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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Doctor Who

Doctor Who "Bigger on the inside..."

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Old October 18 2013, 10:38 AM   #166
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

The dumbed-down/too complicated thing isn't as insane as it sounds. I don't necessarily agree with either criticism, but I do think Moffat has a habit of creating some very interesting, compelling and (occasionally)complex drama and then wrapping it up with a nonsensical or contrived (see: stupid) ending. He rarely establishes firm rules, which can trivialize the ensuing conflict with solutions out of nowhere, or cause it to spin out of control as new twists create layers of increasingly implausible plotting where the viewer must actively ignore significant details (see: the decline of the Weeping Angels). Complexity does not equal sophistication, and a complicated plot can absolutely be a stupid one.
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Old October 18 2013, 10:42 AM   #167
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

Venardhi wrote: View Post
The dumbed-down/too complicated thing isn't as insane as it sounds. I don't necessarily agree with either criticism, but I do think Moffat has a habit of creating some very interesting, compelling and (occasionally)complex drama and then wrapping it up with a nonsensical or contrived (see: stupid) ending. He rarely establishes firm rules, which can trivialize the ensuing conflict with solutions out of nowhere, or cause it to spin out of control as new twists create layers of increasingly implausible plotting where the viewer must actively ignore significant details (see: the decline of the Weeping Angels). Complexity does not equal sophistication, and a complicated plot can absolutely be a stupid one.
Thats a well reasoned take on the matter.
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Old October 18 2013, 12:56 PM   #168
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

Judge Death wrote: View Post


All the Doctors were referenced and we saw/heard stock footage relating to all of them (I think!)
Yeah, so none of them appeared in the episode. It was stock footage. Mona Lisa doesn't get a credit if there is a scene with the painting in the background.
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Old October 18 2013, 01:13 PM   #169
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

Well apparently Hartnell wouldn't return Moffat's calls...
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Old October 18 2013, 02:26 PM   #170
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

Judge Death wrote: View Post
Well apparently Hartnell wouldn't return Moffat's calls...
That reminds me. Moffat mentioned if a Classic Doctor was to be brought back, Hartnell would be the one that should be. Hartnell's Doctor was pretty gruff at the start (Taking off in the TARDIS with Ian and Barbara aboard knowing full well he may never be able to return them to their time; almost cracking the caveman's skull...), until his companions mellowed him. All the other Doctors have taken after Troughton, to some degree, yet HurtDoctor did something horrifying and shameful. Amy and River have both warned The Doctor not to travel alone.

Maybe HurtDoctor is what Hartnell could've/would've become without the Companions mellowing him?
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Old October 18 2013, 02:33 PM   #171
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

Photoman15 wrote: View Post
Judge Death wrote: View Post


All the Doctors were referenced and we saw/heard stock footage relating to all of them (I think!)
Yeah, so none of them appeared in the episode. It was stock footage. Mona Lisa doesn't get a credit if there is a scene with the painting in the background.
I'm curious. Three Doctors are dead and three have aged considerably since their time in the TARDIS. One refuses to come back to the show.

How exactly do you think they should've appeared in the episode in such circumstances?
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Old October 18 2013, 02:36 PM   #172
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

Professor Zoom wrote: View Post
Shazam! wrote: View Post
The Mirrorball Man wrote: View Post
I'm one of them, and I still don't think that catering to the whimsical tastes of fandom is the best way to tell an entertaining story.
Yeah, but we've had season after season of entertaining stories so why not cater to the whimsical tastes of fandom just this once?
What do you mean, just this once? All last season had little mentions of Doctor Who history that only fans would recognize. Like in Cold War, when the TARDIS saved itself--that was a 2nd Doctor reference.

