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General Trek Discussion Trek TV and cinema subjects not related to any specific series or movie.

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Old February 22 2014, 01:28 AM   #31
Nerys Myk
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

T'Girl wrote: View Post
Nerys Myk wrote: View Post
I don't see how you could eliminate the character of Archer. Recast or write better, but not eliminate.
He was completely wrong, and made the show (all seasons) a joke. Replace him with the character of Tucker. Create a different engineer for the ship.

Bry_Sinclair wrote: View Post
T'Girl wrote: View Post
Nerys Myk wrote: View Post
I don't see how you could eliminate the character of Archer. Recast or write better, but not eliminate.
He was completely wrong, and made the show (all seasons) a joke. Replace him with the character of Tucker. Create a different engineer for the ship.

Archer was all wrong, Tucker would've been a far better choice for Captain.
Tucker? Based on what? I like Tucker, but I'm not sure what he brings to the Captain's chair.
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Old February 22 2014, 02:26 AM   #32
T'Girl
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

^ Start with his easy going southern charm.

When I was in High School he was the only character people talked about, even those who rarely watch the show knew about "Trip." What's one of the primary demographics the networks and cable outfit want?

He was (the character) comfortable in his own skin, Archer wasn't. He came off a competent professional, Archer didn't. I could never see Archer as a ladies man, thankfully TPTB didn't try, Trip as Captain would have easied into that role.

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Old February 22 2014, 03:18 AM   #33
Nerys Myk
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

T'Girl wrote: View Post
^ Start with his easy going southern charm.
Having lived in the south, I guess I'm immune. Though I liked having another Southerner in Trek.

When I was in High School he was the only character people talked about, even those who rarely watch the show knew about "Trip." What's one of the primary demographics the networks and cable outfit want?
Kids in High School?

He was (the character) comfortable in his own skin, Archer wasn't. He came off a competent professional, Archer didn't. I could never see Archer as a ladies man, thankfully TPTB didn't try, Trip as Captain would have easied into that role.
That makes him sidekick material.
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Old February 22 2014, 04:45 AM   #34
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

T'Girl wrote: View Post
^ Start with his easy going southern charm.

When I was in High School he was the only character people talked about, even those who rarely watch the show knew about "Trip." What's one of the primary demographics the networks and cable outfit want?

He was (the character) comfortable in his own skin, Archer wasn't. He came off a competent professional, Archer didn't. I could never see Archer as a ladies man, thankfully TPTB didn't try, Trip as Captain would have easied into that role.

What high school did you go to? I was in COLLEGE surrounded by nerds when the show was on, and even THEY did not really know much about Enterprise other than the Vulcan chick got naked..
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Old February 22 2014, 11:16 PM   #35
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

Nerys Myk wrote: View Post
T'Girl wrote: View Post
What's one of the primary demographics the networks and cable outfit want?
Kids in High School?
Young people in general, people who haven't establish brand loyalties and will use commercials to make consumer decisions. "Kids" who would have gotten hooked on Star Trek as High School seniors would be in their early twenties when the show left the air.

The size of this demographic is important in determining what can be charged for advertizing.

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Old February 23 2014, 01:32 AM   #36
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

Jedi_Master wrote: View Post

I almost said Keiko, but she is a guest star... she does win the award as the most annoying and non supportive life partner EVER in Trek.
I'm glad someone finally agrees with me about Keiko. Her character's annoying level was taken to new heights on DS9. It reminded me of other poorly written characters who say "Choose me or your career." It's akin to the spouse of a soldier saying "I don't like where we're assigned so resign."

When it comes to Ezri, it feels like the writer's felt they needed to keep the Dax character around. If they had wrote her as a recurring character, perhaps brought to the station because of concerns of mental health after Sisko's "breakdown" at the end of Season 6. She didn't have to be a regular and even though I am a fan of "Field of Fire", we would have been spared the clunker of "Prodigal Daughter" and the random mid-season running after Worf and sleeping with him because Jadzia loved him.

