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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old November 18 2013, 10:12 AM   #76
Pauln6
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Nerys Myk wrote: View Post
Pauln6 wrote: View Post
[
a) If Kirk doesn't know the names of his crew generally it makes him appear like a poor captain
Does it?

Space Seed wrote:
KIRK: I'm not. Oh, I'll need somebody familiar with the late 20th-Century Earth. Here's a chance for that historian to do something for a change. What's her name? McIvers?
SPOCK: Lieutenant McGivers.
Return To Tomorrow wrote:
KIRK: Who are you?
MULHALL: Doctor Ann Mulhall, Astro-biology. Well, I was ordered to report here for landing party duty.
I hadn't forgotten those but bless you for reminding us

However, Kirk was at least aware of McGivers even if he'd had no real interaction with her and he may not have known Mulhall to put a name to a face but he could still have known about her.

He spent time in sick bay with Chapel in the first movie and if he slept with her as well, I think my criticism is sound. If on the other hand she was one of many nurses in sick bay and they had no direct interaction, the fact that he does not remember her name is far less unedifying.
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Old November 18 2013, 01:50 PM   #77
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Is it ok for a starship Captain to be sleeping with the crew that serve under him anyways? I'd think that would be a breach of ethic if not outright against the rules.
Of course, Spock is Uhura's superior. That does make me think it's kind of creepy that nuTrek's so full of men in positions of authority sleeping with women subordinates. Every prominant female character that isn't a romantic interest for a man that's her superior officer. All two of them, three if you count Chapel off screen.
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Old November 18 2013, 02:26 PM   #78
BillJ
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

borgboy wrote: View Post
Is it ok for a starship Captain to be sleeping with the crew that serve under him anyways?
Ask Picard...

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Nella_Daren

In Nemesis, Riker is marrying Troi and they're going to serve together on the Titan and in the novels, Picard and Crusher are married.
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Old November 18 2013, 03:58 PM   #79
Cara007
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

BillJ wrote: View Post
borgboy wrote: View Post
Is it ok for a starship Captain to be sleeping with the crew that serve under him anyways?
Ask Picard...

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Nella_Daren

In Nemesis, Riker is marrying Troi and they're going to serve together on the Titan and in the novels, Picard and Crusher are married.
Picard and Crusher has been a long time coming.
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Old November 18 2013, 05:36 PM   #80
FarStrider
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Cara007 wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post
borgboy wrote: View Post
Is it ok for a starship Captain to be sleeping with the crew that serve under him anyways?
Ask Picard...

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Nella_Daren

In Nemesis, Riker is marrying Troi and they're going to serve together on the Titan and in the novels, Picard and Crusher are married.
Picard and Crusher has been a long time coming.
Add TAS' Robert April and his wife (and CMO) Sarah to the list. . .
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Old November 18 2013, 09:56 PM   #81
Malaika
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

borgboy wrote: View Post
I find it makes Kirk come off pretty bad if he's having casual sex with his subordinates so much that he doesn't even remember doing it.
maybe Chapel left for her own reasons and did what made her happy.
If we want to nitpick here, then Carol's personal remarks about Kirk's reputation were inappropriate, to begin with, and she might come off as not so professional.
Kirk is her captain and she is an officer who, above all, had just been busted for lying about her true identity to sneak aboard the enterprise (and she also asked her commanding officer - Spock, ironically - to keep the information from the captain)
Honestly, I don't get the whole wank about the underwear bit but I dunno what the writers were thinking with that whole scene and it's a bit of a joke that they considered the phrase about Chapel a "homage" to the original character.
just lots of fail there.
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Old November 19 2013, 12:56 AM   #82
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

I guess I'm a hypocrite, as I always did root for Riker/Troi and Picard/Beverly. I'm also a big fan of Calhoun/Shelby in New Frontiers, where they do acknowledge, discuss, and reevaluate their relationship over time. I'm apparently ok with love and marriage between captains and subordinates, but get all judgey over casual sex between captain and subordinate.
It does seem like it would make things a little awkward at least.
Which can make for interesting drama in fiction. I'm not at all opposed to messy personal issues in the stories, just acknowledging the problems these kind of relationships can bring.
I'm kind of iffy on Uhura and Spock as a couple. I'm still looking at them going "Really?" any time they're together. Kirk and Carol had no chemistry at all imo. I think Uhura would work better with Kirk, although seriously, Kirk and Spock are the real true love.
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Old November 19 2013, 01:52 AM   #83
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

