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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old September 29 2013, 11:32 PM   #31
C.E. Evans
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

Black Cloud S31 wrote: View Post
The US is a democracy...
It's actually a republic.
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Old September 30 2013, 12:06 AM   #32
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

A democratic republic.
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Old September 30 2013, 12:16 AM   #33
C.E. Evans
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

Black Cloud S31 wrote: View Post
A democratic republic.
But not an actual democracy.
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Old September 30 2013, 12:34 AM   #34
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

Whatever, as long as the rights of all kind minorities are not infringed.
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Old September 30 2013, 12:37 AM   #35
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

At what point did some Americans start hairsplitting about whether a "republic" is a "democracy"? It's got to be a post-Cold War thing, surely?
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Old September 30 2013, 12:37 AM   #36
M'Sharak
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
Black Cloud S31 wrote: View Post
The US is a democracy...
It's actually a republic.
Black Cloud S31 wrote: View Post
A democratic republic.
C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
Black Cloud S31 wrote: View Post
A democratic republic.
But not an actual democracy.
That discussion, however, is for a forum other than this one, as it pertains to Star Trek and this movie not at all.

Edit:

BigJake wrote: View Post
At what point did some Americans start hairsplitting about whether a "republic" is a "democracy"? It's got to be a post-Cold War thing, surely?
Not here. (please refer to item 1. What goes in this forum)
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Last edited by M'Sharak; September 30 2013 at 12:41 AM. Reason: link added
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Old September 30 2013, 07:26 PM   #37
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

SeerSGB wrote: View Post
A pretty good analog to Marcus is Cartwright. Cartwright backed political assaination, set Kirk up to take the fall, and was ready to kill the Federation President all in the name of keeping the Federation safe.
And all this makes me wish that Cartwright had more screen time, simply because I think each and every one of those actions deserve attention. Yeah, Chang was set up as the primary villain, but it takes two to tango, and Cartwright was Chang's Starfleet counterpart. (and Brock Peters is simply great, anyway)

Opus wrote: View Post
This wasn't too hard to follow:

Marcus sends Kirk and the Enterprise to the edge of Klingon Space to fire torpedoes into a supposed barren area of Kronos (Qu'onos). A secret computer virus is implanted in the ship's computer by Section 31 to disable Enterprise while out there. Enterprise fires torpedoes. Klingons find Enterprise disabled. Klingons destroy Enterprise and the war Marcus wants begins.

Marcus was never going to spare Enterprise' crew. He sent them to slaughter to begin with.
I just want to emphasize that yes, we're talking about Section 31 here. Say what you will about Marcus' qualifications and climb to power as an admiral, but just the Section 31 link alone provides the connection to the precedent of Starfleet corruption.
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Old September 30 2013, 08:55 PM   #38
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

Isn't there only about 2 or 3 Admirals, in all of Trek that have been consistently portrayed in a Good light, and not breaking rules, in bed with Section 31 or enemies?

Necheyev (Even she did that Cardassian plot thing that got Picard captured and tortured), The Admiral from Enterprise, and maybe 1 or 2 others?

Almost all of the folks above Captain (and several Captains too) were shown to break the rules, be just crazy or psycho, or in bed with enemies
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Old September 30 2013, 09:10 PM   #39
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
"Absolute power corrupts absolutely."
--Captain James R. Kirk, "Where No Man Has Gone Before."
Fixed it for ya. James T. Kirk never said that. Nor was he in the episode.

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Old September 30 2013, 09:49 PM   #40
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

Sindatur wrote: View Post
Isn't there only about 2 or 3 Admirals, in all of Trek that have been consistently portrayed in a Good light, and not breaking rules, in bed with Section 31 or enemies?

Necheyev (Even she did that Cardassian plot thing that got Picard captured and tortured), The Admiral from Enterprise, and maybe 1 or 2 others?

Almost all of the folks above Captain (and several Captains too) were shown to break the rules, be just crazy or psycho, or in bed with enemies
Does Admiral Janeway count? Or did she simply not have enough screen time to abuse her newfound authority?