I would've cut T'Pol out of ENT. Her character was brutally wooden in the first two seasons and they had to turn her into a drug addict in Season 3 to make her interesting. I would rather have seen the crew make some of those early bumbling mistakes if they didn't have her sulking around every episode.
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Old February 23 2014, 02:22 AM   #37
Nerys Myk
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

Finally? Keiko hate is practically a national past time here!
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Old February 23 2014, 02:43 AM   #38
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

And it's freakin' obnoxious.
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Old February 23 2014, 03:02 AM   #39
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

Keiko was treated badly by Miles (though mostly through circumstance).
She was practically a single mother most of the time raising her children on a dingy Space Station full of criminals.
Yes Miles had plenty of time to 'party' with Bashir and co while Keiko was left holding the baby.
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Old February 23 2014, 05:06 AM   #40
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

Keiko's personality could be a little grating but she never got in the way of Miles' career. She traveled with him wherever he went even when there was no botany could be done there. She fought for quality of education over religious intolerance. She was always willing to sacrifice her own happiness to go where Miles goes, so how could you say she was in the way of his career?

Archer wasn't great but I'd sacrifice Reed or Mayweather before Archer.
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Old February 23 2014, 05:17 AM   #41
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

Interesting thing about eliminating Yar: the bizarre thing I found last time I watched thru season one of TNG that I hadn't ever noticed before is how completely inessential she was. I think it must be because she was conceived as something special, but when Justman and Berman started pushing Gene to include a Klingon marine character, Yar's usefulness to scripts effectively ceased, because everything you might reasonably expect Yar to do could be done better by Worf. This is never more overtly pronounced than in Hide & Q, where Q eliminates Yar from the game without her even being able to get off a shot at him, and for the rest of the episode the role she might reasonably have been expected to play down on the planet is instead taken... by Worf.

Tasha Yar was basically made irrelevant from the start. Without Worf there, she would've been functional... but the series just wasn't big enough to sustain the both of them together.
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Old February 23 2014, 05:43 AM   #42
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

Jedi_Master wrote: View Post
For definition purposes, we are limiting "main" characters to those names appeared in the credits every week, and not Guest Stars.
By that definition...

TOS: McCoy (other than Shatner, Nimoy and Kelley, nobody else was credited as a regular)
TNG: Wesley
DS9: Jake
VOY: Kim
ENT: Mayweather

So, excluding TOS as a special case (only three credited leads), you can safely get rid of kids and ensigns and not damage the show...
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Old February 23 2014, 03:12 PM   #43
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

malfourmed wrote: View Post
By that definition...

TOS: McCoy (other than Shatner, Nimoy and Kelley, nobody else was credited as a regular)
And you wouldn't have been able to rid the show of Kelley untik the second season, because iirc he wasn't in the opening credits in season one.

Spock Must Die.

Lance wrote: View Post
Interesting thing about eliminating Yar: the bizarre thing I found last time I watched thru season one of TNG that I hadn't ever noticed before is how completely inessential she was.
Much of what she did standing behind the horseshoe could have been carried out by an extra in most episodes.

My big problem with Yar is that I could never buy someone of Crosby's physical build as a officer who (apparently) was career security. Think about female police officers and marines that you've seen.

Crosby was a stick.

Her eventual replacement by Worf was almost a given from the start, Worf the Klingon warrior was originally conceived as a somewhat low level character, but he grabbed the fans interest, and while not at Stewart's skill level, Dorn's acting abilities fair exceeded Crosby's.

Without the presence of Dorn, Crosby might have stayed and grew, she later became a good average actress in other roles, and that might have happen on Trek too. If she stayed.

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Old February 23 2014, 03:17 PM   #44
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

TOS: I respect that they had a black woman on the bridge but they might have as well replaced her with somebody who actually had some character development.
TNG: Tasha Yar was really useless and the acting was poor. They should've just randomly killed her off at the hands of some bizarre monster. Oh...
DS9: I have many issues with DS9 but I think all the main characters were central to the series. Oh wait, they simply shouldn't have added Ezri. That was a waste of screen time for the final season.
Voy: Harry Kim.
Enterprise: Mayweather.
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Old February 23 2014, 05:00 PM   #45
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Re: Which "main" character could have been eliminated?

Surprised to see so many Jake votes for DS9.

Is that just because you believe everyone else was so awesome, and someone needs to thrown under the bus, or did folks actually have a problem with Jake?
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