RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 142,275
Posts: 5,552,094
Members: 25,264
Currently online: 544
Newest member: Eronai

TrekToday headlines

Star Trek Online Celebrates Five Years
By: T'Bonz on Jan 27

WizKids/Star Trek Online Caption Contest
By: T'Bonz on Jan 26

No Quinto In Heroes Reborn
By: T'Bonz on Jan 26

Pine Responds To Pegg Writer Announcement
By: T'Bonz on Jan 26

Retro Review: Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges
By: Michelle on Jan 24

Urban in Aquaman?
By: T'Bonz on Jan 23

Pegg Co-writing Star Trek 3
By: T'Bonz on Jan 22

Stewart Narrated NASA Documentary
By: T'Bonz on Jan 21

Star Trek 3 Filming To Begin
By: T'Bonz on Jan 21

IDW Publishing Trek Comics For April 2015
By: T'Bonz on Jan 20


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Misc. Star Trek > Future of Trek

Future of Trek Discussion of future Trek projects.

View Poll Results: Do fans want the prime timeline back?
I'm a fan and I want the Prime timeline back. 218 56.62%
I'm a fan and I don't want the Prime timeline back. 64 16.62%
I'm a fan and wouldn't mind if it came back. 43 11.17%
I don't care, just give me Trek! 53 13.77%
I don't know. 7 1.82%
Voters: 385. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old December 7 2013, 02:50 AM   #796
borgboy
Fleet Captain
 
borgboy's Avatar
 
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

The salt vampire is pretty tragic. It is kind of touching how much it needed to be loved. It was much more interesting than if it had been a more two dimensional monster.
__________________
Resistance is futile
borgboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 7 2013, 06:11 AM   #797
Timewalker
Cat-lovin', Star Trekkin' Time Lady
 
Timewalker's Avatar
 
Location: In many different universes, simultaneously.
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

Greg Cox wrote: View Post
Doing a new version of Star Trek, and tweaking the formula, doesn't mean you have to insist that every previous version was somehow flawed. It just means you're having fun with an old standard, like doing a new jazz interpretation of "Somewhere Over the Rainbow" or whatever.

Again, that doesn't mean the classic Judy Garland version isn't still great, but there's always room for another variation on the theme. Nothing is sacred, nothing is set in stone. Everything is grist for the mill.
My old music teacher would have a fit if she knew you'd said this. I was taking the Western Board of Music exams in spinet organ, and the syllabus was heavy on Bach. As in play it as written, with no extraneous frills or settings. Since I play by ear much better than by reading the notes, I had to memorize that stuff to the point where I could replay it in my mind and be note and time-perfect, and drill my fingers into automatically being in the right place at the right time. It was mentally exhausting, really frustrating... but the high I got when I finally got it right and knew I had finally made that crucial breakthrough is indescribable.

After the exams, I liked to take those Bach pieces and play around with them, different styles and settings... and the teacher looked at me in horror, that I'd do that to a piece of music I'd worked so hard on for months.

borgboy wrote: View Post
The salt vampire is pretty tragic. It is kind of touching how much it needed to be loved. It was much more interesting than if it had been a more two dimensional monster.
"Many different faces is a part of what I am...
........ ........ ........ the shifting desert sands."

I wish I could remember more of the song; it's really beautiful and makes me cry every single time I listen to it (I'm tearing up just thinking about it). My tapes are packed away, though, and this one isn't on the filk CDs I have. I remember part of another verse, though, and that's a crucial bit of insight into this "monster":

"I didn't want to kill... I didn't want to die."
__________________
"Let's give it to Riker. He'll eat anything!"

For some great Original Series fanfic, check out the Valjiir Continuum!
Timewalker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 7 2013, 01:52 PM   #798
HaventGotALife
Fleet Captain
 
HaventGotALife's Avatar
 
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

Greg Cox wrote: View Post
Hober Mallow wrote: View Post
HaventGotALife wrote: View Post
What they have done with these two movies makes me long for Rick Berman.
I didn't like the movies either, but damn, that's taking it too far.
HaventGotALife wrote: View Post
I started watching TNG in 1990, so I'm a little late to the party. But you still had to find something wrong with Original Star Trek to think it needed the re-boot treatment.
The reason it needs to be rebooted is not because there's something wrong with it, but because there's something right with it. Otherwise it wouldn't be rebooted.
That's a good point--that extends beyond just STAR TREK.

Too many people seem to think that a remake or reboot somehow constitutes a rejection or criticism of the previous version, when that's not really the case. Accepting a new version doesn't mean you think the old version wasn't good enough. It's perfectly reasonable to appreciate both on their own terms--and accept that the new version is doing things differently. Not necessarily better, nor worse, but differently.

Doing a new version of Star Trek, and tweaking the formula, doesn't mean you have to insist that every previous version was somehow flawed. It just means you're having fun with an old standard, like doing a new jazz interpretation of "Somewhere Over the Rainbow" or whatever.