Hell, the Name of the Doctor was all about the Doctor's past. With appearances by all of the Doctors.
Yep, and they were all great! So...
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Old October 18 2013, 03:16 PM   #173
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

Sindatur wrote: View Post
Judge Death wrote: View Post
Well apparently Hartnell wouldn't return Moffat's calls...
That reminds me. Moffat mentioned if a Classic Doctor was to be brought back, Hartnell would be the one that should be. Hartnell's Doctor was pretty gruff at the start (Taking off in the TARDIS with Ian and Barbara aboard knowing full well he may never be able to return them to their time; almost cracking the caveman's skull...), until his companions mellowed him. All the other Doctors have taken after Troughton, to some degree, yet HurtDoctor did something horrifying and shameful. Amy and River have both warned The Doctor not to travel alone.

Maybe HurtDoctor is what Hartnell could've/would've become without the Companions mellowing him?
These photos have been circulating Tumblr as of this morning

David Bradley as The First Doctor


Claudia Grant as Susan


Jemma Powell as Barbra Wright and Jamie Glover as Ian Chesterton.



Pictures from Mark Gatiss' "Adventure's in Time". Set to debut on Nov 12.

http://www.radiotimes.com/news/2013-...-and-brian-cox
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Old October 18 2013, 03:25 PM   #174
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

Captaindemotion wrote: View Post
Photoman15 wrote: View Post
Judge Death wrote: View Post


All the Doctors were referenced and we saw/heard stock footage relating to all of them (I think!)
Yeah, so none of them appeared in the episode. It was stock footage. Mona Lisa doesn't get a credit if there is a scene with the painting in the background.
I'm curious. Three Doctors are dead and three have aged considerably since their time in the TARDIS. One refuses to come back to the show.

How exactly do you think they should've appeared in the episode in such circumstances?
I didn't say they shoud (have). I'm just pointing out that none of the (surviving) Doctors actually appeared (in new footage), which is fine for this episode. For the 50th though, I think some others should have been included.
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Old October 18 2013, 03:29 PM   #175
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

I just realized that in 2013, six different actors will play the role of the Doctor.
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Old October 18 2013, 03:34 PM   #176
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

@Photoman15Ah, okay, I understand now.

I really would have liked to see McGann and Eccleston and I would've creamed my pants had Davison and Tom Baker appeared (though I tend to think that their physical appearances would cause problems). I really couldn't care less if Colin Baker or Sly McCoy appeared but I recognise that they're part of DW history and have their fans and I think McCoy has aged well enough to have been included without any great difficulty. Ultimately, I'm going to try to just enjoy this episode for what it is, not what I want it to be.

To borrow Starkers' analogy, though, ST celebrated its 30th anniversary in DS9, which used existing footage and in Voyager which had a new performance from George Takei and Grace Lee Whitney. But I think most people regard the former as by far the better episode. Hopefully the absence of new footage from old Doctors in DOTD doesn't hamper it from being a good story.
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Old October 18 2013, 03:49 PM   #177
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

^ All I wanted was Eccleston or McGann to be in the 50th. U_U my dreams were shattered when I learned Eccleston did meet with Moffat and turned down the chance to reprise the role of the 9th Doctor.
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Old October 18 2013, 03:59 PM   #178
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

Personally, I wanted an Eccleston-Tennant-Smith ensemble, with McGann featuring briefly but substancially, ala First Doctor in The Three Doctors.

Well, at least they got Tennant. And its John Hurt in there too, so it must be interesting.
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Old October 18 2013, 04:12 PM   #179
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

Judge Death wrote: View Post
Well apparently Hartnell wouldn't return Moffat's calls...
William Hartnell was dead even before The Five Doctors, in 1983. The role of the First Doctor was played by Richard Hurndall, and he's dead, too.

If they couldn't get the actual Doctors, I'd be happy with Companions, especially those from the first 5 Doctors (never liked Peri, Mel, or Ace).
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Old October 18 2013, 04:28 PM   #180
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Re: Original Series Doctors Protest Lack Of 50th Involvement

Sigh, Saavik was right..
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