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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies I-X

Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

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Old September 12 2013, 03:05 PM   #16
Mario de Monti
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Re: Is 'Woman In Cafeteria' Janice Rand, or not?

Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
GLW looked amazing and she was extremely happy with the scene; Robert Wise had ordered her to remove her glam makeup for TMP, and she'd been devastated how harshly the camera had treated her.
Interesting. To me her appearance in TMP was the best she ever looked in Trek

Very interesting story by the way. Thanks for telling
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Old September 12 2013, 03:09 PM   #17
Garrovick
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Re: Is 'Woman In Cafeteria' Janice Rand, or not?

It's definitely Rand in the Spacedock cafeteria as far as I'm concerned. Yes, the Commander insignia is a bit goofy but that would hardly be the first (or last) instance of incorrect costuming in Trek.
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Old September 12 2013, 04:04 PM   #18
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Re: Is 'Woman In Cafeteria' Janice Rand, or not?

Mario de Monti wrote: View Post
Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
GLW looked amazing and she was extremely happy with the scene; Robert Wise had ordered her to remove her glam makeup for TMP, and she'd been devastated how harshly the camera had treated her.
Interesting. To me her appearance in TMP was the best she ever looked in Trek

Very interesting story by the way. Thanks for telling
My thanks as well, Therin.

I always knew it was Rand, as I never read the credits anyway. I just wait through them to see if we get any extra scenes.
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Old September 12 2013, 07:53 PM   #19
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Re: Is 'Woman In Cafeteria' Janice Rand, or not?

As others have said, I agree it's Rand. That's the only way the reaction makes much sense.

Regarding the two uniforms, I think we have to assume that the two uniforms are potentially interchangeable - not unlike what we saw with the TNG/DS9 uniforms for a while.

Regarding Rand's changing rank, we might want to assume that one rank is actually her "correct" rank and others are a mistake. I think it's generally assumed that she was enlisted, but given her position aboard the Excelsior, I believe I'd like to think she went back to the Academy at some point pre-TSFS thus qualifying her for officer ranks.

It also depends how much time you put bewteen TMP and TWOK, doesn't it?
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Old September 13 2013, 09:06 AM   #20
Therin of Andor
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Re: Is 'Woman In Cafeteria' Janice Rand, or not?

Mario de Monti wrote: View Post
To me her appearance in TMP was the best she ever looked in Trek

Very interesting story by the way. Thanks for telling
No problem.

GLW came out in her TMP costume for Robert Wise's comments and he revealed a dislike of her TOS character from his research, calling her "Kirk's geisha girl" - and then he sent her back to Makeup to have her "glam" makeup removed before her scenes could be filmed. She was distressed because Nichelle, Majel and Persis were permitted glamour makeup - and Persis even had contractual airbrushing for still photos.

Here's a pic of GLW stepping through the doors of International Departures in Sydney, Australia:

Therin of Andor wrote: View Post

Grace Lee Whitney by Therin of Andor, on Flickr

I took this pic of a glowing Grace Lee Whitney as she departed Australia following her first science fiction convention Down Under (1982). We had just collected her from the domestic air terminal and delivered her to the international terminal. ST II had just opened - she had been saddened not to have been included - but it was at this convention, sitting with a bunch of gregarious, supportive Aussies, that she resolved to go teetotal, although we didn't know it then. Her personal life has been on the improve ever since.

It was with great delight that I read a "Starlog" interview, years later, in which Grace mentioned Aussie fans as the turning point in her life.
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Old September 13 2013, 09:33 AM   #21
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Re: Is 'Woman In Cafeteria' Janice Rand, or not?

I never noticed the misnaming in the credits and just always assumed it was Rand. Could it be a case of not wanting to pay royalties like with Lacarno/Paris?
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Old September 13 2013, 03:47 PM   #22
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Re: Is 'Woman In Cafeteria' Janice Rand, or not?

R. Star wrote: View Post
I never noticed the misnaming in the credits and just always assumed it was Rand. Could it be a case of not wanting to pay royalties like with Lacarno/Paris?
No.

No royalties are owed to a writer for this character, since Rand dates back to the Writers' Bible of TOS. The royalty rule is more for a one-off guest character in an episode written by an outside writer, who gets turned into a recurring character in other writers' scripts, ie. T'Pau, Locarno, etc.

And it's not a "misnaming". It is a cameo and a kind of in-joke. As I said, the script itself doesn't specify that it's Rand. Not listing the character's name is part of the in-joke. It was a directorial choice to use GLW as Rand. The scriptwriter had no idea the director would add an existing TOS character to the scene. He could have used an extra, but he used GLW.

Some cameos in movies go uncredited, even though the actor has lines eg. Whoopi Goldberg in "Generations" and "Nemesis", and Noel Neill and Kirk Allyn as Lois Lane's parents in "Superman: The Movie" (dialogue restored for TV premiere).
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Old September 13 2013, 04:00 PM   #23
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Re: Is 'Woman In Cafeteria' Janice Rand, or not?

Praetor wrote: View Post
As others have said, I agree it's Rand. That's the only way the reaction makes much sense.
I always assumed it was Rand, because the scene works better emotionally that way.

That bit isn't about her uniform and rank. It's about: "Hey, look, it's Janice--from the old show--and she's getting all choked up about what happened to the Enterprise. What a nice moment!"

I don't think you're supposed to be paying attention to her insignia at that moment.
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Old September 13 2013, 05:39 PM   #24
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Re: Is 'Woman In Cafeteria' Janice Rand, or not?

Agreed.
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Old September 14 2013, 01:02 AM   #25
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Re: Is 'Woman In Cafeteria' Janice Rand, or not?

It was clearly meant to be Janice in STIII they just ret-conned her rank. They did the same to O'Brien. I can live with it.

And glam make-up or not, Grace looked good in TMP IMO. Too much glam make-up on an older woman doesn't look as good to me. In Basic Instinct 2 Sharon Stone was caked in so much make-up it looked a bit odd. Shortly after I saw her talking with Dev Patel on a red carpet beaming away, wrinkles and all and she is still incredibly beautiful without the make-up.
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Old September 14 2013, 09:52 PM   #26
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Re: Is 'Woman In Cafeteria' Janice Rand, or not?

Sorry to be a skeptic, but how would anyone know what Persis had in her contract? Actors aren't usually forthcoming about the details of their deals.
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Old September 15 2013, 04:01 AM   #27
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Re: Is 'Woman In Cafeteria' Janice Rand, or not?

The OP question is what do we think. Based on what I've read here and my own opinions, it seems the answer is a clear yes. It's Rand.
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