RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 141,537
Posts: 5,512,971
Members: 25,139
Currently online: 491
Newest member: Pammijo

TrekToday headlines

Two New Starships Collection Ships
By: T'Bonz on Dec 26

Captain Kirk’s Boldest Missions
By: T'Bonz on Dec 25

Trek Paper Clips
By: T'Bonz on Dec 24

Sargent Passes
By: T'Bonz on Dec 23

QMx Trek Insignia Badges
By: T'Bonz on Dec 23

And The New Director Of Star Trek 3 Is…
By: T'Bonz on Dec 23

TV Alert: Pine On Tonight Show
By: T'Bonz on Dec 22

Retro Review: The Emperor’s New Cloak
By: Michelle on Dec 20

Star Trek Opera
By: T'Bonz on Dec 19

New Abrams Project
By: T'Bonz on Dec 18


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old February 27 2014, 05:38 AM   #16
JarodRussell
Vice Admiral
 
JarodRussell's Avatar
 
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
Plus, Khan Prime's skin colour changes between "Space Seed" and WoK anyway. He goes from awful faux-Indian brownface to Montelban's natural white skin tone.


Show me three reviews that recognized this change back when TWOK was released and I'll consider respecting that argument.
JarodRussell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 27 2014, 05:40 AM   #17
BlueMetroid
Lieutenant
 
BlueMetroid's Avatar
 
Location: Cydonia, Mars
View BlueMetroid's Twitter Profile
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

The Stig wrote: View Post
Much like the execrable Enterprise two-parter that 'explained' the Klingon appearance change, this is really a question that no one needs the answer to.
I thoroughly enjoyed Affliction and Divergence. Personally, I needed to know.
__________________
http://nickcagecats.tumblr.com/
BlueMetroid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 27 2014, 06:17 AM   #18
Hanukkah Solo
Admiral
 
Hanukkah Solo's Avatar
 
Location: Skywalker
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

BlueMetroid wrote: View Post
Skywalker wrote: View Post
iguana_tonante wrote: View Post
How do they explain that Kirk has blue eyes now???? CANON VIOLATION!!!!
Prime Kirk was born on Earth. In the new universe Kirk was born prematurely in a shuttle. The shuttle's shields were inadequate to fully protect Kirk, his mother, and the crew from the radiation of the nearby star, which turned his eyes blue. It all makes sense, you just don't want to see it!
Yep, this is Orci's official explanation that he confirmed via Twitter.
Wait, really?
Hanukkah Solo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 27 2014, 06:25 AM   #19
Hartzilla2007
Vice Admiral
 
Hartzilla2007's Avatar
 
Location: Star Trekkin Across the universe.
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

BlueMetroid wrote: View Post
Set Harth wrote: View Post
-Brett- wrote: View Post
It's a reboot. Period.
No it isn't. Period. If it was a reboot the characters in the film wouldn't openly talk about how things turned out in the original timeline, nor would one of the participants of those events get called up on the video phone. Those things do not happen in reboots; by definition they cannot.
This.
Indeed it's just stuff I really don't give a crap about.

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
Plus, Khan Prime's skin colour changes between "Space Seed" and WoK anyway. He goes from awful faux-Indian brownface to Montelban's natural white skin tone.


Show me three reviews that recognized this change back when TWOK was released and I'll consider respecting that argument.
Oh, so the reason pointing out that previous Star Trek films did some of the things the naysayers don't like in the new stuff is a bad thing is that the naysayers didn't actually care about it until the new people did it in a Star Trek movie.
Hartzilla2007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 27 2014, 06:48 AM   #20
Sindatur
Vice Admiral
 
Sindatur's Avatar
 
Location: Sacramento, CA
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

Hartzilla2007 wrote: View Post
BlueMetroid wrote: View Post
Set Harth wrote: View Post

No it isn't. Period. If it was a reboot the characters in the film wouldn't openly talk about how things turned out in the original timeline, nor would one of the participants of those events get called up on the video phone. Those things do not happen in reboots; by definition they cannot.
This.
Indeed it's just stuff I really don't give a crap about.

