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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old January 23 2014, 01:02 AM   #31
Pauln6
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

'The Centre of the Galaxy' was the name of the bar in that system It's actually the third system on the left past Laurentia.
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Old February 1 2014, 12:10 PM   #32
Shaka Zulu
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
If the Enterprise NX-01 could make it to Kronos in 4 days at warp 5 in "Broken Bow", then a century later the NCC-1701 at it's very top speed (which is warp 8 or more) could make it in a day in ID.
THIS.

Also, I presume that the Enterprise was travelling at warp 9.95 and that this was an urgent mission that required the higher warp speed.

Crazy Eddie wrote: View Post
STV was a piece of crap, but I'm not convinced it was badly written. Quite the contrary, I think it was extraordinarily well written and had a lot of potential as a story.

It was just badly DIRECTED.
The movie would have worked better if the Excelsior class had been the ship used for the Enterprise instead of the Constitution class; maybe a residual bit of transwarp tech could have been used as a way to get to the 'center of the galaxy'.

Or maybe the movie was shit after all?

Last edited by Shaka Zulu; February 1 2014 at 12:28 PM.
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Old February 2 2014, 02:34 AM   #33
Kelthaz
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
If the Enterprise NX-01 could make it to Kronos in 4 days at warp 5 in "Broken Bow", then a century later the NCC-1701 at it's very top speed (which is warp 8 or more) could make it in a day in ID.
Yeah, but both of those events are dumb.

Personally, I think that, instead of Khan going to Qo'noS, he should have traveled to a Klingon border world of little strategic interest. This solves so many problems.

- No instantaneous warping between the Klingon and Federation home worlds.
- No explanation needed for why the Klingons have pitiful defenses on their homebase and no defenses in orbit.
- No super fast starships.
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Old February 2 2014, 10:19 AM   #34
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

drt wrote: View Post
Each new production team has always thrown the previous under the bus, starting with Rodenberry himself and TMP (the novelization of which suggests that the original series was an over-dramatization of Kirk's five year mission).
I'd be very curious to hear more about this.
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Old February 2 2014, 10:31 AM   #35
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

Kelthaz wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
If the Enterprise NX-01 could make it to Kronos in 4 days at warp 5 in "Broken Bow", then a century later the NCC-1701 at it's very top speed (which is warp 8 or more) could make it in a day in ID.
Yeah, but both of those events are dumb.

Personally, I think that, instead of Khan going to Qo'noS, he should have traveled to a Klingon border world of little strategic interest. This solves so many problems.

- No instantaneous warping between the Klingon and Federation home worlds.
- No explanation needed for why the Klingons have pitiful defenses on their homebase and no defenses in orbit.
- No super fast starships.
A lot of Trek's problems could be resolved with minor tweakes like this but the bottom line is that space is vast and if we don't want our characters to spend weeks in pursuit of a travelling vessel, all fights have to take place at impulse in one location. Trek writers don't really like that.
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Old February 2 2014, 11:49 AM   #36
King Daniel Into Darkness
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

RCAM wrote: View Post
drt wrote: View Post
Each new production team has always thrown the previous under the bus, starting with Rodenberry himself and TMP (the novelization of which suggests that the original series was an over-dramatization of Kirk's five year mission).
I'd be very curious to hear more about this.

Here's the relevant section from the preface to Gene Roddenberry's novelization of Star Trek: The Motion Picture (supposedly the words of Admiral Kirk, writing in the first person)


Unfortunately, Starfleet's enthusiasm affected even those who chronicled our adventures, and we were painted somewhat larger than life, especially myself.

Eventually, I found that I had been fictionalized into some sort of "modern Ulysses" and it has been painful to see my command decisions of those years so widely applauded, whereas the plain facts are that ninety-four of our crew met violent deaths during those years - and many of them would still be alive if I had acted either more quickly or more wisely. Nor have I been as foolishly courageous as depicted. I have never happily invited injury; I have disliked in the extreme every duty circumstance which has required me to risk my life. But there appears to be something in the nature of depicters of popular events which leads them into the habit of exaggeration. As a result, I have become determined that if I ever again found myself involved in an affair attracting public attention, I would insist that some way be found to tell the story more accurately.

(P. 7-8)
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Old February 2 2014, 06:34 PM   #37
Kelthaz
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

Pauln6 wrote: View Post
Kelthaz wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
If the Enterprise NX-01 could make it to Kronos in 4 days at warp 5 in "Broken Bow", then a century later the NCC-1701 at it's very top speed (which is warp 8 or more) could make it in a day in ID.
Yeah, but both of those events are dumb.

Personally, I think that, instead of Khan going to Qo'noS, he should have traveled to a Klingon border world of little strategic interest. This solves so many problems.

- No instantaneous warping between the Klingon and Federation home worlds.
- No explanation needed for why the Klingons have pitiful defenses on their homebase and no defenses in orbit.
- No super fast starships.
A lot of Trek's problems could be resolved with minor tweakes like this but the bottom line is that space is vast and if we don't want our characters to spend weeks in pursuit of a travelling vessel, all fights have to take place at impulse in one location. Trek writers don't really like that.
I agree that ships moving at the speed of plot is a perfectly acceptable use of dramatic license, but the complete lack of Klingon defenses around their home planet was a major issue that took me out of the movie. A Klingon border planet with no strategic interest would have fixed both of these problems.
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Old February 2 2014, 10:49 PM   #38
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

Kelthaz wrote: View Post
Pauln6 wrote: View Post
Kelthaz wrote: View Post

Yeah, but both of those events are dumb.