Hah, come to think of it, ADMIRAL Kirk [/khan] stole the Enterprise, blew her up, and then changed the course of history, though all for good reason. I imagine that Internal Affairs couldn't have been too happy about the outcome of that trial at the end of TVH.
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Old September 30 2013, 10:01 PM   #41
C.E. Evans
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

ssosmcin wrote: View Post
C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
"Absolute power corrupts absolutely."
--Captain James R. Kirk, "Where No Man Has Gone Before."
Fixed it for ya. James T. Kirk never said that. Nor was he in the episode.

Um, no. You fixed nothing for me.

Don't rewrite and change my posts please. If you want to discuss something with me, then quote what I actually wrote and we'll go from there.
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Old September 30 2013, 10:42 PM   #42
Sindatur
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

Cyke101 wrote: View Post
Sindatur wrote: View Post
Isn't there only about 2 or 3 Admirals, in all of Trek that have been consistently portrayed in a Good light, and not breaking rules, in bed with Section 31 or enemies?

Necheyev (Even she did that Cardassian plot thing that got Picard captured and tortured), The Admiral from Enterprise, and maybe 1 or 2 others?

Almost all of the folks above Captain (and several Captains too) were shown to break the rules, be just crazy or psycho, or in bed with enemies
Does Admiral Janeway count? Or did she simply not have enough screen time to abuse her newfound authority?

Hah, come to think of it, ADMIRAL Kirk [/khan] stole the Enterprise, blew her up, and then changed the course of history, though all for good reason. I imagine that Internal Affairs couldn't have been too happy about the outcome of that trial at the end of TVH.
Well, she broke the Temporal Prime Directive, and was warned against doing so, but, chose to do it anyways (though, the Reset button was pushed)
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Old September 30 2013, 10:47 PM   #43
M'Sharak
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

Sindatur wrote: View Post
Isn't there only about 2 or 3 Admirals, in all of Trek that have been consistently portrayed in a Good light, and not breaking rules, in bed with Section 31 or enemies?
Yep. I think it's just Komack and Westervliet.

C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
ssosmcin wrote: View Post
C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
"Absolute power corrupts absolutely."
--Captain James R. Kirk, "Where No Man Has Gone Before."
Fixed it for ya. James T. Kirk never said that. Nor was he in the episode.

Um, no. You fixed nothing for me.

Don't rewrite and change my posts please. If you want to discuss something with me, then quote what I actually wrote and we'll go from there.
It's a joke. Relax.
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Old September 30 2013, 10:55 PM   #44
Cyke101
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

Sindatur wrote: View Post
Cyke101 wrote: View Post
Sindatur wrote: View Post
Isn't there only about 2 or 3 Admirals, in all of Trek that have been consistently portrayed in a Good light, and not breaking rules, in bed with Section 31 or enemies?

Necheyev (Even she did that Cardassian plot thing that got Picard captured and tortured), The Admiral from Enterprise, and maybe 1 or 2 others?

Almost all of the folks above Captain (and several Captains too) were shown to break the rules, be just crazy or psycho, or in bed with enemies
Does Admiral Janeway count? Or did she simply not have enough screen time to abuse her newfound authority?

Hah, come to think of it, ADMIRAL Kirk [/khan] stole the Enterprise, blew her up, and then changed the course of history, though all for good reason. I imagine that Internal Affairs couldn't have been too happy about the outcome of that trial at the end of TVH.
Well, she broke the Temporal Prime Directive, and was warned against doing so, but, chose to do it anyways (though, the Reset button was pushed)
Huh, I was thinking of Nemesis Janeway and completely forgot about Endgame Janeway. I feel ashamed. Where should I turn in my comm-badge?
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Old September 30 2013, 11:51 PM   #45
C.E. Evans
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Re: The Admirals character makes no sense whatsoever

M'Sharak wrote: View Post
Sindatur wrote: View Post
Isn't there only about 2 or 3 Admirals, in all of Trek that have been consistently portrayed in a Good light, and not breaking rules, in bed with Section 31 or enemies?
Yep. I think it's just Komack and Westervliet.

C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
ssosmcin wrote: View Post

Fixed it for ya. James T. Kirk never said that. Nor was he in the episode.

Um, no. You fixed nothing for me.

Don't rewrite and change my posts please. If you want to discuss something with me, then quote what I actually wrote and we'll go from there.
It's a joke. Relax.
No, I don't find rewriting other posters' quotes remotely funny nor cute. I'm also not the only one that feels that way.
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