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
Plus, Khan Prime's skin colour changes between "Space Seed" and WoK anyway. He goes from awful faux-Indian brownface to Montelban's natural white skin tone.


Show me three reviews that recognized this change back when TWOK was released and I'll consider respecting that argument.
Oh, so the reason pointing out that previous Star Trek films did some of the things the naysayers don't like in the new stuff is a bad thing is that the naysayers didn't actually care about it until the new people did it in a Star Trek movie.
I don't even think a Facepalm pic needs to be posted. The Khan expressions in the comparative pic work quite nicely, especially the Space Seed one
__________________
One Day I hope to be the Man my Cat thinks I am

Where are we going? And why are we in this Handbasket?
Sindatur is online now   Reply With Quote
Old February 27 2014, 07:57 AM   #21
Shaka Zulu
Fleet Captain
 
Location: Bulawayo Military Krral
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

Nebusj wrote: View Post
Wereghost wrote: View Post
It does kind of almost sort of in a way partially make sense if you suspend a resoectable amount of disbelief. Section 31 wanted his genius but not the associated baggage. Though why they didn't just compromise and use one of the 72 others is unclear.
… because the super-secret branch of Star Fleet was worried its project to subvert the legitimate government of the Federation, build an armada of hyper-advanced weaponry, and launch a preemptive invasion of conquest against neighboring powers might suffer from some bad press if they have on staff a secret agent who looks like a half-forgotten warlord who died centuries ago …
My sentiments exactly.
Shaka Zulu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 27 2014, 02:38 PM   #22
JarodRussell
Vice Admiral
 
JarodRussell's Avatar
 
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

Hartzilla2007 wrote: View Post
BlueMetroid wrote: View Post
Set Harth wrote: View Post

No it isn't. Period. If it was a reboot the characters in the film wouldn't openly talk about how things turned out in the original timeline, nor would one of the participants of those events get called up on the video phone. Those things do not happen in reboots; by definition they cannot.
This.
Indeed it's just stuff I really don't give a crap about.

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
Plus, Khan Prime's skin colour changes between "Space Seed" and WoK anyway. He goes from awful faux-Indian brownface to Montelban's natural white skin tone.


Show me three reviews that recognized this change back when TWOK was released and I'll consider respecting that argument.
Oh, so the reason pointing out that previous Star Trek films did some of the things the naysayers don't like in the new stuff is a bad thing is that the naysayers didn't actually care about it until the new people did it in a Star Trek movie.
Didn't care? No. Nobody even noticed it. For the audience there was no noticable change in Khan's appearance, other than that he got much older and wore self made clothes.

The new film on the other hand noticably whitewashed the guy.
JarodRussell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 27 2014, 02:48 PM   #23
Bry_Sinclair
Commodore
 
Bry_Sinclair's Avatar
 
Location: Tactical withdrawl along the Klingon border
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

Perhaps John Harriman is actually John Harriman, a follower of Khan's, who assumed his master's identity after Khan died onboard the Botany Bay due to a faulty cyrogentic tube. That would explain the differences.
__________________
Avatar: Captain Naya, U.S.S. Renown NCC-1415 [Star Trek: Four Years War]
Manip by: JM1776 (STPMA.net)
Bry_Sinclair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 27 2014, 02:56 PM   #24
Herkimer Jitty
Rear Admiral
 
Herkimer Jitty's Avatar
 
Location: Dayglow, New California Republic
Send a message via Windows Live Messenger to Herkimer Jitty
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

Cryogenic tube won't be installed until Tuesday.
__________________
STAR TREK: 1964-1965½, 1966-1969, Jan. 21-23 1972, 1979-2001, 2003-2005, 2009-?
Herkimer Jitty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 27 2014, 03:24 PM   #25
BlueMetroid
Lieutenant
 
BlueMetroid's Avatar
 
Location: Cydonia, Mars
View BlueMetroid's Twitter Profile
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

Skywalker wrote: View Post
BlueMetroid wrote: View Post
Skywalker wrote: View Post
Prime Kirk was born on Earth. In the new universe Kirk was born prematurely in a shuttle. The shuttle's shields were inadequate to fully protect Kirk, his mother, and the crew from the radiation of the nearby star, which turned his eyes blue. It all makes sense, you just don't want to see it!
Yep, this is Orci's official explanation that he confirmed via Twitter.
Wait, really?
Yep! I asked him on Twitter before he deleted his account.
__________________
http://nickcagecats.tumblr.com/
BlueMetroid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 27 2014, 03:51 PM   #26
F. King Daniel
Admiral
 
F. King Daniel's Avatar
 
Location: King Daniel Into Darkness
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
Hartzilla2007 wrote: View Post
BlueMetroid wrote: View Post

This.
Indeed it's just stuff I really don't give a crap about.

