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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies I-X

Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

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Old February 20 2014, 02:53 AM   #16
Armored Saint
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

gottacook wrote: View Post
The color fotonovel of TMP (i.e., Star Trek The Motion Picture The Photostory, edited by Richard J. Anobile) omits the scene entirely, and it was a good choice to do so.
But what happens to Sonak? Is he totally erased of the story, so, they didn't have any science officer?
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Old February 20 2014, 09:57 AM   #17
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

On a ship with 400+ people they'd have plenty of other science officers to fill the position, albeit they would only be lieutenants. It's a false dilemma. It's like... installing a navigator who is an ensign as your new chief engineer or NuSpock's protectionist approach because a junior science officer is prettier than him.. A very clumsy plot device that could have been handled better.

They certainly should not have been using the transporter but getting the ship ready for launch was a priority so they were taking risks that they would not have ordinarily taken.

What's more curious is why the starbase didn't just use their own transporter to deposit them without actively using the receiving pad?
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Old February 20 2014, 03:56 PM   #18
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

gottacook wrote: View Post
DonIago wrote: View Post
IIRC the novelization even notes that Kirk's caught off-guard by the transporter controls having been reconfigured. He's not explicitly blamed for the situation, but there's a suggestion that he didn't make things any better either.
Please let's not bring the novel into this. Then you have to make Kirk's girlfriend Lori (Lori? Really?) one of the victims, which puts a whole new slant on who is responsible for her death. (Perhaps he secretly wanted her dead, and poor Sonak was just collateral damage.).
I take a look about that on Memory-Alpha...ILLOGICAL...Kirk doesn't date older women (she's vice-admiral).
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Old February 20 2014, 05:16 PM   #19
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

Armored Saint wrote: View Post
gottacook wrote: View Post
DonIago wrote: View Post
IIRC the novelization even notes that Kirk's caught off-guard by the transporter controls having been reconfigured. He's not explicitly blamed for the situation, but there's a suggestion that he didn't make things any better either.
Please let's not bring the novel into this. Then you have to make Kirk's girlfriend Lori (Lori? Really?) one of the victims, which puts a whole new slant on who is responsible for her death. (Perhaps he secretly wanted her dead, and poor Sonak was just collateral damage.).
I take a look about that on Memory-Alpha...ILLOGICAL...Kirk doesn't date older women (she's vice-admiral).
Lori was Kirk ex-wife. (in the novelisation anyway).
How many guys would want to get rid of their ex - and had the opportunity
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Old February 23 2014, 04:46 AM   #20
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

Armored Saint wrote: View Post
gottacook wrote: View Post
The color fotonovel of TMP (i.e., Star Trek The Motion Picture The Photostory, edited by Richard J. Anobile) omits the scene entirely, and it was a good choice to do so.
But what happens to Sonak? Is he totally erased of the story, so, they didn't have any science officer?
I found my copy. The name Sonak isn't mentioned; neither is the rank of science officer, until Kirk tells Ilia that Decker is "our Exec and Science Officer."
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Old February 25 2014, 08:40 PM   #21
Captrek
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

It never occurred to me that Kirk's presence in Engineering contributed to the accident.

I have always felt that there's something that Kirk did to contribute to the accident, but it may have been necessary. Sonak and Scotty and both told him that the Enterprise could not be ready in less than 20 hours, and he ordered that the 20-hour job be completed in 12 hours no matter what it took. When you force people to take shortcuts, accidents will happen.

The wormhole was also Kirk's fault, in the same sense. It's debatable whether Kirk was right or wrong to push so hard, but that pushing contributed to the wormhole and possibly to the transporter accident.
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Old February 26 2014, 02:26 PM   #22
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

I've always been amused by Rand's look when Kirk tells her it's not her fault. I've always interpreted it as a private "you're damn right it wasn't my fault and I don't need you patronizing me either".

Another thing, when McCoy beams up he asks permission to come on board. A female voice says "Granted". Was that supposed to be Rand's voice? It almost sounds like an automatic response.

Finally, I would have also loved to see McCoy acknowledge that Rand is in the transporter room instead of just waking about complaining about engineers. He probably hasn't seen her in years!
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Old February 26 2014, 02:46 PM   #23
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

Armored Saint wrote: View Post
Kirk doesn't date older women (she's vice-admiral).
Except for Ruth from Shore Leave, a good 10-15 years older than he.
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Old February 26 2014, 04:22 PM   #24
Robert Comsol
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

pfontaine2 wrote: View Post
Finally, I would have also loved to see McCoy acknowledge that Rand is in the transporter room instead of just waking about complaining about engineers. He probably hasn't seen her in years!
Very good observation!

If there is one major issue I'm having with TMP it's that our protagonists act rather like automatons than living human beings.

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Old February 26 2014, 04:58 PM   #25
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

Hey, if you're going to take on a giant digitizing automaton, who better to engage it than a ship of automatons?
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Old February 26 2014, 07:12 PM   #26
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post
pfontaine2 wrote: View Post
Finally, I would have also loved to see McCoy acknowledge that Rand is in the transporter room instead of just waking about complaining about engineers. He probably hasn't seen her in years!
Very good observation!

If there is one major issue I'm having with TMP it's that our protagonists act rather like automatons than living human beings.

Bob
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Maybe he doesn't recognize her.
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Old February 26 2014, 11:56 PM   #27
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

It's a ridiculous and false statement to say the crew act like automatons. Kirk is initially testy and obsessed. Bones is curmudgeonly as ever. Decker is frustrated, Spock is the only one who's "automaton" like, but that's part of the story. Sure, at first the crew don't act like they did on the series, but getting back to that place is rather the point, no?
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Old February 27 2014, 08:51 AM   #28
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

gottacook wrote: View Post
DonIago wrote: View Post
IIRC the novelization even notes that Kirk's caught off-guard by the transporter controls having been reconfigured. He's not explicitly blamed for the situation, but there's a suggestion that he didn't make things any better either.
Please let's not bring the novel into this. Then you have to make Kirk's girlfriend Lori (Lori? Really?) one of the victims, which puts a whole new slant on who is responsible for her death. (Perhaps he secretly wanted her dead, and poor Sonak was just collateral damage.)

The world is a poorer place for novelist Roddenberry not having had a decent editor to show him, gently, why a super-overabundance of words in italics is not a good idea.
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Old February 27 2014, 01:01 PM   #29
Robert Comsol
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

Maurice wrote: View Post
It's a ridiculous and false statement to say the crew act like automatons.
Oh my goodness, since when is an opinion a "false statement"?
Regardless how much I love and cherish TMP, the acting is rather "stiff" and the long looks, pauses and gestures (sometimes close to pathetic) were probably supposed to say more than a thousand words but weren't really successful in doing so, in my opinion.

In contrast, and despite its many plotholes, ST VI-TUC delivers much better and credible character interactions in the tradition of TOS, in my opinion.

Bob
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Old February 27 2014, 07:19 PM   #30
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Re: Does Kirk Contribute to the Transporter Accident in TMP?

I don't think the rampant retro-prejudices evinced in TUC resemble much of TOS at all, except for when the crew get possessed by alien energy beings or they get some bad apple on board. You can find exceptions to this, but in the main, Kirk & co don't regress to our level all that often without something weird triggering it.

I finally settled in with being able to enjoy TUC after a long spell of despising it, but it is only in the same way that I could enjoy a Bantam or Pocket novel that took enormous liberties with what we'd seen on TV ... oh, they're really THAT military now? I'm thinking of a bad Bantam novel where Kirk is annoyed by an underling and Kirk demands he salute him. That's Elaan-level assholiness.
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