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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Misc. Star Trek > Future of Trek

Future of Trek Discussion of future Trek projects.

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Old April 23 2014, 04:00 PM   #91
iPadCary
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Re: Should the next Star Trek series have a major war?

BigJake wrote: View Post
Uh... what's a "First City"?
Qo'noS's DC/Moscow/Berlin.
It's their capital.

OK, I guess I misread this board's love of Trek.
Apologies.
I shall now take my leave and shan't darken your doorstep again.
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Old April 23 2014, 04:37 PM   #92
2takesfrakes
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Re: Should the next Star Trek series have a major war?

"... darken your doorstep ..."

>>SNORT!!!<<
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Old April 23 2014, 06:09 PM   #93
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Re: Should the next Star Trek series have a major war?

2takesfrakes wrote: View Post
If I saw STAR TREK: Dam Busters making it to the screen, I would probably tune in every night. I wouldn't mind a blood-thirsty series ...
Well, I'll be honest. I like to have a shelf video library, so I sometimes buy films or tv shows I've heard of but never seen. One of those was Space: Above and Beyond, which I missed during first run in the 90s, and only ran one season. I wanted to see if I could figure out why it failed.

It was a war story every week. I watched each episode once, and haven't rewatched any of them since because they were just deadenly dull after a week long marathon of space battles and ground battles and its gung-ho approach to US Marines... In Space!

I'm afraid I'd have the same reaction to any Star Trek: War! series. The Dominion War was an interesting little trip for a while, but it ran much too long for my tastes. War is not what I watch Star Trek for.
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Old April 23 2014, 07:21 PM   #94
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Re: Should the next Star Trek series have a major war?

Ryan8bit wrote: View Post

If I want to watch a show about action-adventure space fiction, I watch Star Wars. Star Trek is a little bit more complex than that and sometimes involves politics and war, and I mean in the original.
Which you've just nailed down why the format was so successful for so long: It could do any kind of story and could do different things each and every week. TOS and early-TNG were just chock full of variety. If they had done seventy-nine episodes of just war and politics with the Klingons or Romulans, people would've left in a hurry and we wouldn't still be talking about it today, nearly fifty-years after the fact.

I've always considered Star Wars a space fantasy with more in common with Lord of the Rings than Star Trek. YMMV.
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Old April 23 2014, 10:05 PM   #95
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Re: Should the next Star Trek series have a major war?

Actually, I think that format staying the same for so long was where things started to stagnate. Yes, it was good for a time, but after a while it just became more of the same. It wasn't just TOS and early TNG that had variety, it was most of TNG. VOY had the same format, and Enterprise started out that way. DS9 is probably the only show that deviated from it, but they still didn't have an intense focus on war until the end. Even though they were at war, they still found time to do different kinds of stories within that context. Variety wasn't really the problem.

Now let me just say that I agree in that I don't think a war or political focus is a good way to go. To the original question, I believe my answer was that being after a war would be more interesting than during. I don't think the focus should be on war, but at the same time I keep seeing comments along the lines of, "It's Star Trek not Star Wars," which seem to imply that any kind of war doesn't fit in because of the name. Like Star Trek is only about [fill in the blank]. But as you've pointed out, it's never been about one thing. It's not just space fiction or action adventure... it's a melange of lots of fun things.

So the original question seems to ask if we want to focus on just one of those things that Star Trek is made up of, and I don't know if I'm in favor of that. I think if war was strictly a backdrop and not a focus, that would be ok, but I don't want all out war. As is, Star Trek has never really handled war concepts all that well anyways.

If we focused on just action-adventure, I think that would be pretty boring too, at least for a series. I'm still up for a variety of stories.
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Old April 23 2014, 10:14 PM   #96
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Re: Should the next Star Trek series have a major war?

Ryan8bit wrote: View Post
Actually, I think that format staying the same for so long was where things started to stagnate. Yes, it was good for a time, but after a while it just became more of the same.
I think that format (people exploring space in a spaceship) is kinda what Star Trek "is". If you're going to abandon that, you might as well just make something entirely new instead of trying to make Star Trek something it isn't. YMMV.
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Old April 24 2014, 01:15 AM   #97
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Re: Should the next Star Trek series have a major war?

Ryan8bit wrote: View Post
Actually, I think that format staying the same for so long was where things started to stagnate.
I don't think it was the format so much as the uninspired storytelling, telling and retelling virtually the same ship-in-danger plots and the same crew-is-infected-and-must-race-against-time-to-find-a-cure plots and, in the case of VOY, the same looks-like-we-might-get-home-but-OH!-just-missed-it plots. If every episode of TNG had been of the same quality as "Measure of a Man" or "Yesterday's Enterprise," I don't think anyone would mind the episodic format. Unfortunately, Piller's rule that the ship had to be in mortal danger every week started to suck the life from the show.
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Old April 24 2014, 01:24 AM   #98
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Re: Should the next Star Trek series have a major war?