borgboy wrote: View Post
I guess I'm a hypocrite, as I always did root for Riker/Troi and Picard/Beverly. I'm also a big fan of Calhoun/Shelby in New Frontiers, where they do acknowledge, discuss, and reevaluate their relationship over time. I'm apparently ok with love and marriage between captains and subordinates, but get all judgey over casual sex between captain and subordinate.
It does seem like it would make things a little awkward at least.
Which can make for interesting drama in fiction. I'm not at all opposed to messy personal issues in the stories, just acknowledging the problems these kind of relationships can bring.
I'm kind of iffy on Uhura and Spock as a couple. I'm still looking at them going "Really?" any time they're together. Kirk and Carol had no chemistry at all imo. I think Uhura would work better with Kirk, although seriously, Kirk and Spock are the real true love.

To you, kirk and spock are the real true love because you love your slash fan fiction and you are a gay man. Malakia probably thinks uhura and spock are the real true love because they are an interracial couple and because she is black . She is obviously rooting for the black female character to get the guy. this is what happens when we push our own beliefs on a pairing simply because it reflects our own life. we become blindly bias and ignorant.

This is not the first time I have heard this topic.I can't even believe it is still a conversation.Sorry I don't want Kirk and Spock to be in a homosexual relationship . it will ruin their friendship and it is also unnecessary.

What has our society even become? Why cant 2 guys be best friends without their female fans and gay fans insisting they become lovers.

Is it fair on their female loving counterparts. Is it fair on the standard loving heterosexual couple that is rooted and required in every story since the history of man kind.

From Rose/Jack in Titanic to Clark and Louis Lane in Superman, Romeo and Juliet from Shakespare classic play to Rhett and Scarlet in Gone with the Wind to Han/Leia in Star Wars to Aragorn/Arwen in lord of the rings and to even Miss Piggie and Kermit from the Muppets. Rhe lists goes on.


We as a society now see sex as the end point of every relationship even that of siblings. There are now female marvel fans now pushing for Thor and Loki to become a couple.

Lets all forget they are brothers (rolling my eyes).

It does not matter if they are not brothers by blood. They are still brothers. sex should not be part of their relationship.

The Same goes for Kirk and Spock. they have a very deep friendship and have called each other friends for nearly 50 years and at the same time shown romantic interest in women. why are female fans and gay men pushing for them to be gay.

Why cant the female fans and LGBT community respect heterosexual couples any more.

a lot of people like me who greatly enjoys heterosexual pairings have never pushed or demanded that an established gay character be made straight so why are people pushing for established straight characters to be gay?



Please where is the tolerance in that?
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Old November 19 2013, 02:04 AM   #84
Mr. Laser Beam
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Chapel is fine, but there are other characters whom I would much prefer seeing in a future film - characters we haven't ever actually seen yet. For example: Moves-With-Burning-Grace.
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Old November 19 2013, 02:43 AM   #85
Nerys Myk
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Pauln6 wrote: View Post
Nerys Myk wrote: View Post
Pauln6 wrote: View Post
[
a) If Kirk doesn't know the names of his crew generally it makes him appear like a poor captain
Does it?



Return To Tomorrow wrote:
KIRK: Who are you?
MULHALL: Doctor Ann Mulhall, Astro-biology. Well, I was ordered to report here for landing party duty.
I hadn't forgotten those but bless you for reminding us

However, Kirk was at least aware of McGivers even if he'd had no real interaction with her and he may not have known Mulhall to put a name to a face but he could still have known about her.

He spent time in sick bay with Chapel in the first movie and if he slept with her as well, I think my criticism is sound. If on the other hand she was one of many nurses in sick bay and they had no direct interaction, the fact that he does not remember her name is far less unedifying.
Splitting hairs there with the "may not have". Fact is Kirk doesn't know Mullhall and is vague on who McIvers is.