Personally, I think that, instead of Khan going to Qo'noS, he should have traveled to a Klingon border world of little strategic interest. This solves so many problems.

- No instantaneous warping between the Klingon and Federation home worlds.
- No explanation needed for why the Klingons have pitiful defenses on their homebase and no defenses in orbit.
- No super fast starships.
A lot of Trek's problems could be resolved with minor tweakes like this but the bottom line is that space is vast and if we don't want our characters to spend weeks in pursuit of a travelling vessel, all fights have to take place at impulse in one location. Trek writers don't really like that.
I agree that ships moving at the speed of plot is a perfectly acceptable use of dramatic license, but the complete lack of Klingon defenses around their home planet was a major issue that took me out of the movie. A Klingon border planet with no strategic interest would have fixed both of these problems.
The novelization (and apparently the script) suggest that Enterprise dropped out of warp behind one of Qo'nos' moons and was hiding there from those very same defenses. It's subtly implied that even the Enterprise crew is surprised at how lax those defenses really are; OTOH, if that's really Praxis breaking up in orbit, it's probably understandable.

If Enterprise is equipped with transwarp drive -- and it very much appears to be -- it could just be a matter of the ship being too fast for Klingon sensors to track it.
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Old February 2 2014, 11:14 PM   #39
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

Speaking "in universe" it doesn't require an "explanation". Clearly the ships in Abrams' Trek move at the same speed as they do in all other forms of Trek--speed of plot. Moreover, even IF (and only for the sake of discussion--I refuse to acknowledge a "need" to do so) the ships in current Trek are far faster than in any previous iteration, it still does NOT require an "explanation". If every other piece of tech that differs between TOS and the Abrams' Trek films can be "explained" by the divergent timeline (and that is certainly how we are supposed to read those differences), then faster travel time is just part and parcel of the whole. No need to re-write the story, spend 10 mins. of valuable screen time giving us a "talking heads" expository screen pointing out the different types of propulsion systems (yawn) between TOS and current Trek... It takes however long it takes for the ships to get where they are going. One is certainly free to complain that things are "faster" for all sorts of reasons (story pacing, aesthetic choice of making galaxy seem smaller and less wondrous, etc.). But storytelling devices never require "explanation". They are simply part of the story.
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Old February 2 2014, 11:22 PM   #40
King Daniel Into Darkness
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

Kelthaz wrote: View Post
Pauln6 wrote: View Post
Kelthaz wrote: View Post

Yeah, but both of those events are dumb.

Personally, I think that, instead of Khan going to Qo'noS, he should have traveled to a Klingon border world of little strategic interest. This solves so many problems.

- No instantaneous warping between the Klingon and Federation home worlds.
- No explanation needed for why the Klingons have pitiful defenses on their homebase and no defenses in orbit.
- No super fast starships.
A lot of Trek's problems could be resolved with minor tweakes like this but the bottom line is that space is vast and if we don't want our characters to spend weeks in pursuit of a travelling vessel, all fights have to take place at impulse in one location. Trek writers don't really like that.
I agree that ships moving at the speed of plot is a perfectly acceptable use of dramatic license, but the complete lack of Klingon defenses around their home planet was a major issue that took me out of the movie. A Klingon border planet with no strategic interest would have fixed both of these problems.
Their planet appeared to be mid-apocalypse when Kirk and friends arrived. They were evacuating and probably had more important things to worry about than a neutral trade ship entering their airspace.
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Old February 14 2014, 05:01 PM   #41
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

I still think a "Captain's log, we've finally reached Kronos after X days" would have sufficed. Quick, simple, solves whatever issues anyone has with how long space travel is depicted. I think that would have been more preferable to the absurd notion that you can travel between planets at a long distance within 2 mins.
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Old February 19 2014, 04:05 PM   #42
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

MakeshiftPython wrote: View Post
I still think a "Captain's log, we've finally reached Kronos after X days" would have sufficed. Quick, simple, solves whatever issues anyone has with how long space travel is depicted. I think that would have been more preferable to the absurd notion that you can travel between planets at a long distance within 2 mins.
The counter to that notion is that such a scene serves no narrative purpose and exists solely to satisfy some arcane technical need. The time it takes to travel between Earth and the Klingon homeworld is completely irrelevant to the story that was being told. It was rightly left out as a consequence.
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Old February 20 2014, 04:12 AM   #43
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

Quite so.
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Old February 20 2014, 08:35 PM   #44
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

Well, apparently if the display in Adm Marcus's office is any indication (about 00:27 in this video, upper right of chart), looks like the wormhole/transwarp network theory is probably canon for this reality.

Fan-wank: Conventional warp-drive exists, and ships enter the network for high speed travel between certain access points but both called simply "warp drive" in-universe. My guess is a limited section of the Borg/Xindi Network 'discovered' through the data collected from the Narada rather than a locally-made one. Unknown if Starfleet in general knows what the nature of the network is with possible exception of Section 31.
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Old February 21 2014, 12:41 PM   #45
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Re: Theory regarding the super-fast trip from Qo'noS to Earth

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
If the Enterprise NX-01 could make it to Kronos in 4 days at warp 5 in "Broken Bow", then a century later the NCC-1701 at it's very top speed (which is warp 8 or more) could make it in a day in ID.
I like this explanation, it seems very plausible.
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