:49 AM   #24
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

Sometimes people tend to forget the fiction in science-fiction, that some stuff is indeed just made up solely for dramatic storytelling purposes with no actual basis in science. In the fictional Star Trek Universe, there is an energy barrier surrounding the Galaxy, and it's really no different from ancient sea stories about things at the End of the World.
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Old March 11 2014, 11:00 AM   #25
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

Maurice wrote: View Post
You can leave the "galaxy" pretty easily up going galactic north or south instead out along the plane of the disc. As Spock might say say, your "pattern indicates two dimensions thinking."
Wouldn't that rather apply to the producers or the VFX people?

I mean, it really just looks like the barrier would be an obstacle for a ship that's somehow stuck to a two-dimensional plane. A spaceship approaching it should be able to pass over or under it (unless lethal radiation is least at the bright center of it, there could be plenty of impenetrable "dark" matter above and below).

Oops...just another one of these crazy rationalization attempts.

Bob
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Old March 11 2014, 12:48 PM   #26
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
Sometimes people tend to forget the fiction in science-fiction, that some stuff is indeed just made up solely for dramatic storytelling purposes with no actual basis in science. In the fictional Star Trek Universe, there is an energy barrier surrounding the Galaxy, and it's really no different from ancient sea stories about things at the End of the World.
+1
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Old March 11 2014, 02:53 PM   #27
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
Sometimes people tend to forget the fiction in science-fiction, that some stuff is indeed just made up solely for dramatic storytelling purposes with no actual basis in science. In the fictional Star Trek Universe, there is an energy barrier surrounding the Galaxy, and it's really no different from ancient sea stories about things at the End of the World.
Well said. Trek is a comic-book fantasy world, not real science fiction (whatever it was originally envisioned as), and this is another example. It's as realistic as the magical bridge made of rainbows in Thor, but it's just as real to Trek's world as that is to the Marvel movieverse.
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Old March 11 2014, 03:43 PM   #28
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

The "rationalization" that personally satisfies me is that the "barrier" is "something" that is only observable by ships and probes employing some sort of warp drive. In "normal" space, it's effectively not there and one can just cruise on by. But it would take hundreds or thousnads of years to traverse the same distance. Kick in that warp drive and it becomes very "real".

As to why it appears as a "band" instead of a "shell", maybe that's just one of those optic things. Likewly, it IS a "shell", but it simply appears to be a band from whatever angle it's approached. Warp "north" or "south" of the galactic plane, and it still looks like a bloody band.

Yeah, a "weak" explanation to be sure, but it suspends my disbelief well enough to enjoy the story.

Sincerely,

Bill
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Old March 11 2014, 04:04 PM   #29
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

I remember wondering something similar to this thread topic a number of years back. I will provide the link if anyone is interested....

LINK

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Old March 11 2014, 04:05 PM   #30
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Re: A Goof in the STAR TREK Franchise

Redfern wrote: View Post
The "rationalization" that personally satisfies me is that the "barrier" is "something" that is only observable by ships and probes employing some sort of warp drive. In "normal" space, it's effectively not there and one can just cruise on by. But it would take hundreds or thousnads of years to traverse the same distance. Kick in that warp drive and it becomes very "real".

As to why it appears as a "band" instead of a "shell", maybe that's just one of those optic things. Likewly, it IS a "shell", but it simply appears to be a band from whatever angle it's approached. Warp "north" or "south" of the galactic plane, and it still looks like a bloody band.

Yeah, a "weak" explanation to be sure, but it suspends my disbelief well enough to enjoy the story.

Sincerely,

Bill
Actually that's a pretty damn good explanation. I like it.
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