Nothing in the first film indicates that Kirk spent any time with Chapel when he was in sickbay.


borgboy wrote: View Post
Is it ok for a starship Captain to be sleeping with the crew that serve under him anyways? I'd think that would be a breach of ethic if not outright against the rules.
Of course, Spock is Uhura's superior. That does make me think it's kind of creepy that nuTrek's so full of men in positions of authority sleeping with women subordinates. Every prominant female character that isn't a romantic interest for a man that's her superior officer. All two of them, three if you count Chapel off screen.
Did I miss a scene? I don't recall Kirk and Marcus being in a romantic relationship in the film.
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Old November 19 2013, 03:26 AM   #86
CorporalClegg
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Cara007 wrote: View Post
To you, kirk and spock are the real true love because you love your slash fan fiction and you are a gay man.


Malakia probably thinks uhura and spock are the real true love because they are an interracial couple and because she is black . She is obviously rooting for the black female character to get the guy.


this is what happens when we push our own beliefs on a pairing simply because it reflects our own life. we become blindly bias and ignorant.
Pot/kettle?

This is not the first time I have heard this topic.I can't even believe it is still a conversation.Sorry I don't want Kirk and Spock to be in a homosexual relationship . it will ruin their friendship and it is also unnecessary.
How so?

What has our society even become? Why cant 2 guys be best friends without their female fans and gay fans insisting they become lovers.
Humans are androgynous. Our society hasn't "become" anything; it's merely started to accept that.
Is it fair on their female loving counterparts. Is it fair on the standard loving heterosexual couple that is rooted and required in every story since the history of man kind.
Wut?

From Rose/Jack in Titanic to Clark and Louis Lane in Superman, Romeo and Juliet from Shakespare classic play to Rhett and Scarlet in Gone with the Wind to Han/Leia in Star Wars to Aragorn/Arwen in lord of the rings and to even Miss Piggie and Kermit from the Muppets. Rhe lists goes on.
There are plenty of same-sex relationships throughout literature too. Shakespeare wrote some as he was in one.

We as a society now see sex as the end point of every relationship
It is.

It does not matter if they are not brothers by blood. They are still brothers. sex should not be part of their relationship.
Says you. When any biological concern is removed from the equation, it's not for you or anyone else to decide what is and is not a proper relationship.

The Same goes for Kirk and Spock. they have a very deep friendship and have called each other friends for nearly 50 years and at the same time shown romantic interest in women. .
They can't have interest in both?

Why cant the female fans and LGBT community respect heterosexual couples any more.
Why can't you respect LGBT relationships?

a lot of people like me who greatly enjoys heterosexual pairings have never pushed or demanded that an established gay character be made straight so why are people pushing for established straight characters to be gay?
Fallacy.

Please where is the tolerance in that?
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Old November 19 2013, 05:01 AM   #87
borgboy
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

I know Marcus wasn't really involved with Kirk, so maybe I'm pushing the issue there, fair enough.
I'm allowed to ship Kirk and Spock if I want to. Nobody has a right to tell other people which characters they can want together. This browbeating of me any time gay or slash issues come up is getting old. I don't recall that I've insisted on any kind of changes to the canon couples, all I've done is discuss my thoughts.
Considering the only gay characters in Trek are supporting characters in the novels, I don't think anyone's in danger of being overrun by fictional gays from the future. I'm not sure what the point of listing famous heterosexual couples was. It just makes me think there's plenty of room for some diversity in our entertainment.

There's been an active fandom of Kirk/Spock fans since practically the beginning of Trek, and K/S slashers pretty much single handed invented slash. Like it or not, it's part of Trek history. It's also an extremely specialized niche of fandom that should be pretty easy to ignore of you don't like it.
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Old November 19 2013, 10:43 AM   #88
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

CorporalClegg wrote: View Post
Cara007 wrote: View Post
To you, kirk and spock are the real true love because you love your slash fan fiction and you are a gay man.


Malakia probably thinks uhura and spock are the real true love because they are an interracial couple and because she is black . She is obviously rooting for the black female character to get the guy.


Pot/kettle?

How so?

Humans are androgynous. Our society hasn't "become" anything; it's merely started to accept that.
Wut?

There are plenty of same-sex relationships throughout literature too. Shakespeare wrote some as he was in one.

It is.

Says you. When any biological concern is removed from the equation, it's not for you or anyone else to decide what is and is not a proper relationship.

They can't have interest in both?

Why can't you respect LGBT relationships?

a lot of people like me who greatly enjoys heterosexual pairings have never pushed or demanded that an established gay character be made straight so why are people pushing for established straight characters to be gay?
Fallacy.