Again, that doesn't mean the classic Judy Garland version isn't still great, but there's always room for another variation on the theme. Nothing is sacred, nothing is set in stone. Everything is grist for the mill.
I suggest re-reading through this thread. Everyone was complaining about old Star Trek before I put a point on it. "Star Trek wasn't fun anymore," "Star Trek was formulaic," "You want Rick Berman back?!"

It is possible to appreciate both, but that's not what is happening here. They are such vastly different interpretations that to appreciate one, and defend it, you have to tear down the other.

The prime universe had good and bad in it, like anything. But to reduce Star Trek to "warp to a planet, get in trouble, get out of trouble, and nothing matters..." is complaining about old Trek. I can be as equally reductive about the movies, both old and esp. new. "Put the Enterprise, a crew member, and/or Earth in peril. Make sure everyone's on the bridge at the end of the movie, the end."

My point to all of this is that your statement is logically sound, but that's not what's going on in here.
HaventGotALife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 7 2013, 03:22 PM   #799
borgboy
Fleet Captain
 
borgboy's Avatar
 
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

I wish we were getting more movies/tv with the classic universe. I'd LOVE a new movie with characters from VOY, DS9 and TNG. At least we have the novels to carry those characters forward.
And I've really liked the new movies and am looking forward to the next one.
When I say I miss the classic universe, that doesn't mean my ideal is to keep Berman in charge. I don't see the two as being the same thing.
__________________
Resistance is futile
borgboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 7 2013, 06:02 PM   #800
Hober Mallow
Commodore
 
Location: The planet Terminus, site of the Encyclopedia Foundation on the periphery of the galaxy
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

HaventGotALife wrote: View Post
I suggest re-reading through this thread. Everyone was complaining about old Star Trek before I put a point on it. "Star Trek wasn't fun anymore," "Star Trek was formulaic," "You want Rick Berman back?!"
Rick Berman is "old Star Trek?"

Rick Berman created and produced Star Trek spinoffs, which were based on Gene Roddenberry's Star Trek. They have as much to do with original Star Trek as JJ Abrams' movies, and are no more or less valid.

Sounds to me like you're more of a Rick Berman Trek fan than a Star Trek fan. There's nothing wrong with that, and I mean no offense by saying it; a lot of people grew up watching Trek spinoffs. But I see those shows related to Star Trek the same way Basil Rathbone's Sherlock Holmes movies are related to Conan Doyle's original stories. The Rathbone films were a legitimate vision of the character, but eventually you have to move on from them to keep the character alive in other equally valid interpretations. Nick Meyer, Rick Berman, and JJ Abrams have all produced their own interpretations of Star Trek, and if there's going to be a future for Star Trek, that needs to continue.
__________________
"Beep... beep!" --Captain Pike

Last edited by Hober Mallow; December 7 2013 at 06:41 PM.
Hober Mallow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 7 2013, 06:51 PM   #801
Chemahkuu
Vice Admiral
 
Chemahkuu's Avatar
 
Location: United Kingdom
Send a message via Yahoo to Chemahkuu
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

Um, the Basil Rathbone movies mashed together random elements of many of the stories and made a collection of stand alone movies from them.

And he was not the first actor to play the character on film, not event the 10th, there were several before him.

Jeremy Brett's long running 80's series did adapt each story in turn to television, but even they had changes and additions were necessary given how short many of the Holmes stories are.

There is no "canon" or "definitive" Holmes as each interpretation changes something from the books in some way.
__________________
"But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake."
Chemahkuu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 7 2013, 07:17 PM   #802
Hober Mallow
Commodore
 
Location: The planet Terminus, site of the Encyclopedia Foundation on the periphery of the galaxy
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

Chemahkuu wrote: View Post
Um, the Basil Rathbone movies mashed together random elements of many of the stories and made a collection of stand alone movies from them.
And your point is?

And he was not the first actor to play the character on film, not event the 10th, there were several before him.
[sarcasm]Oh, well that completely negates my point then...[/sarcasm]
There is no "canon" or "definitive" Holmes as each interpretation changes something from the books in some way.
Which is exactly my point. The same is true of each interpretation of Star Trek. We can pretend it "all fits together," just as we can pretend Nick Meyer's "Seven Per Cent Solution" is part of Conan Doyle's Holmes canon; but Nick Meyer's Holmes is no more valid an interpretation than the Holmes of the Rathbone movies or the animated series Sherlock Holmes in the 22nd Century.
__________________
"Beep... beep!" --Captain Pike
Hober Mallow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 7 2013, 07:22 PM   #803
nightwind1
Commodore
 
nightwind1's Avatar
 
Location: Des Moines, IA
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

Chemahkuu wrote: View Post
Um, the Basil Rathbone movies mashed together random elements of many of the stories and made a collection of stand alone movies from them.

And he was not the first actor to play the character on film, not event the 10th, there were several before him.

Jeremy Brett's long running 80's series did adapt each story in turn to television, but even they had changes and additions were necessary given how short many of the Holmes stories are.

