RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 138,959
Posts: 5,391,446
Members: 24,722
Currently online: 473
Newest member: Jadakiss

TrekToday headlines

Forbes Cast In Powers
By: T'Bonz on Aug 22

Dorn To Voice Firefly Character
By: T'Bonz on Aug 22

No ALS Ice Bucket For Saldana
By: T'Bonz on Aug 22

Free Star Trek Trexels Game
By: T'Bonz on Aug 22

New Trek-themed Bobble Heads
By: T'Bonz on Aug 21

IDW Publishing November Trek Comic
By: T'Bonz on Aug 20

Pegg/Wright Trilogy In The Works
By: T'Bonz on Aug 20

Star Trek: The Compendium Rebate Details
By: T'Bonz on Aug 20

Gold Key Archives Volume 2
By: T'Bonz on Aug 19

Takei Documentary Wins Award
By: T'Bonz on Aug 19


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Doctor Who

Doctor Who "Bigger on the inside..."

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old January 29 2014, 02:05 AM   #1
Shaka Zulu
Fleet Captain
 
Location: Bulawayo Military Krral
Who-Mongeneous

The title refers to this article about the lack of diversity in the casting of the new Doctor, and how its fans that are of color feel about that:

Nearly two decades have passed since I first watched the show, but on the occasion of its 50th anniversary, to my eyes, the show looked a bit… like 1980s Northern California. “The Day of the Doctor,” the episode marking the special occasion, was simulcast globally in 94 countries, an official Guinness World Record. So why was so little of the world in it? I had expected the diversity of the audience to be reflected on the screen, but instead the episode seemed Anglo in every dimension.
I monitored #DoctorWho50th on Twitter but couldn’t find many people of color livetweeting the simulcast. The few that did seemed to have “the feels” like everyone else. No one mentioned race. With Matt Smith’s tenure in the title role ending on Wednesday, I turned to Facebook to find more Whovians: friends, friends-of-friends, and strangers, mostly Americans, mostly people of color. What did they think about the whitewashed “Day of the Doctor”?


The most strident objection came from Nathan Taylor, who is himself white: “The 50th was a fun show. But damn it was white! Seriously, like 90 seconds of aggregate POC screen time at most, and no speaking roles? Really, BBC?”


*“Part of the reason that I have taken a break from the show is how it handles women and race,” the blogger Whiskeypants, who identifies as multiracial Jewish, wrote. “Part of me really wants to keep watching and enjoying, and part of me wants to stop being so damned disappointed in it.”
*Tanya Merchant, who is white, explained, “I dislike the Clara choice so much that I still haven’t watched her portion of season seven in full. I’m willing to give the 13th doctor a chance, but I would like to see more diversity across categories—more queer representation, different roles for women besides ingénue pixie dream girl, more people of color, people with diverse body types, different faiths (how about a non-exoticized Pakistani companion?).”
*M. Lau, an Asian-Australian, articulated the dangers of an ever-shifting competition: “If Doctor Who doesn’t diversify, I have zero intention of starting it up again. I’m time-poor, and I would rather spend my time and effort and money on shows that aren’t 99 percent white (see Elementary, or Person of Interest, or Sleepy Hollow). There’s so much whitewashing/erasure, or colourface, or stereotyping, that I’m not bothering with shows that don’t even attempt some degree of intersectionality.”
Who-Mongeneous
Shaka Zulu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 29 2014, 04:11 AM   #2
MissionFever
Ensign
 
Re: Who-Mongeneous

Didn't we just do this?

http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=233698
MissionFever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 31 2014, 05:16 PM   #3
inflatabledalek
Captain
 
Re: Who-Mongeneous

The complaint about the show being too "Anglo" is a bizarre one, why watch a British TV show if you don't want it to be very... well British?

EDIT: Duh, ignore that, brain fart over what the person being quoted meant by "Anglo", even though it should have been really obvious... It coming after mentioning the rest of the world may have softened my mind a bit, but it should not have done nearly enough to get me as confused as it did.[/EDIT]

No problems here with the casting of an non-white Doctor (my long standing, though perhaps dull as I was mildly surprised to find out when Eccles left how may people felt the same, choice of Patterson Joseph might still be in with a shot now they've gone for an older actor again), but I felt this time round a lot of the people who were really enthusiastic about the idea came across not so much being in favour of non-white casting and more really against the idea of any series staring a white British guy. Which makes you wonder how they put up with a show staring a white British guy for long enough to become a fan of it.

My only real criteria with Doctor casting (and I'll admit it's an arbitrary one), is they be British. It's pretty much the one BIG ongoing UK SF franchise* and it would be nice, if not desperately essential, if that were reflected in the casting of the main lead.











