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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old November 17 2013, 12:29 AM   #481
BillJ
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

CorporalCaptain wrote: View Post
Everyone's a superhero
Everyone's a Captain Kirk


—99 Red Balloons
I've always thought of Kirk as a superhero.

SeerSGB wrote: View Post

Which is why I keep thinking that STID is two movies compressed. Everything post Khan reveal feels like ideas from a follow up movie that got jammed into STID's final 1/4.
This is a fair criticism of the movie. I do think the transition from Harrison to Khan was sloppy.
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Old November 17 2013, 12:45 AM   #482
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

CorporalCaptain wrote: View Post
Everyone's a superhero
Everyone's a Captain Kirk


—99 Red Balloons
A man doesn't have to be a superhero... to be a hero.

--I totally thought this would be a quote from somebody famous, but it isn't
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Old November 17 2013, 12:47 AM   #483
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

BillJ wrote: View Post
CorporalCaptain wrote: View Post
Everyone's a superhero
Everyone's a Captain Kirk


—99 Red Balloons
I've always thought of Kirk as a superhero.
Same.

And, as strange as it may seem, I've never heard the English version of that song (nor do I really want to), but I did have to look that line up since it's a bit different from the literal translation of the original. It's a bit darker in German.

In any case the German calls the fighter pilots "great warriors" who thought they were Kirk.

A small difference that I just thought I'd share cuz I'm bored.
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Old November 17 2013, 12:51 AM   #484
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

CorporalClegg wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post
CorporalCaptain wrote: View Post
Everyone's a superhero
Everyone's a Captain Kirk


—99 Red Balloons
I've always thought of Kirk as a superhero.
Same.

And, as strange as it may seem, I've never heard the English version of that song (nor do I really want to), but I did have to look that line up since it's a bit different from the literal translation of the original. It's a bit darker in German.

In any case the German calls the fighter pilots "great warriors" who thought they were Kirk.

A small difference that I just thought I'd share cuz I'm bored.
Right. The "Red Balloons" version is not a literal translation.
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Old November 17 2013, 12:59 AM   #485
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

CorporalCaptain wrote: View Post
CorporalClegg wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post

I've always thought of Kirk as a superhero.
Same.

And, as strange as it may seem, I've never heard the English version of that song (nor do I really want to), but I did have to look that line up since it's a bit different from the literal translation of the original. It's a bit darker in German.

In any case the German calls the fighter pilots "great warriors" who thought they were Kirk.

A small difference that I just thought I'd share cuz I'm bored.
Right. The "Red Balloons" version is not a literal translation.
Most translations of song lyrics or poetry aren't, because a literal translation generally won't scan. The best translations are those which preserve (most of) the sense and tone of the original text without sacrificing the metrical rhythm of the lines.
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Old November 17 2013, 01:23 AM   #486
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

BigJake wrote: View Post
Nerys Myk wrote: View Post
But Star Trek is full of such "Comic book" ideas.
"Full of" is putting it a bit strongly, but like I said, I didn't care for Who Mourns for Adonais either. For my tastes, Trek's quality goes down the closer it comes to pure fantasy. It's more compelling to me as SF or as the use of an SF framework for telling dramatic stories from other fictional genres.
I'd have to disagree. Trek is full of comic book/junk science like Psi powers and people gaining new abilities from radiation and "alien" materials. More Peter Venkman than Albert Einstein. We're talking baby steps SF here.
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Old November 17 2013, 01:38 AM   #487
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

Nerys Myk wrote: View Post
Trek is full of comic book/junk science like Psi powers and people gaining new abilities from radiation and "alien" materials. More Peter Venkman than Albert Einstein. We're talking baby steps SF here.
Psi powers are a venerable SF theme, but to be sure they're more firmly in the junk science category now than ever before. It will be interesting to see if televised SF ever grows beyond them. As far as baby steps SF goes, that's absolutely true... but the baby steps were giant steps compared to Flash Gordon or Buck Rogers or Lost In Space. Or, arguably, nuTrek.

People gaining new abilities from radiation? Which episode am I forgetting?
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Old November 17 2013, 01:45 AM   #488
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

BigJake wrote: View Post
...but the baby steps were giant steps compared to Flash Gordon or Buck Rogers or Lost In Space. Or, arguably, nuTrek.
I'd argue that from an entertainment perspective, the Abrams films were a giant step up from much of the Star Trek with Rick Berman's name on it.

