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Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

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Old December 31 2013, 09:55 PM   #16
Ronald Held
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

I suppose that In the 23d century it would sound like a Scottish accent influenced by Federation Standard.
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Old December 31 2013, 11:04 PM   #17
Kirby
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

Ru ru, chu wrote: View Post
Kirby wrote: View Post
I'm not sure what's worse: Scotty's Scottish accent, or Picard's French accent.
</p>
Picard never HAD a French accent.

He rarely even spoke French.


The character may have been French, but obviously spoke with an English accent, just like the actor. Seems simple enough...
My comment was largely tongue-in-cheek. One of the first TNG episodes I believe Data referred to French as a dead language or something like that, so it's entirely possible the English accent took over for French. Also, Scotty's accent may be normal for his region 200 years from now. I'm sure that lots of accents from around the world have changed over the past 200 years, and see no reason why they wouldn't be changed further in another 200 years.
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Old December 31 2013, 11:15 PM   #18
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

Doh. I thought Pegg was Scottish. My wife right now, God help me, is watching Bedknobs and Broomsticks and the bad Prussian accents are flying.
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Old January 1 2014, 12:48 AM   #19
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

Maurice wrote: View Post
Knowing various Scottish people I'd venture to say it only bears a passing resemblance to actual Scots accents.
I agree.
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Old January 1 2014, 01:05 PM   #20
Lance
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

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Not Trek related, but Daphne's Cockney accent on Frasier is awful. A Brit friend of mine said that she sounds like a Brit, trying to sound American, trying to sound English.
Well, there are two factors in that:

1) Jane Leeves has been living in America for a while, so like Marina Sirtis her accent has slipped a little.

2) Daphne Moon is supposed to be from Manchester, but Leeves herself is from Essex (near London) and largely fails to hide that fact to a keen ear. The thing that makes her sound unconvincing isn't the poor cockney accent, it's that she isn't supposed to be playing cockney!
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Old January 1 2014, 02:07 PM   #21
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

Interestingly, John Mahoney (who played Martin Crane) was born in Manchester but moved to America as a young man and completely lost his Mancunian accent.

Thanks, everyone.
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Old January 1 2014, 02:18 PM   #22
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

I was less concerned with the realism of Scotty's accent, than I was with the realism of Scotty, the character. Whenever he got command of the ship, for example, and especially when faced with an enemy of some sort, he always got so cartoonishly scrappy! I couldn't stand it, really. It just made everything about him, including his accent, come off as extremely fake and lept me out my Suspension of Disbelief, every time. Even in TUC, when he starts freaking out at Valeris for suggesting "they" go to STARFLEET with their theory on what happened there, it just seemed so forced. Doohan wasn't a very good actor ... as evidenced by his thin rsum.
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Old January 1 2014, 03:12 PM   #23
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

I liked Scotty and his character overall, but as things progressed, particularly in the films he became more caricature. After TWOK it's pretty much a downward slide, but it could be spotty after TOS' Season 1.

Chekov's accent was terrible from the get-go. It was simply too much, too forced. I think we've all heard English spoken by actual Russians and they don't sound anything like that.
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Old January 1 2014, 04:06 PM   #24
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

CaptPapa wrote: View Post
yesterday while watching an old Perry Mason episode, I may have heard the world's worst accent on film. The character, as described on film, was supposed to be a Welsh person, but the actor (read generic white TV character actor) was so bad with the accent, it came out as an Indian accent - and a caricature at that.
ME
Probably most viewers have no idea what an authentic Welsh accent is supposed to sound like. I know I don't...
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Old January 1 2014, 04:12 PM   #25
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

plynch wrote: View Post
The world then was full of ethnic humpr done by white guys with cheesy accents. Buddy Ebsen on the Tonight show doing his "classic bit" as a Chinese waiter or something like that. 1966, people were ok with cheesy accents. Like bad disguises on spy shows. Now that we're exposed more in US media to real people from the actual places, the old cheese hasn't aged well. Except Pegg and other true Scots sound wrong to me, raised on the glories of Jimmy Doohan.

(And accents definitely change over time as Doohan asserted. My father in law, born in the US to Finnish parents, goes to Finland and he sounds hilarious to them. In the new country the language ossified as it was in 1890. In hipster Finland, it kept evolving.)
CaptPapa wrote: View Post
I'm not surprised that Scotty's Scots accent was not very authentic - I've also read a number of comments on Chekov's . . . not very good Russian accent.
Among other things, I enjoy old movies and I'm frequently amused by English actors speaking in their native voices, but playing German or French characters. It never seemed to bother them, or the producers.
However, yesterday while watching an old Perry Mason episode, I may have heard the world's worst accent on film. The character, as described on film, was supposed to be a Welsh person, but the actor (read generic white TV character actor) was so bad with the accent, it came out as an Indian accent - and a caricature at that.
ME
There was a Wild Wild West ep I saw a while ago. An evil henchman was supposed to be a cockney sailor. It was clearly an American guy. He had NO accent whatsoever, but he kept saying "Gov-NAH" and "OY!" a lot, so we'd know hoe was English. Oy.