*Someone is going to name 10 I've forgotten now aren't they?
__________________
TRANSFORMATION: JIM'LL FIX IT
Wreck-Gar's attempt at a pop-culture reference goes badly wrong in my look at: Hunters Part 1
inflatabledalek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 31 2014, 05:28 PM   #4
Starkers
Admiral
 
Starkers's Avatar
 
Location: Paddling...
Re: Who-Mongeneous

Well you could maybe make an argument for Red Dwarf as well in terms of an ongoing franchise I guess, a show with two black leads.

I was always a big advocate of Paterson Joseph too
__________________
Werewolves on the Moon Now with Guardians of the Galaxy review

The Devils of Amber Street
Starkers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 31 2014, 06:10 PM   #5
O'Dib
Commodore
 
O'Dib's Avatar
 
Location: Mr. Brody's still
Re: Who-Mongeneous

Shaka Zulu wrote: View Post
The title refers to this article about the lack of diversity in the casting of the new Doctor, and how its fans that are of color feel about that:
It also appears to refer to mongs, which is a whole different kind of offensive.
__________________
Ee'd plebnista, norkohn forkohn perfectunun
O'Dib is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 31 2014, 06:38 PM   #6
Mr. Adventure
Admiral
 
Mr. Adventure's Avatar
 
Location: Mr. Adventure
Re: Who-Mongeneous

I don't know, who's ever heard of a Pakistani doctor? Might be stretching credibility.
Mr. Adventure is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 31 2014, 07:00 PM   #7
MacLeod
Admiral
 
Location: Great Britain
Re: Who-Mongeneous

To be somehwat fair to DW given it's a British show and the demographic of the UK is something like 87% white, 13% others.

So the question is it a fair reflection of the UK?

There is nothing wrong with making the Doctor female and/or non-white but it must be done for the right reason(s).
__________________
On the continent of wild endeavour in the mountains of solace and solitude there stood the citadel of the time lords, the oldest and most mighty race in the universe looking down on the galaxies below sworn never to interfere only to watch.
MacLeod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 3 2014, 02:23 AM   #8
14thDoctor
Rear Admiral
 
14thDoctor's Avatar
 
Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: Who-Mongeneous

The Moffat era lacks diversity?

What about the Scottish companion? (Just because she's white, doesn't mean she's not a minority.)

Or the male nurse? (Challenging gender roles, y'all.)

Or the lesbian interracial (interspecies?) couple?

Or their asexual brown skinned companion?

Or Dorium? (Thin privilege. It's a thing.)

Or Rita? (Indian and Muslim)

Or the Van Baalen brothers?

Or Hila Tacorian?

Or Liz 10?

Or Guido and Isabella, the black Venetians?

Or Doctor Nasreen Chaudhry? (Indian and over 40. Age privilege. It's also a thing.)

Or The Emperor? (Height privilege. Google it.)

Or that submarine full of Russians?

Or Queen Nefertiti?

Or Colonel Runaway?

Or "Mels?"

Or even Hitler?
__________________
http://www.wordforge.net
14thDoctor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 3 2014, 02:56 AM   #9
Count Zero
Yeah, I know...
 
Count Zero's Avatar
 
Location: Land of Awesome
Re: Who-Mongeneous

The article erroneously claims that there isn't any POC in a speaking role in "Day of the Doctor". While it is indeed very white the Time Lord who works closely with the leader of the War Council is black. Apparently, he's called Androgar although I don't think he's named on screen. However, it is definetely a speaking role.
__________________
"Now and then we had a hope that if we lived and were good, God would permit us to be pirates." Mark Twain, Life on the Mississippi
Count Zero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 3 2014, 03:21 AM   #10
14thDoctor
Rear Admiral
 
14thDoctor's Avatar
 
Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: Who-Mongeneous

Count Zero wrote: View Post
The article erroneously claims that there isn't any POC in a speaking role in "Day of the Doctor". While it is indeed very white the Time Lord who works closely with the leader of the War Council is black. Apparently, he's called Androgar although I don't think he's named on screen. However, it is definetely a speaking role.
The same folks in the OP's article who complain about a lack of diversity seem to feel that that example of diversity is insufficient.

And Mickey doesn't count, since he started out flawed.

And Martha doesn't count, either because she wasn't flawed enough, or because the Doctor didn't treat her exactly like he did Rose.


And the two of them getting married is a travesty, because if two black characters get married, it must be because they're black. Not because they've both travelled with the Doctor and seen and done things few other people could relate to. Not because they could have bonded over not being appreciated by Rose and the Doctor. Not because they both appeared destined to join Torchwood after Journeys End, at which point they'd have been the only single people on the team, working closely together in a new city where they don't really know anyone else... Nah, it has to be the colour of their skin that led to them connecting. That must be it.
__________________
http://www.wordforge.net
14thDoctor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 3 2014, 03:38 AM   #11
The Wormhole
Admiral
 
The Wormhole's Avatar
 
Re: Who-Mongeneous

14thDoctor wrote: View Post
The Moffat era lacks diversity?

