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Old January 10 2014, 11:05 PM   #376
Timby
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

Scout101 wrote: View Post
Good news, Yankees just got younger! Didn't pick anyone up, though. Vernon Wells DFAed. Couldn't even get the proverbial bag of balls for him.

They had to clear room to get Brian Roberts and/or Matt Thornton on the roster (neither deal was finalized yet because the 40-man roster was clogged)...
The corpse of Vernon Wells DFA'd for the corpse of Brian Roberts.

Man, the Yankees are just filled with young talent right now.
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Old January 10 2014, 11:09 PM   #377
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

Timby wrote: View Post
Scout101 wrote: View Post
Good news, Yankees just got younger! Didn't pick anyone up, though. Vernon Wells DFAed. Couldn't even get the proverbial bag of balls for him.

They had to clear room to get Brian Roberts and/or Matt Thornton on the roster (neither deal was finalized yet because the 40-man roster was clogged)...
The corpse of Vernon Wells DFA'd for the corpse of Brian Roberts.

Man, the Yankees are just filled with young talent right now.
Careful, Robert could be lightning in a bottle.
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Old January 11 2014, 12:19 AM   #378
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

Yanks wrote: View Post
That only saved the club $2.4 million toward the cap.
Yeah, that's not how baseball works. Contracts are guaranteed, so you get to pay him 2.4 Million regardless of whether he's on the team or not.

And it counts towards the Luxury Tax anyway. Plus there's no cap.

Yanks wrote: View Post

Careful, Robert could be lightning in a bottle.
And Jeter could hit .650 all season, and his repaired ankle may suddenly give him competent range at SS, but those aren't likely either.

RobertS MAY be serviceable, but he hasn't played a full season since 2009, and hasn't been very good in the partial seasons he HAS played. At 36, unlikely he's going to suddenly bounce back to being awesome, healthy, and young. He was worth it as a cheap flier, because there weren't any other 2B options after you let Cano go, but you didn't pick up a hidden all-star. Unless it's 2007 still, which is the last time he was that. And even then, not special, just the best on a shit O's team.

But spin the narrative however you like. It's ok to admit the Yankees aren't the AL powerhouse at the moment, though. Bluster and rings from the 1920s don't translate to wins in 2014...
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Old January 11 2014, 02:01 AM   #379
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

Scout101 wrote: View Post
Yanks wrote: View Post
That only saved the club $2.4 million toward the cap.
Yeah, that's not how baseball works. Contracts are guaranteed, so you get to pay him 2.4 Million regardless of whether he's on the team or not.

And it counts towards the Luxury Tax anyway. Plus there's no cap.

Yanks wrote: View Post

Careful, Robert could be lightning in a bottle.
And Jeter could hit .650 all season, and his repaired ankle may suddenly give him competent range at SS, but those aren't likely either.

RobertS MAY be serviceable, but he hasn't played a full season since 2009, and hasn't been very good in the partial seasons he HAS played. At 36, unlikely he's going to suddenly bounce back to being awesome, healthy, and young. He was worth it as a cheap flier, because there weren't any other 2B options after you let Cano go, but you didn't pick up a hidden all-star. Unless it's 2007 still, which is the last time he was that. And even then, not special, just the best on a shit O's team.

But spin the narrative however you like. It's ok to admit the Yankees aren't the AL powerhouse at the moment, though. Bluster and rings from the 1920s don't translate to wins in 2014...
I'm not sure it counts toward the LT limit of 189M...

...and don't be a hater. Robertson is more than capable of making a huge contribution this year, providing he stays healthy - which is pretty much the story for the Yankees this year.
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Old January 11 2014, 02:33 AM   #380
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

Timby wrote: View Post
Man, the Yankees are just filled with young talent right now.
I went to college in the Bronx, been to a shit ton of Yankee games, a Mets fan, lefty, and will be 34 next week. Where do I sign up? I'm a good fit.
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Old January 11 2014, 04:54 PM   #381
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

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...and don't be a hater. Robertson is more than capable of making a huge contribution this year, providing he stays healthy - which is pretty much the story for the Yankees this year.
Brian Roberts has a career OPS of .761, and his slugging percentage has averaged .301 over the past three seasons. That's slugging, not batting average or on-base. The only way he is even remotely capable of making a "huge contribution" is if you live on a planet where crack grows on trees.
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Old January 11 2014, 05:21 PM   #382
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

And no matter how many times you say you're 'not sure' whether DFA'ed players count towards the luxury tax, doesn't make it true or even with discussing. They DO count. MLB does guaranteed contracts, it's not the NFL. Yankees are paying his full salary, and it counts. Only thing that changed is that he doesn't have to show up anymore.