I've been watching a lot of 60s TV the last few years - Mission Impossible, WWW, It Takes a Thief, Five-O, Man and Girl from UNCLE. Anybody playing a foreign agent, whether he's supposed to be from eastern Europe or Latin America, used the same generic faux foreign accent.
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Old January 2 2014, 12:05 AM   #26
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

Maurice wrote: View Post
As I recall (perhaps from the book Chekov's Enterprise), Koenig said his accent was based on Lithuanian grandparents or something, not Russian. I'd have to look it up.
Do Lithuanians turn their V's into W's when they speak English? "Keptin, the alien wessel just wanished!"

Perhaps Walter Koenig had seen bottles of Polish vodka labeled "wdka". But that's Polish.

Among other things, I enjoy old movies and I'm frequently amused by English actors speaking in their native voices, but playing German or French characters. It never seemed to bother them, or the producers.
That's long been an accepted convention of the cinema, like 28-year-old actors playing teenagers. And it's not just old movies. Last night I was watching Hostile Waters, a made-for-cable movie from 1997, in which much of the action takes place aboard a Russian submarine. All the Russian characters speak English with varying degrees of an accent. The actor playing the Russian sub captain spoke American English with no accent at all.

Apparently many producers still feel the viewing audience doesn't want to have to read subtitles.

Forbin wrote: View Post
There was a Wild Wild West ep I saw a while ago. An evil henchman was supposed to be a cockney sailor. It was clearly an American guy. He had NO accent whatsoever, but he kept saying "Gov-NAH" and "OY!" a lot, so we'd know he was English. Oy.
He was a Jewish Cockney?
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Old January 2 2014, 01:23 AM   #27
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

Speaking of movies with Russian sub commanders, how about that one in 1990 in which the commander had a Scottish accent...?
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Old January 2 2014, 06:29 AM   #28
Geoff Peterson
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

Ru ru, chu wrote: View Post
CaptPapa wrote: View Post
yesterday while watching an old Perry Mason episode, I may have heard the world's worst accent on film. The character, as described on film, was supposed to be a Welsh person, but the actor (read generic white TV character actor) was so bad with the accent, it came out as an Indian accent - and a caricature at that.
ME
Probably most viewers have no idea what an authentic Welsh accent is supposed to sound like. I know I don't...
I believe it sounds a bit like gargling.

No Sanity Clause wrote: View Post
Maurice wrote: View Post
As I recall (perhaps from the book Chekov's Enterprise), Koenig said his accent was based on Lithuanian grandparents or something, not Russian. I'd have to look it up.
Do Lithuanians turn their V's into W's when they speak English? "Keptin, the alien wessel just wanished!"

Perhaps Walter Koenig had seen bottles of Polish vodka labeled "wdka". But that's Polish.
The Wiki says his parents were Russian Jews who lived in Lithuania before coming to the USA.
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Old January 2 2014, 06:51 AM   #29
TorontoTrekker
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

Ru ru, chu wrote: View Post
CaptPapa wrote: View Post
yesterday while watching an old Perry Mason episode, I may have heard the world's worst accent on film. The character, as described on film, was supposed to be a Welsh person, but the actor (read generic white TV character actor) was so bad with the accent, it came out as an Indian accent - and a caricature at that.
ME
Probably most viewers have no idea what an authentic Welsh accent is supposed to sound like. I know I don't...
Check out Torchwood - three of the main cast (Eve Myles, Gareth David-Lloyd, and Kai Owen) are all Welsh.

Though I've met all three of them, and I can't say that I really noticed anything particularly distinctive about any of their accents. (And I say that as someone who used to do a fair bit of theatre, so I've always been interested in accents.) They're definitely noticeable - particularly Eve's - but I didn't find them difficult to understand at all.

Interestingly, last year when I met another one of Torchwood's cast members, Burn Gorman, all I said was "Pleased to meet you," and his immediate response was, "Where's your accent from?" It turned out he'd just returned from a month-long camping trip three hours' drive north of where I live, so I figure he didn't expect to hear a Canadian accent in Atlanta. (I was surprised, when checking IMDb to see which cast members were Welsh, to learn that he was actually born in Hollywood. He probably has the thickest accent of any of them.)

As far as James Doohan's Scottish accent is concerned, several years ago I worked for several months with someone who had grown up in Scotland, and his accent wasn't that dissimilar to the one Doohan used. I think my co-worker was from Edinburgh. So I would chalk it up more to a) the accent being very different from what they have in Aberdeen, and b) Doohan being occasionally inconsistent (though I can't say as how I noticed his accent being inconsistent).
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Old January 2 2014, 09:42 AM   #30
Lance
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Re: How realistic was Scotty's accent?

The new Doctor Who, being made in Wales, is of course a great ambassador for the Welsh accent. Starting with "The Unquiet Dead" in series 1, a Welsh accent or two has never been far away. Particularly on the 'making of' documentaries.

(Mind you, the current show-runner is a Scot.)
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