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Old April 16 2014, 09:56 PM   #4636
Christopher
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

Agent Richard07 wrote: View Post
Anyone catch those coordinates?
"49 27 41 -80 3 40"

Which, when entered into Google Maps, gives "Unnamed Rd, Cochrane, Unorganized, North Part, ON P0L, Canada." It's in eastern Ontario near the Quebec border, about 120 miles south of the southernmost tip of Hudson Bay.
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Old April 16 2014, 10:26 PM   #4637
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

kitik wrote: View Post
So we saw Ward holding the Berserker staff. Surely that won't be the last we see of that staff.
In the very next scene, we see him flexing his muscles, as if evaluating new strength. I am betting, he used it already to become super in anticipation of fighting May.
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Old April 16 2014, 11:00 PM   #4638
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

Chemahkuu wrote: View Post
^Except for singing away his humanity, becoming the masked vigilanty embodiment of an entire sentient universe planning to erase our own, and on losing the oppertunity to do so simply kills Giles in frustration.

That's before taking all of Los Angeles literally to hell and having them remain dead or horribly remembering every moment of it when it returns, never once thinking to take the fight to another branch of W&H which he conveniently forgot existed to lessen the damage.

Swell guy.
My reference was strictly to the events depicted in the T.V. show. I don't know anything about what you're referring to here.
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Old April 16 2014, 11:04 PM   #4639
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

Captain Craig wrote: View Post
Hand is just too versatile for plot and story telling to actually be dead, DEAD. I'm trying to grasp Feige, Whedon or someone thinking that would be a good call.
Who else were you going to use as cannon fodder at that point? Hate to say it because I quite liked Hand's character, but at that point, she was the only expendable senior-level SHIELD agent in the story at... um... hand. Doing anything short of killing her wouldn't have been effective to showing Ward's betrayal.

But it is Marvel so she very well could come back. Tahiti IS a magical place.
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Old April 16 2014, 11:07 PM   #4640
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

kitik wrote: View Post
So we saw Ward holding the Berserker staff. Surely that won't be the last we see of that staff.
Maybe Professor "Elliot Randolph" will reappear to provide backup for Coulson's team. I think that since he's an Asgardian who spent over 1000 years quietly living among humans, Coulson will judge him to be someone who wouldn't align with HYDRA. So if Ward brings the Berserker staff into play, Randolph might be Coulson's strategic response.
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Old April 16 2014, 11:16 PM   #4641
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

^ For what it's worth, Ward was wearing gloves this time when handling the staff. I certainly think he'll consider using it again, but I also think that the staff brings back unpleasant memories of a time long ago that he thinks John Garrett saved him from.

Christopher wrote: View Post
I don't understand your basis for that.
Garrett's exact quote in this episode was "you've got a gift." There was a similar line in The Magical Place about her ability to persuade people. Sure, none of them specifically described it as superhuman, but referring to it as a gift the way Garrett did certainly at least suggested the possibility. I can certainly be wrong, of course, but I'm not grabbing it out of thin air.
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Old April 16 2014, 11:23 PM   #4642
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

Out of curiosity I decided to check out the last couple episodes (after giving up on the show early on), and I have to say so far I'm liking this new direction a whole lot more. The dismantling of SHIELD and the threat from Hydra has given the show a much needed sense of urgency and unpredictability, and characters like Ward have suddenly become a lot more interesting (and I admire that they didn't wimp out on making him an actual villain).

That said, I do wish they would take a cue from Winter Soldier and up the sophistication of the writing a little more. Paxton's character is so cartoonishly evil he belongs in an episode of Chuck, and the nonstop, jokey dialogue makes it kinda hard to take anything all that seriously.

There's nothing wrong with having some lighter moments, but I still think the show would work a lot better (and draw in more viewers) if it just took itself a little more seriously.

Last edited by davejames; April 16 2014 at 11:34 PM.
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Old April 16 2014, 11:49 PM   #4643
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

Alidar Jarok wrote: View Post
Garrett's exact quote in this episode was "you've got a gift." There was a similar line in The Magical Place about her ability to persuade people. Sure, none of them specifically described it as superhuman, but referring to it as a gift the way Garrett did certainly at least suggested the possibility. I can certainly be wrong, of course, but I'm not grabbing it out of thin air.
Well, first off, we've already had a female character in this show who had paranormal powers of persuasion, namely Lorelei. Would they really want to repeat themelves that way?

And if Raina did have paranormal persuasive abilities like Lorelei, or like Maxwell Lord or Eden from Heroes, then wouldn't she just have been able to talk her way out of that prison?

Just because someone is exceptionally good at something, that doesn't make it a superpower. Lots of people are called "gifted" because of abilities that are simply at the high end of normal human potential, like a gifted student or a gifted athlete. For instance, Tony Stark is a gifted inventor, an exceptional genius, but that's not a superhuman ability, just a peak-human ability. Same for Hawkeye's aim or Black Widow's or May's combat skills.

