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Old January 23 2014, 10:18 PM   #1
Tyberius
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Threshold

I was watching Threshold the other night.

In the opening scenes, Tom is piloting the shuttle, while Torres and Kim are running mission control.

At the end of the scene, we discover that the Tom is really on the holodeck.

Is there a real shuttle out in space that Tom is piloting through the holographic interface? If not, how does the computer know what kind of stresses that a warp 10 flight would produce? And if it was purely holographic, why couldn't Tom ask the computer for the fix instead of Neelix? In TNG, when there are unknowns, the holodeck doesn't give back information (Elementary, Dear Data).

On the whole, I didn't think it was too bad an episode. Sure you had some goofy Newts, but, TNG had some weird (de)evolution with Genesis and that was a pretty cool episode. What killed it for me was the Newt Puppet Paris and Janeway. The Newt babies looked good to me.

Sad to see Paris pining for Kes, especially when he is working so closely with B'Elanna. Janeway cockblocks him though.
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Old January 24 2014, 12:35 AM   #2
Guy Gardener
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Re: Threshold

It wasn't the unpredictable stress of sustaining warp 10, it was the known stress of approaching warp 10 and the transwarp threshold as the 9.99 recurring, recurs deeper into the decimal places as they are still flying geometrically faster every second and yet never getting within kissing distance of Warp 10.

They just assumed that once they got to warp 10, that every thing would be cool because the Borg arn't too bothered by the effort when they're scooning around at Warp 10.
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Old January 25 2014, 10:45 PM   #3
C.E. Evans
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Re: Threshold

Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
It wasn't the unpredictable stress of sustaining warp 10, it was the known stress of approaching warp 10 and the transwarp threshold as the 9.99 recurring, recurs deeper into the decimal places as they are still flying geometrically faster every second and yet never getting within kissing distance of Warp 10.

They just assumed that once they got to warp 10, that every thing would be cool because the Borg arn't too bothered by the effort when they're scooning around at Warp 10.
The Borg used a different kind of drive system, one that utilized a network of transwarp conduits that aren't too unlike wormholes (aside from the Voyager using one to ultimately get back home, the Enterprise-D also used one to briefly visit the Delta Quadrant in TNG's "Descent" two parter).
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Old January 26 2014, 08:59 AM   #4
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Re: Threshold

Do you really think Tom would have thought about the Borg at all in Threshold?

You know how the Federation welcomes youngling races who figure out Warp into the Galactic community with a warm hand shake?

Janeway should have been worried that someone would be attracted by their transwarp experiments or their slipstream experiments or their enhanced warp drive experiments from Course: Oblivion, just like the Traveller got a woody when he say how tight Wesley's potential was in that boy geniuses catsuit.
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Last edited by Guy Gardener; January 26 2014 at 09:10 AM.
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Old January 27 2014, 01:21 AM   #5
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Re: Threshold

Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
just like the Traveller got a woody when he say how tight Wesley's potential was in that boy geniuses catsuit.
Yep. Neelix and the Traveller, just riding around in their panel van, handing out free candy.
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Old January 27 2014, 01:28 AM   #6
Guy Gardener
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Re: Threshold

I need to learn how to type without fucking up every other wodr.
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Old January 28 2014, 07:07 AM   #7
Ro_Laren
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Re: Threshold

What I don't get about this episode is that in one scene they mention that the Doctor did a physical exam on Paris and the results showed that because of some physical ailment there was a big chance that the Warp 10 shuttle trip would kill Paris. Once Captain Janeway learned that the trip would likely kill Tom, she told him that someone else would have to pilot the shuttle. But after he said, "pretty please Captain, let me pilot the shuttle" she basically says, "well, okay, I guess you can!" It didn't seem like Janeway to just let Tom risk his life because he really wanted to be the test pilot. On a side note, if someone else flew the shuttle and the test flight had proved that it was safe to fly Warp 10 I wonder what Captain Janeway would have done with Paris if there was a 100% chance that it would kill him. Would she have left him somewhere in the Delta Quadrant or hope that the Doc was wrong and let Paris stay on the ship as they flew at Warp 10 back to the Alpha Quadrant.
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Old January 28 2014, 07:53 AM   #8
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Re: Threshold

JANEWAY: I've just spoken to the Doctor, and it's his opinion that we let Ensign Kim make the test flight.
PARIS: May I ask why?
JANEWAY: He checked over your biometric readings from the shuttle simulations. He says you have a slight enzymatic imbalance in your cerebellum.
PARIS: So?
JANEWAY: I know it doesn't sound like much, but he can't predict what'll happen when you cross the threshold. He believes there's a small chance that you could suffer a brain haemorrhage under the subspace stress.
PARIS: How big a chance?
JANEWAY: Two percent.
PARIS: Two percent? I'll take that chance.
JANEWAY: There's no reason to. Ensign Kim is capable of piloting the shuttle for this mission.
PARIS: Yeah, he's capable. That's not the point.
JANEWAY: What is the point, Mister Paris?
PARIS: Well, it's hard to explain, but this is my flight.
JANEWAY: Your flight?
PARIS: When I was a boy, my father used to tell me that I was special, that one day I'd do something significant. My teachers at school, all the kids, everyone used to say, Tom Paris is going to do something important when he grows up. Obviously, that didn't happen.
JANEWAY: This isn't about personal redemption. We're talking about medical risk. Your life could be in danger, and we need you.
PARIS: Captain, this is the first time in ten years I feel I have a life to risk.
JANEWAY: You're sure about this?
PARIS: Captain, I've never been so sure about anything. Please. Please let me make the flight.
JANEWAY: Good luck, Lieutenant.
How long could you drink %2 beer before you got tipsy, or %2 milk before you got a huge ass?