What about the Scottish companion? (Just because she's white, doesn't mean she's not a minority.)

Or the male nurse? (Challenging gender roles, y'all.)

Or the lesbian interracial (interspecies?) couple?

Or their asexual brown skinned companion?

Or Dorium? (Thin privilege. It's a thing.)

Or Rita? (Indian and Muslim)

Or the Van Baalen brothers?

Or Hila Tacorian?

Or Liz 10?

Or Guido and Isabella, the black Venetians?

Or Doctor Nasreen Chaudhry? (Indian and over 40. Age privilege. It's also a thing.)

Or The Emperor? (Height privilege. Google it.)

Or that submarine full of Russians?

Or Queen Nefertiti?

Or Colonel Runaway?

Or "Mels?"

Or even Hitler?
You forgot the Indian Space Agency from Dinosaurs on a Spaceship. And since you mention Hitler, that episode also features many other German characters. In fact pretty much all the guest characters aside from the Tesselecta crew are German. And then there's the black Secret Service agent in The Impossible Astronaut.
__________________
"Internet message boards aren't as funny today as they were ten years ago. I've stopped reading new posts." -The Simpsons 20th anniversary special.
The Wormhole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 3 2014, 03:46 AM   #12
Nerys Myk
Fleet Admiral
 
Nerys Myk's Avatar
 
Location: House of Kang, now with ridges
Re: Who-Mongeneous

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
14thDoctor wrote: View Post
The Moffat era lacks diversity?

What about the Scottish companion? (Just because she's white, doesn't mean she's not a minority.)

Or the male nurse? (Challenging gender roles, y'all.)

Or the lesbian interracial (interspecies?) couple?

Or their asexual brown skinned companion?

Or Dorium? (Thin privilege. It's a thing.)

Or Rita? (Indian and Muslim)

Or the Van Baalen brothers?

Or Hila Tacorian?

Or Liz 10?

Or Guido and Isabella, the black Venetians?

Or Doctor Nasreen Chaudhry? (Indian and over 40. Age privilege. It's also a thing.)

Or The Emperor? (Height privilege. Google it.)

Or that submarine full of Russians?

Or Queen Nefertiti?

Or Colonel Runaway?

Or "Mels?"

Or even Hitler?
You forgot the Indian Space Agency from Dinosaurs on a Spaceship. And since you mention Hitler, that episode also features many other German characters. In fact pretty much all the guest characters aside from the Tesselecta crew are German. And then there's the black Secret Service agent in The Impossible Astronaut.
And the Gay FBI agent.
__________________
The boring one, the one with Khan, the one where Spock returns, the one with whales, the dumb one, the last one, the one with Kirk, the one with the Borg, the stupid one, the bad one, the new one, the other one with Khan.
Nerys Myk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 3 2014, 04:03 AM   #13
14thDoctor
Rear Admiral
 
14thDoctor's Avatar
 
Location: Edmonton, Canada
Re: Who-Mongeneous

Nerys Myk wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post
14thDoctor wrote: View Post
The Moffat era lacks diversity?

What about the Scottish companion? (Just because she's white, doesn't mean she's not a minority.)

Or the male nurse? (Challenging gender roles, y'all.)

Or the lesbian interracial (interspecies?) couple?

Or their asexual brown skinned companion?

Or Dorium? (Thin privilege. It's a thing.)

Or Rita? (Indian and Muslim)

Or the Van Baalen brothers?

Or Hila Tacorian?

Or Liz 10?

Or Guido and Isabella, the black Venetians?

Or Doctor Nasreen Chaudhry? (Indian and over 40. Age privilege. It's also a thing.)

Or The Emperor? (Height privilege. Google it.)

Or that submarine full of Russians?

Or Queen Nefertiti?

Or Colonel Runaway?

Or "Mels?"

Or even Hitler?
You forgot the Indian Space Agency from Dinosaurs on a Spaceship. And since you mention Hitler, that episode also features many other German characters. In fact pretty much all the guest characters aside from the Tesselecta crew are German. And then there's the black Secret Service agent in The Impossible Astronaut.
And the Gay FBI agent.
With his unseen black fiancé!

And the black Preacher from A Town Called Mercy.

And the black crash "survivor" from Asylum of the Daleks.

And Angie and Artie, who were basically regulars for half a season.



But no, the Moffat era isn't diverse at all.
__________________
http://www.wordforge.net
14thDoctor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 3 2014, 05:04 PM   #14
The Wormhole
Admiral
 
The Wormhole's Avatar
 
Re: Who-Mongeneous

14thDoctor wrote: View Post
And the black Preacher from A Town Called Mercy.
Same episode also features a transsexual horse ("He prefers to be called Susan and asks that you respect his life choices"). Yes, that counts.
__________________
"Internet message boards aren't as funny today as they were ten years ago. I've stopped reading new posts." -The Simpsons 20th anniversary special.
The Wormhole is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:50 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.