Please where is the tolerance in that?
Once more with feeling:
Did you read my post?

I respect LGBT relationships. Like I said I don't insists that they turn gay characters straight. so why are people insisting that they make straight characters gay.

you are also dead wrong on the brothers things and you are showing your ignorance. this is the reason why a lot of parent are heavily counselled and some even undergo psychological analysis when they are adopting a child.

when you adopt a child you are suppose to love the child as your own same goes for his adopted siblings. Them having sex is still incests.


Thor and Loki are brothers. please girls, stop perverting their relationship.

I am also embarrassed that you honestly think sex is the end point of every relationship. it just proves your ignorance again and shows how far decayed our society has become and you wonder why there are so many unwanted pregnancies, single mothers and STDs. Do people now even have a little standard of morality left? probably not.

Lastly there are not plenty of same sex relationship that is just media brain washing. Literature has always written the standard romantic relationship between a man and a woman. From much ado about nothing with Beatrice and Bennedict to Romeo and Juilet, Lancelot and Guinevere, Robin Wood and Marian, Scarlett O’Hara and Rhett Butler, Elizabeth Bennett and Mr. Darcy from Pride and Prejudice.

Every great fundamental literature writer has always had a standard relationship between a man and women central to his story. films are not different.


borgboy: Are you aware that that slash has no substance and it is nothing more than a sexual fantasy for women. all slash fans are girls only and that does not say much for the pairings.

we have had this conversation before about how women get turned on when they see two men have sex. there is no substance in that.

I never cared for slash. I only started caring when the slash fans started attacking the loving heterosexual cannon pairings.

Last edited by Cara007; November 19 2013 at 12:30 PM.
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Old November 19 2013, 11:19 AM   #89
CorporalClegg
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

I may be an ignorant, brain-washed bumpkin, but at least I stayed at a Holiday Inn last night.
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Old November 19 2013, 12:19 PM   #90
M'Sharak
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Cara007 wrote: View Post
CorporalClegg wrote: View Post
Cara007 wrote: View Post
To you, kirk and spock are the real true love because you love your slash fan fiction and you are a gay man.




Pot/kettle?

How so?

Humans are androgynous. Our society hasn't "become" anything; it's merely started to accept that.
Wut?

There are plenty of same-sex relationships throughout literature too. Shakespeare wrote some as he was in one.

It is.

Says you. When any biological concern is removed from the equation, it's not for you or anyone else to decide what is and is not a proper relationship.

They can't have interest in both?

Why can't you respect LGBT relationships?

Fallacy.

Please where is the tolerance in that?
Once more with feeling:
Did you read my post?

I respect LGBT relationships. Like I said I don't insists that they turn gay characters straight. so why I people insisting that they make straight characters gay.

you are also dead wrong on the brothers things and you are showing your ignorance. this is the reason why a lot of parent are heavily counselled and some even go undergo psychological analysis when they are adopting a child.

when you adopt a child you are suppose to love the child as your own same goes for his adopted siblings. Them having sex is still incests.


Thor and Loki are brothers. please girls, stop perverting their relationship.

I am also embarrassed that you honestly think sex is the end point of every relationship. it just proves your ignorance again and shows how far decayed our society has become and you wonder why there are so many unwanted pregnancies, single mothers and STDs. Do people now even have a little standard of morality left? probably not.

Lastly there are not plenty of same sex relationship that is just media brain washing. Literature has always written the standard romantic relationship between a man and a woman. From much ado about nothing with Hero and Horatio to Romeo and Juilet, Lancelot and Guinevere, Robin Wood and Marian, Scarlett O’Hara and Rhett Butler, Elizabeth Bennett and Mr. Darcy from Pride and Prejudice.

Every great fundamental literature writer has always had a standard relationship between a man and women central to his story. films are not different.


borgboy: Are you aware that that slash has no substance and it is nothing more than a sexual fantasy for women. all slash fans are girls only and that does not say much for the pairings.

we have had this conversation before about how women get turned on when they see two men have sex. there is no substance in that.

I never cared for slash. I only started caring when the slash fans started attacking the loving heterosexual cannon pairings.
That will be enough soapboxing. If this is something you really want to talk about, start a thread about it (in a forum appropriate to the topic, as in: not this forum) or put it in a blog, but don't hijack a thread which is about something else.
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