People gaining new abilities from radiation? Which episode am I forgetting?
The radiation was off the scale as they crossed the barrier in Where No Man Has Gone Before.
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Old November 17 2013, 01:55 AM   #489
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

BigJake wrote: View Post
Nerys Myk wrote: View Post
Trek is full of comic book/junk science like Psi powers and people gaining new abilities from radiation and "alien" materials. More Peter Venkman than Albert Einstein. We're talking baby steps SF here.
Psi powers are a venerable SF theme, but to be sure they're more firmly in the junk science category now than ever before. It will be interesting to see if televised SF ever grows beyond them. As far as baby steps SF goes, that's absolutely true... but the baby steps were giant steps compared to Flash Gordon or Buck Rogers or Lost In Space. Or, arguably, nuTrek.

People gaining new abilities from radiation? Which episode am I forgetting?
Where No Man Has Gone Before. Gary Mitchell get psi powers from the Galactic Barrier.
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Old November 17 2013, 02:08 AM   #490
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

BillJ wrote: View Post
BigJake wrote: View Post
...but the baby steps were giant steps compared to Flash Gordon or Buck Rogers or Lost In Space. Or, arguably, nuTrek.
I'd argue that from an entertainment perspective, the Abrams films were a giant step up from much of the Star Trek with Rick Berman's name on it.
As a feast for the senses and action-delivery-system, Abramstrek is streaks beyond anything else in the franchise, there's absolutely no contesting that. The most disastrous flaw of Berman-era Trek was that it got so used to painting inside the lines of "canon" visual style that it forgot that maybe it should attempt to do something exciting and fresh. For visual design*, style, verve, nuTrek is the clear winner... and Trek is an action franchise first, which earns it huge points on that score.

Let me set down my Cup of Hatorade for a moment and tell you some things I love about nuTrek: the uniforms, a great update of the classic look. The visuals overall**: in and of themselves, I think the design and CGI teams deserve a damned large share of credit for the financial success of the films. The action set-pieces -- especially space-diving in ST09, Khan and Kirk's space-shot in STID, Quinto's Khan yell (whatever dramatic-structuring nitpicks one might have with it, in and of itself it was good fun) and Spock's subsequent battle with Khan.

All damned good stuff.

(* Except perhaps for the incredibly lame-assed product placements.)

(** Excepting the Apple Store bridge sets and the absurd preponderance of lens flare, everything else was great.)

The radiation was off the scale as they crossed the barrier in Where No Man Has Gone Before.
So the radiation was actually the source of Gary Mitchell's powers? I'd always thought it was something undefined about the region of space, just like the "Barrier" didn't register in the ship's sensors but did in the mind.
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Old November 17 2013, 02:15 AM   #491
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

BigJake wrote: View Post
So the radiation was actually the source of Gary Mitchell's powers? I'd always thought it was something undefined about the region of space, just like the "Barrier" didn't register in the ship's sensors but did in the mind.
Actually, I misremembered the lines. There was no radiation.
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Old November 17 2013, 02:22 AM   #492
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

BillJ wrote: View Post
BigJake wrote: View Post
So the radiation was actually the source of Gary Mitchell's powers? I'd always thought it was something undefined about the region of space, just like the "Barrier" didn't register in the ship's sensors but did in the mind.
Actually, I misremembered the lines. There was no radiation.
Shit happens.

I don't know if you've ever read Vernor Vinge's A Fire Upon the Deep (if not, treat yourself, it's great) but it always seemed to me like "Where No Man Has Gone Before" was the inspiration for his Zones of Thought concept.
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Old November 17 2013, 04:53 AM   #493
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

BillJ wrote: View Post
Is it really any worse than Neelix and his holographic lungs?
Yes, They switched out the holographic lungs for a single lung from an alien with a seven-year life span. While they were training her to be the only nurse on a 70-year journey.
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Old November 17 2013, 05:09 AM   #494
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

I wonder if Neelix could have had another offscreen lung transplant from one of the Talaxians before Voyager left the vicinity. That would be a sensible precaution to take, although of course the episode appeared to move along too quickly for there to be time for such an operation.
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Old November 17 2013, 05:33 AM   #495
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Re: Orci, Kurtzman and Lindelof should not Return.

Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post
Is it really any worse than Neelix and his holographic lungs?
Yes, They switched out the holographic lungs for a single lung from an alien with a seven-year life span. While they were training her to be the only nurse on a 70-year journey.
Yet some folks continue to scream about gaps in the plot of the Abrams films.
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