Only caveat is that if another team signs him this season, the new team only has to pay him the MLB minimum salary (around 500k), and the Yankees don't pay that part. They'd be on the hook for the remaining 1.9 Mil in that case.

Otherwise, why wouldn't you just DFA Arod and save 100 mil? Right...

And everyone must seem like a hater when you're sitting around in Yankees footie pajamas. Come on dude, at least pretend like it's a rational discussion. Other people here are fans of teams, but can discuss other teams (or even their own in a non-'we're the best' light) rationally. Or at the very least, use google or baseball-reference to put facts or numbers to the things being discussed.

"provided they stay healthy" is a nonsense term on a team who has an average infield age of 37, and ALL of the starters are coming off significant injuries. Roberts' injury history meaning he hasn't played a full season in over 4 years. Provided they all have perfect health, get over the physical declines, and de-age 10 years, maybe they'll be decent. Since that's not happening, you're more just hoping you can field a team without using single-A scrubs for large portions.

You can HOPE for nice results, but nothing indicates they are likely. Stop talking about how your boys should be getting fitted for rings. Yankees are NOT relevant right now. Old, beat up, declining players, and most importantly, no starting pitching. Oh, and no prospects, and salary money pretty much all spent. Only thing that prevents this from being a TOTAL disaster is that you still can cling to hope that Tanaka might come your way. Tough odds to sign him, and not guaranteed to actually be the savior anyway, so take that how you will. No matter how much you wish it were true (or 1997), no one's really worried about the Yankees anymore. Maybe in a few years, but to rebuild, you gotta let go of the foolish dream of having to be relevant every year, and actually rebuild. Throwing money at has-beens isn't going to get you there, and you sign them to long contracts that just kicks the rebuild further down the road.

But good luck, I guess. Red Sox made a nice leap last year, so it's not impossible. Then again, Sox had the players, just had injuries and a bumbling clusterfuck of a manager in 2012. Pitching was still good, Ells, Pedroia, and Ortiz were still there, etc. Plus had a farm system to draw on. And the Dodgers bought all our big contracts so we could start fresh there, which was nice. Reminds me, we owe them another fruit basket...
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Old January 11 2014, 05:42 PM   #383
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

Timby wrote: View Post
Yanks wrote: View Post
...and don't be a hater. Robertson is more than capable of making a huge contribution this year, providing he stays healthy - which is pretty much the story for the Yankees this year.
Brian Roberts has a career OPS of .761, and his slugging percentage has averaged .301 over the past three seasons. That's slugging, not batting average or on-base. The only way he is even remotely capable of making a "huge contribution" is if you live on a planet where crack grows on trees.
Nope, he could end up being a strong #5 or #6 in the line up. He wont be in the top 4.
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Old January 11 2014, 06:08 PM   #384
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

Alex Rodriguez suspended for 162 games. He's going to take it to federal court (since MLB violated state and federal laws in its investigation of Biogenesis, and the suspension doesn't comply with the JDA).

Break out the beer and popcorn, because this is going to be juicy.

Edit: This also ensures Project 189 will survive (the Yankees are not getting Tanaka).
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Old January 11 2014, 09:07 PM   #385
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

Timby wrote: View Post
Alex Rodriguez suspended for 162 games. He's going to take it to federal court (since MLB violated state and federal laws in its investigation of Biogenesis, and the suspension doesn't comply with the JDA).

Break out the beer and popcorn, because this is going to be juicy.

Edit: This also ensures Project 189 will survive (the Yankees are not getting Tanaka).
How do you know about Tanaka?