Not to mention that the show has made it clear that paranormal abilities are extremely rare in the MCU, and thus the odds of any given person having them are extremely low. So unless Raina is shown doing something that a very skilled human could not do, it is unlikely that she has any paranormal ability. To paraphrase Sherlock Holmes in The Hound of the Baskervilles, we are bound to exhaust all natural hypotheses before falling back upon a supernatural one.
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Old April 17 2014, 12:19 AM   #4644
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

Well, I'm pleased so far with how they're handling Ward, and convinced that he's the real deal until they should drop some clue to the contrary.

I particularly like how they're acknowledging in-show that Ward's stiff, square-jaw routine was a deliberate act on the character's part. He was trying to be the most boring character on the show...that redeems him somewhat as a character (and I don't mean morally, for you hair-triggers out there).

They definitely made clear, however, that his loyalty is and always has been to Garrett. There's no indication that he cares about Hydra as an independent entity/greater cause.

Nor does Garrett, for that matter. I'm definitely getting the vibe from the last couple of episodes that Garrett is an opportunist first and a card-carrying Hydra agent second. He had his own little side operation going on, and he's taking advantage of the current chaos--and the outing of Hydra assets--to continue pursuing his own agenda. Hydra having been a conspiracy within SHIELD, and their main plan having been defeated, there doesn't seem to be a central Hydra authority calling the shots in the wake of TWS any more than there's a central SHIELD authority.

I'd like to think that they're setting up the base as a recurring location (at least temporarily answering the question of how they'll fuel and maintain the Bus), but Ward knowing about it does make that problematic....
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Old April 17 2014, 12:29 AM   #4645
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

So if there is any question about renewal, we're going to start sending in lanyards to ABC in protest, right?
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Old April 17 2014, 12:38 AM   #4646
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

Christopher wrote: View Post
Well, first off, we've already had a female character in this show who had paranormal powers of persuasion, namely Lorelei. Would they really want to repeat themelves that way?
Dunno. We'll have to wait and see. They did invent Raina before they decided to use Lorelei, though, I'd imagine.
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Old April 17 2014, 01:06 AM   #4647
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

I liked that the group was mobile and didn't have a set HQ but Providence, the base our team reached during the last episode, feels like it will be their home location.
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Old April 17 2014, 01:54 AM   #4648
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

The Old Mixer wrote: View Post
Hydra having been a conspiracy within SHIELD, and their main plan having been defeated, there doesn't seem to be a central Hydra authority calling the shots in the wake of TWS any more than there's a central SHIELD authority.
Except the post-credits scene in TWS confirms that HYDRA does have a larger existence than just the branch of it that was inside SHIELD, and it definitely has a guy in charge.


bbjeg wrote: View Post
I liked that the group was mobile and didn't have a set HQ but Providence, the base our team reached during the last episode, feels like it will be their home location.
The only way that will happen is if the team either wins Ward back to their side in the very near future -- which would be a huge copout -- or exposes and captures him before he can report their location back to Garrett. Although it seems unlikely to me that he wouldn't have already given Garrett their location, since he was still with Garrett when Skye contacted him.
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Old April 17 2014, 01:57 AM   #4649
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

Alidar Jarok wrote: View Post
Christopher wrote: View Post
Well, first off, we've already had a female character in this show who had paranormal powers of persuasion, namely Lorelei. Would they really want to repeat themelves that way?
Dunno. We'll have to wait and see. They did invent Raina before they decided to use Lorelei, though, I'd imagine.
It'd be doubly redundant if it turns out that Skye's 084'ness includes the power to make people like and protect her, as some fan have speculated.

The interesting possibility exists that they might be thinking about setting up a take on Spider-Woman at some point and is not a passive ability to persuade and attract the opposite sex one of Jessica Drew's hallmarks?

Personally I like the "Ms. Captain Marvel" idea better, but this is also a strong candidate. I mean from Marvel's POV, if they can't do Spider-Man, may as well do Spider-Woman instead, no?

Or maybe Raina's secret past is she's Jessica Drew? So many possibilities...
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Old April 17 2014, 02:06 AM   #4650
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Re: Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

Christopher wrote: View Post
The Old Mixer wrote: View Post
Hydra having been a conspiracy within SHIELD, and their main plan having been defeated, there doesn't seem to be a central Hydra authority calling the shots in the wake of TWS any more than there's a central SHIELD authority.
Except the post-credits scene in TWS confirms that HYDRA does have a larger existence than just the branch of it that was inside SHIELD, and it definitely has a guy in charge.
I'm not sure the guy in the post-credits scene was necessarily in charge or necessarily HYDRA anymore (although he probably was at one point). The quote was that SHIELD and HYDRA are "two sides of the same coin that no longer hold any currency." That suggests he's no longer concerned with either.
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