Piller had a rule that the ship had to be in mortal danger every week? That's news to me.

VOY certainly stagnated, and ENT -- where they didn't have the guts to really run with their premise -- even moreso. Far as I can remember Piller was responsible for the best and most varied seasons of TNG happening at all.
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Old April 24 2014, 02:00 AM   #99
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Re: Should the next Star Trek series have a major war?

BigJake wrote: View Post
Piller had a rule that the ship had to be in mortal danger every week? That's news to me.
IIRC, his reasoning was that since conflict can't come from the characters (who are enlightened Roddenberrian 24th Century humans and have no real conflict with each other) the source of the conflict much come from outside. Makes sense being saddled with Roddenberry's vision of no-conflict, but then it led to terrible episodes like that one with Lwaxana and Alexander and a tacked-on ship-in-jeopardy b-story so dull that the Lwaxana story was actually more interesting.

Of course, Piller's own "Family" didn't feature an outside threat; but I also remember Piller complaining (in either Starlog or Cinefantastique -- I can't remember) that the episode didn't bring in the ratings, which is probably why we didn't get another episode like that one.

EDIT: Oops. My mistake. Ron Moore wrote "Family," though IIRC it was Piller's idea to show the psychological aftermath of Picard's Borg experience.
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Old April 24 2014, 02:12 AM   #100
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Re: Should the next Star Trek series have a major war?

iPadCary wrote: View Post
OK, I guess I misread this board's love of Trek.
Apologies.
I shall now take my leave and shan't darken your doorstep again.
Live Long & Prosper!
Love =/= groupthink.

Except in dystopias.
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Old April 24 2014, 02:32 AM   #101
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Re: Should the next Star Trek series have a major war?

Hober Mallow wrote: View Post
BigJake wrote: View Post
Piller had a rule that the ship had to be in mortal danger every week? That's news to me.
IIRC, his reasoning was that since conflict can't come from the characters (who are enlightened Roddenberrian 24th Century humans and have no real conflict with each other) the source of the conflict much come from outside.
Okay, source of conflict coming from outside I can see. That's a bit different. And yes, that stricture did start to drag on things after a while.
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Old April 24 2014, 04:03 AM   #102
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BillJ wrote: View Post
iPadCary wrote: View Post

And ask yourself this: if those JJ Abrams abominations are so hot, why is absolutely no one from those things ever the main attraction at a Trek convention, much less ever actually appearing at one, hmm? I don't recall ever seeing a Zack Quinto, or a Chris Pine or a Simon Pegg anywhere near a Star Trek convention, do you?
I'm pretty sure all three have been at some Star Trek conventions, but I could be wrong.
I'm guessing the main reason you don't see much of the nu-cast at conventions is they don't need the money (or maybe the main actors appearance fees are too expensive).
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Old April 24 2014, 04:41 AM   #103
Hober Mallow
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Re: Should the next Star Trek series have a major war?

iPadCary wrote: View Post
OK, I guess I misread this board's love of Trek.
Just because some of us aren't too keen on yet another TNG spinoff doesn't mean we don't love Star Trek.
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Old April 24 2014, 10:57 AM   #104
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Re: Should the next Star Trek series have a major war?

Melakon wrote: View Post
War is not what I watch Star Trek for.
I am not advocating a War-driven STAR TREK, either, but I am prepared for it. One thing, though - the STARFLEET look just isn't very combatty ... you know? It looks like some fashion statement, or other. The MACOs on ENTERPRISE definitely had the right look for that.

The other problem has been the staging. Hand-held cameras and gritty realism of war need to be in play, even though, in reality, futuristic war wouldn't ever require boots on the ground, it's just not fun to watch it, that way. Finally, in support of the idea, though, there are many different faces of war: The traumatised civilians, the medical emergencies, the friendly fire, the collaborators, the unlikely romances ... on and on. If the coverage were such, it could be a really entertaining concept.

There is much material to mine from a series based on a war, but Rick Berman-styled STAR TREK was never up to the challenge, really. I suspect a new film crew would feel otherwise. So ... if STAR TREK: War! came to television, I'd feel compelled to give it a shot, sure ... but the wonderful thing about war is that it can end. After the Path to Healing has been followed, exploration could resume, or any other kind of STAR TREK story.
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Old April 24 2014, 01:24 PM   #105
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Re: Should the next Star Trek series have a major war?

iPadCary wrote: View Post
OK, I guess I misread this board's love of Trek.
Apologies.
I shall now take my leave and shan't darken your doorstep again.
Live Long & Prosper!
This thread may help you determine which types of fans frequent to the TrekBBS.
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