Hmmm?

So really after it happened once, it had really been been a %2 chance that it would happen to him every time he went to transwarp?

Over the course of the show I can think of at least 4 other times Tom went to transwarp, even if a transwarp conduit is like a Faraday cage protecting passengers from all the weird freaky shit that happens in outer transwarp space.

Did they have to reverse this Salamander metamorphosis happening to him every time he went to transwarp, or did the Doctor figure out an inoculation that he had to take once a month for just in case?
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Old January 28 2014, 04:47 PM   #9
Tyberius
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Re: Threshold

Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
JANEWAY: I've just spoken to the Doctor, and it's his opinion that we let Ensign Kim make the test flight.
PARIS: May I ask why?
JANEWAY: He checked over your biometric readings from the shuttle simulations. He says you have a slight enzymatic imbalance in your cerebellum.
PARIS: So?
JANEWAY: I know it doesn't sound like much, but he can't predict what'll happen when you cross the threshold. He believes there's a small chance that you could suffer a brain haemorrhage under the subspace stress.
PARIS: How big a chance?
JANEWAY: Two percent.
PARIS: Two percent? I'll take that chance.
JANEWAY: There's no reason to. Ensign Kim is capable of piloting the shuttle for this mission.
PARIS: Yeah, he's capable. That's not the point.
JANEWAY: What is the point, Mister Paris?
PARIS: Well, it's hard to explain, but this is my flight.
JANEWAY: Your flight?
PARIS: When I was a boy, my father used to tell me that I was special, that one day I'd do something significant. My teachers at school, all the kids, everyone used to say, Tom Paris is going to do something important when he grows up. Obviously, that didn't happen.
JANEWAY: This isn't about personal redemption. We're talking about medical risk. Your life could be in danger, and we need you.
PARIS: Captain, this is the first time in ten years I feel I have a life to risk.
JANEWAY: You're sure about this?
PARIS: Captain, I've never been so sure about anything. Please. Please let me make the flight.
JANEWAY: Good luck, Lieutenant.
How long could you drink %2 beer before you got tipsy, or %2 milk before you got a huge ass?

Hmmm?

So really after it happened once, it had really been been a %2 chance that it would happen to him every time he went to transwarp?

Over the course of the show I can think of at least 4 other times Tom went to transwarp, even if a transwarp conduit is like a Faraday cage protecting passengers from all the weird freaky shit that happens in outer transwarp space.

Did they have to reverse this Salamander metamorphosis happening to him every time he went to transwarp, or did the Doctor figure out an inoculation that he had to take once a month for just in case?

Obviously, the Salamander metamorphosis was not limited solely to Paris, so some extra shielding must have been put into place, or the Doctor just inoculated everybody as needed.
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Old January 28 2014, 05:09 PM   #10
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Re: Threshold

The biggest question is why didn't they use the tech to get home, the EMH wouldn't have been affected and could have told Starfleet Medical how to reverse the side-effects.
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Old January 28 2014, 05:55 PM   #11
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Re: Threshold

MacLeod wrote: View Post
The biggest question is why didn't they use the tech to get home, the EMH wouldn't have been affected and could have told Starfleet Medical how to reverse the side-effects.
My suggestion is that perhaps not everyone could have been desalamanderized.

If the Doctor told had Janeway that a third of the crew wouldn't survive desalamanderization, then she'd have rejected trying.
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Old January 28 2014, 05:58 PM   #12
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Re: Threshold

^True, but shouldn't they have included that in the episode.
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Old January 28 2014, 06:00 PM   #13
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Re: Threshold

MacLeod wrote: View Post
^True, but shouldn't they have included that in the episode.
Yep.
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Old January 28 2014, 07:22 PM   #14
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Re: Threshold

CorporalCaptain wrote: View Post
MacLeod wrote: View Post
^True, but shouldn't they have included that in the episode.
Yep.
Now I'm picturing one of the below-decks crew hearing the one-third risk of permanent salamanderization and piping up, ``Well, that's okay, Cap'n, I like salamanders!'' And then everybody feels awkward being around him.
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Old January 28 2014, 07:57 PM   #15
Guy Gardener
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Re: Threshold

They couldn't navigate at transwarp.

Try driving a race car with cut breaks and no steering wheel.

If they had to send the Doctor, it would have been months later, or even years later after they had figured out how to plot a course in a straightish line to Earth.
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