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Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

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Old March 14 2014, 12:38 AM   #91
Shat Happens
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Re: On-Screen Documents

you people made me get the book and chek. It's on Page 1.

I received James because it was (..) the name of my mother's first love instructor
Notice "first". I get it's meant as figurative, not a real instructor.

That or sex in the 23 century is a major composed of various disciplines.
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Old March 14 2014, 01:42 AM   #92
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Re: On-Screen Documents

Shat Happens wrote: View Post
you people made me get the book and chek. It's on Page 1.

I received James because it was (..) the name of my mother's first love instructor
Notice "first". I get it's meant as figurative, not a real instructor.

That or sex in the 23 century is a major composed of various disciplines.
Probably just the first guy she had sex with.
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Old March 14 2014, 02:10 AM   #93
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Re: On-Screen Documents

Under the eye of NBC Standards and Practices and a less "liberated" American culture, Roddenberry did some great writing for Star Trek. True, he started off with a green Orion slave girl, but the rest of the series was played pretty straight. By 1979 however, when he was under far less restraint, he was again injecting off-color material into the franchise for no better reason than attention-getting.

The love instructor bit in his TMP novelization, plus Ilia's whole "overwhelming pheromones" deal, seemed awkward and stupid to me even as a hormonal teenager. I'll bet Star Trek II would have been sexed up if GR had stayed in control.

I like sexy movies as much as anyone, but that's not what Star Trek is best at, and not what I want to see Kirk and Spock dealing with.
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Old March 14 2014, 03:31 AM   #94
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Re: On-Screen Documents

Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
^ Especially now that we know - the real George Kirk was clearly not the kind of wuss who would cause his wife to need a "love instructor" (whatever the hell that means) in the first place.
Somebody had to keep Mrs. Kirk company while George was out protecting the Nine Realms.
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Old March 14 2014, 03:38 AM   #95
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The Old Mixer wrote: View Post
Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
^ Especially now that we know - the real George Kirk was clearly not the kind of wuss who would cause his wife to need a "love instructor" (whatever the hell that means) in the first place.
Somebody had to keep Mrs. Kirk company while George was out protecting the Nine Realms.
Mrs. Kirk lives in a fantasy world.
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Old March 14 2014, 05:09 AM   #96
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Re: On-Screen Documents

Shat Happens wrote: View Post
. . .
I received James because it was (..) the name of my mother's first love instructor
Notice "first". I get it's meant as figurative, not a real instructor.

That or sex in the 23 century is a major composed of various disciplines.
In the 23rd century they teach sexual technique in school. You have to know it in case something goes wrong with the machine.
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Old March 14 2014, 05:24 AM   #97
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Re: On-Screen Documents

I love the TMP novelization, it's like pure Roddenberry for better or worse. Inspired by this thread, I started reading it a little last night. I love that Sulu is described as a "scrutable Asian".
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Old March 14 2014, 06:26 AM   #98
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Re: On-Screen Documents

Mr. Adventure wrote: View Post
I love the TMP novelization, it's like pure Roddenberry for better or worse. Inspired by this thread, I started reading it a little last night. I love that Sulu is described as a "scrutable Asian".
That is the conflicting mindset of the ultra-progressive; GR's description for Sulu was patently offensive--certainly antiquated, but he likely thought he was being "respectful" of what he believed was some inherent trait of those from Sulu's background.

Stereotyped, misguided BS X 1000, but hey, its Gene (the hero who fought dastardly, woman hatin' NBC!), so he cannot be accused of being politically incorrect.

...yeah...

Then, TMP was the point where GR--in full revisionist mode--tried to explain away the make-up of the TOS Klingons...
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Old March 14 2014, 11:09 AM   #99
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Re: On-Screen Documents

TREK_GOD_1 wrote: View Post
GR's description for Sulu was patently offensive--certainly antiquated, but he likely thought he was being "respectful" of what he believed was some inherent trait of those from Sulu's background.

I'm pretty sure it already sounded backward and out-of-touch by 1979, but the actual cliche was "inscrutable Asian." The idea was that you never knew what those mysterious Asians were thinking. GR was calling Sulu "scrutable," reversing the cliche, as a little attempt at wit.

Another Roddenberry-ism that clanged on my ear occurred in an interview. I can't remember if it was on The Mike Douglas Show (I audio-taped his appearance as a kid) or if it's on the 1976 spoken-word LP (now CD) Inside Star Trek. He referred to "...the affection I have for Asians..." as the reason for Sulu's presence. It was one of the most paternalistic and self-centered (to say nothing of over-generalizing) statements I've ever heard.
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Old March 14 2014, 01:57 PM   #100
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Re: On-Screen Documents

ZapBrannigan wrote: View Post
Another Roddenberry-ism that clanged on my ear occurred in an interview. I can't remember if it was on The Mike Douglas Show (I audio-taped his appearance as a kid) or if it's on the 1976 spoken-word LP (now CD) Inside Star Trek. He referred to "...the affection I have for Asians..." as the reason for Sulu's presence. It was one of the most paternalistic and self-centered (to say nothing of over-generalizing) statements I've ever heard.
Yeah, that's GR....but again, he thought he could say anything, since as the creator of Star Trek, he was the Super Most Liberal Understanding Man in the Universe, so his every view was acceptable.
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Old March 15 2014, 12:43 AM   #101
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Re: On-Screen Documents

Anybody else thinking of making comparisons between Gene Roddenberry eventually losing touch with what made Star Trek work and George Lucas having the same issue with Star Wars?
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Old March 15 2014, 01:59 AM   #102
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Re: On-Screen Documents

ZapBrannigan wrote: View Post
. . . Another Roddenberry-ism that clanged on my ear occurred in an interview. I can't remember if it was on The Mike Douglas Show (I audio-taped his appearance as a kid) or if it's on the 1976 spoken-word LP (now CD) Inside Star Trek. He referred to "...the affection I have for Asians..." as the reason for Sulu's presence.
Well, they do make such bloody good cameras . . .
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Old March 15 2014, 07:26 AM   #103
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Kevman7987 wrote: View Post
Anybody else thinking of making comparisons between Gene Roddenberry eventually losing touch with what made Star Trek work and George Lucas having the same issue with Star Wars?
It has crossed my mind, but unfortunately I don't have anything "deep" or worthwhile to say.
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Old March 15 2014, 09:58 AM   #104
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Re: On-Screen Documents

LMFAOschwarz wrote: View Post
Kevman7987 wrote: View Post
Anybody else thinking of making comparisons between Gene Roddenberry eventually losing touch with what made Star Trek work and George Lucas having the same issue with Star Wars?
It has crossed my mind, but unfortunately I don't have anything "deep" or worthwhile to say.

Based on the book Inside Star Trek (Solow, Justman), it's my impression that GR was starting to adopt hippie values by the end of the second season, around 1968. And, per his Wikipedia entry (section 4.4), in the 1970s he graduated from hipster to full-blown druggie.

I don't know what messed up George Lucas, but for my money he sure messed up the SW prequels.
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Old March 15 2014, 08:22 PM   #105
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Re: On-Screen Documents

ZapBrannigan wrote: View Post
TREK_GOD_1 wrote: View Post
GR's description for Sulu was patently offensive--certainly antiquated, but he likely thought he was being "respectful" of what he believed was some inherent trait of those from Sulu's background.

I'm pretty sure it already sounded backward and out-of-touch by 1979, but the actual cliche was "inscrutable Asian." The idea was that you never knew what those mysterious Asians were thinking. GR was calling Sulu "scrutable," reversing the cliche, as a little attempt at wit.
It was a lame and old attempt even by then.
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