And I hope the federal judge upholds, then MLB suspends his ass for life.
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Old January 11 2014, 10:31 PM   #386
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

Because you (the Yankees) suddenly care about steroids and the integrity of the game? Or just want to pull the rip cord and get out of that awful contract any way you can? If he was still hitting like 2005, doubt we'd be hearing so much from the Yankees fans about how Arod has to go. Since there's still what, 4 years? left on the contract, suddenly everyone is declaring Arod's gotta go, integrity of the game, etc.



These sorts of examples are the kind of thing that NFL actually does right. You can cut the player and still get a little benefit, but it's a huge hit against the salary cap for being dumb with the money in the first place. In MLB, Yankees get a get out of jail free card for the bad part of the contract while still getting to over-bid for the good part and enjoy the productive years. Kinda sucks, hope Arod keeps fighting, gets it reduced to the same 65 games that Braun got. Or worst case, does his 1-year ban, and shows up for the last 3 years of the deal, clean and ready to play (at his crappy, old age-riddled, non-steroided best)
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Old January 11 2014, 10:36 PM   #387
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

Scout101 wrote: View Post
Because you (the Yankees) suddenly care about steroids and the integrity of the game? Or just want to pull the rip cord and get out of that awful contract any way you can? If he was still hitting like 2005, doubt we'd be hearing so much from the Yankees fans about how Arod has to go. Since there's still what, 4 years? left on the contract, suddenly everyone is declaring Arod's gotta go, integrity of the game, etc.



These sorts of examples are the kind of thing that NFL actually does right. You can cut the player and still get a little benefit, but it's a huge hit against the salary cap for being dumb with the money in the first place. In MLB, Yankees get a get out of jail free card for the bad part of the contract while still getting to over-bid for the good part and enjoy the productive years. Kinda sucks, hope Arod keeps fighting, gets it reduced to the same 65 games that Braun got. Or worst case, does his 1-year ban, and shows up for the last 3 years of the deal, clean and ready to play (at his crappy, old age-riddled, non-steroided best)
I guess you can make that baseless claim, but if your team had paid that you'd be wishing the same. While I want him out of baseball forever, this does not get the Yankees out of the last 61 million. He obstructed the investigation. I don't think this see the inside of a federal court though.

It does free up some cash, for sure - but I'm glad that MLB is cleaning house. They should have done this earlier.
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Old January 11 2014, 10:55 PM   #388
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

dHere's the problem with MLB's "cleaning house" position:

- Rodriguez never failed an official test.
- Nobody except MLB and the arbitrator has seen the "evidence" that MLB purchased illegally from people formerly with Biogenesis (which compromised several legitimate government investigations)
- The suspension is completely arbitrary (it's outside of the 50 / 100 / indefinite schedule; it technically falls under the commissioner's purview but that's very sketchy).
- Not only do we not know what evidence they have, but we don't even know if it's reliable considering it was obtained in an underhanded manner from shady people.
- If MLB is so confident that Rodriguez deserves 162 games, why aren't they showing the evidence to the press?
- The suspension is significantly longer than the ones that other Biogenesis-linked players received (the most before that was 65, for Ryan Braun).

MLB's lead investigator literally fucked a witness into compliance. Since the 211-game suspension is now moot, Selig is suspending Rodriguez for the coming season, for two reasons: First, he hates Rodriguez and he's active, unlike Bonds or McGwire. Second, this is a massive favor to Hal Steinbrenner. This is as shady as it gets.

In any event, though, this will be fun to watch. Rodriguez will ask the court for an injunction. The court will have to decide whether he has a substantial likelihood of success on the merits and faces irreparable harm. The latter criteria he likely meets, the former ... well, we'll see.
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Old January 11 2014, 11:54 PM   #389
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

^ I suspect he'll get an injunction. Whether he ultimately wins (I'm assuming it'll go to an arbitrator first) is a big questionmark, but I can see the merits to both sides. I suspect before this whole thing is over, Rodriguez will at least get an opportunity to contest the evidence and he might win because of the way Baseball obtained it.

Yanks wrote: View Post
Nope, he could end up being a strong #5 or #6 in the line up. He wont be in the top 4.
I'm not sure that says much. It's all relative to the rest of the Yankees players.
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Old January 12 2014, 12:05 AM   #390
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

Won't see the inside of a federal court room.
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