JarodRussell wrote: View Post



Show me three reviews that recognized this change back when TWOK was released and I'll consider respecting that argument.
Oh, so the reason pointing out that previous Star Trek films did some of the things the naysayers don't like in the new stuff is a bad thing is that the naysayers didn't actually care about it until the new people did it in a Star Trek movie.
Didn't care? No. Nobody even noticed it. For the audience there was no noticable change in Khan's appearance, other than that he got much older and wore self made clothes.

The new film on the other hand noticably whitewashed the guy.
It was 1982, a time before home video, easy screengrabs and photoshop comparisons. Even letterzines of the time were black and white. Had this pic been available, fans very much would have noticed and complained.
__________________
Star Trek Imponderables, fun mashups of Trek's biggest continuity errors! Ep1, Ep2 and Ep3
F. King Daniel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 27 2014, 03:58 PM   #27
Hartzilla2007
Vice Admiral
 
Hartzilla2007's Avatar
 
Location: Star Trekkin Across the universe.
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
Hartzilla2007 wrote: View Post
BlueMetroid wrote: View Post

This.
Indeed it's just stuff I really don't give a crap about.

JarodRussell wrote: View Post



Show me three reviews that recognized this change back when TWOK was released and I'll consider respecting that argument.
Oh, so the reason pointing out that previous Star Trek films did some of the things the naysayers don't like in the new stuff is a bad thing is that the naysayers didn't actually care about it until the new people did it in a Star Trek movie.
Didn't care? No. Nobody even noticed it. For the audience there was no noticable change in Khan's appearance, other than that he got much older and wore self made clothes.
Did it ever occur to you that the main reason for that might be because Space Seed wasn't available on home video at the time so that people who would be watching Wrath of Khan back then would be going off of memories of a 15 year old TV episode they may have seen once or twice.

Do you honestly think that if trek fans back then had the level of access to the old episodes we have today they wouldn't have been bitching about it?
Hartzilla2007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 27 2014, 04:40 PM   #28
Khan 2.0
Captain
 
Khan 2.0's Avatar
 
Location: earth...but when?...spock?
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

i wonder if theyd have had the appearance change explanation had original choice Benico Del Toro been cast (or if theyd got STID out summer 2011 or 2012 with a pre Skyfall Javier Barhem)

probably not
Khan 2.0 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old February 27 2014, 05:15 PM   #29
Ryan8bit
Commodore
 
Ryan8bit's Avatar
 
Location: St. Paul, MN
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

I think people were probably more likely to accept it in TWOK just because it was the same actor, and the skin color wasn't of much consequence. When you start recasting, the gates of scrutiny are much more open. And it's not as if it was just the skin color that was different. The accent, the build, and the general character were different too.

All that said, I think an in-universe explanation isn't necessary at all. That stuff needs to be left to fanon.
Ryan8bit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 27 2014, 05:50 PM   #30
BlueMetroid
Lieutenant
 
BlueMetroid's Avatar
 
Location: Cydonia, Mars
View BlueMetroid's Twitter Profile
Re: Khan's Into Darkness Appearance change finally explained

Khan 2.0 wrote: View Post
i wonder if theyd have had the appearance change explanation had original choice Benico Del Toro been cast (or if theyd got STID out summer 2011 or 2012 with a pre Skyfall Javier Barhem)

probably not
I've often wondered this. I hope they would have, as Del Toro and Montalban look absolutely nothing alike, other than both being Latino.
__________________
http://nickcagecats.tumblr.com/
BlueMetroid is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 01:21 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.