There is no "canon" or "definitive" Holmes as each interpretation changes something from the books in some way.
Kind of like Star Trek.
__________________
Remember: No Matter Where You Go, There You Are...88

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.
nightwind1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 7 2013, 08:12 PM   #804
Chemahkuu
Vice Admiral
 
Chemahkuu's Avatar
 
Location: United Kingdom
Send a message via Yahoo to Chemahkuu
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

nightwind1 wrote: View Post
Chemahkuu wrote: View Post
Um, the Basil Rathbone movies mashed together random elements of many of the stories and made a collection of stand alone movies from them.

And he was not the first actor to play the character on film, not event the 10th, there were several before him.

Jeremy Brett's long running 80's series did adapt each story in turn to television, but even they had changes and additions were necessary given how short many of the Holmes stories are.

There is no "canon" or "definitive" Holmes as each interpretation changes something from the books in some way.
Kind of like Star Trek.
Sorry, I thought he was another one of the people trying to say there was only 'one true version of trek', we've been getting too many of them in here.
__________________
"But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake."
Chemahkuu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 7 2013, 08:33 PM   #805
Greg Cox
Vice Admiral
 
Location: Oxford, PA
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

Chemahkuu wrote: View Post

Sorry, I thought he was another one of the people trying to say there was only 'one true version of trek', we've been getting too many of them in here.
It's not just Trek. I feel like I keep getting sucked into the same debate everywhere . . . regarding Trek, X-Men, Wonder Woman, Dracula, or whatever. No matter what "iconic" bit of pop culture is under discussion, you've got the purists and traditionalists insisting that some new version is not the "real" SPACE IGUANAS, or has taken too many liberties from the original source material, or is simply not close enough to the version they grew up on . . . .

Granted, I've been guilty of this myself on occasion. I gave up on the NIGHT STALKER reboot after one episode--and will go to my grave insisting that Diana Rigg is the one true Emma Peel . . .
__________________
www.gregcox-author.com

Last edited by Greg Cox; December 7 2013 at 08:46 PM.
Greg Cox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8 2013, 12:49 AM   #806
HaventGotALife
Fleet Captain
 
HaventGotALife's Avatar
 
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

Hober Mallow wrote: View Post
HaventGotALife wrote: View Post
I suggest re-reading through this thread. Everyone was complaining about old Star Trek before I put a point on it. "Star Trek wasn't fun anymore," "Star Trek was formulaic," "You want Rick Berman back?!"
Rick Berman is "old Star Trek?"

Rick Berman created and produced Star Trek spinoffs, which were based on Gene Roddenberry's Star Trek. They have as much to do with original Star Trek as JJ Abrams' movies, and are no more or less valid.

Sounds to me like you're more of a Rick Berman Trek fan than a Star Trek fan. There's nothing wrong with that, and I mean no offense by saying it; a lot of people grew up watching Trek spinoffs. But I see those shows related to Star Trek the same way Basil Rathbone's Sherlock Holmes movies are related to Conan Doyle's original stories. The Rathbone films were a legitimate vision of the character, but eventually you have to move on from them to keep the character alive in other equally valid interpretations. Nick Meyer, Rick Berman, and JJ Abrams have all produced their own interpretations of Star Trek, and if there's going to be a future for Star Trek, that needs to continue.
We cannot bring back Gene Roddenberry. He's a pile of bones, after being dead since 1991. I spent my youth yelling about how bad Rick Berman was, but I enjoy his versions of Trek more than the last two films. Berman worked with Roddenberry, as did Nick Meyer and Harve Bennett. I long for someone who doesn't hate Star Trek as it was before. Listening to Abrams, he thinks that the original series and every spinoff was "naive."

So, yes, you could equate the two. But one has respected what came before, the other hasn't. And judging by what he's done with the universe so far, I don't want to see the 24th century version of what he would do.
HaventGotALife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8 2013, 01:08 PM   #807
bbjeg
Vice Admiral
 
bbjeg's Avatar
 
Location: C,IMD14U.
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

Just to reiterate, Prime Trek doesn't mean Berman Trek.
bbjeg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 8 2013, 03:50 PM   #808
BillJ
Admiral
 
BillJ's Avatar
 
Location: Covington, Ky.
View BillJ's Twitter Profile
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

HaventGotALife wrote: View Post
Listening to Abrams, he thinks that the original series and every spinoff was "naive."
I'm sure you have actual evidence that is what he thinks? Or are you simply talking out of your ass?
__________________
"...the most elementary and valuable statement in science, the beginning of wisdom, is I do not know." - Lt. Commander Data, "Where Silence Has Lease"
BillJ is online now   Reply With Quote
Old December 8 2013, 03:52 PM   #809
BillJ
Admiral
 
BillJ's Avatar
 
Location: Covington, Ky.
View BillJ's Twitter Profile
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

Bearded Bloke wrote: View Post
Just to reiterate, Prime Trek doesn't mean Berman Trek.
Since 75% of Prime Trek was made under Berman's watch, it does mean Berman Trek.
__________________
"...the most elementary and valuable statement in science, the beginning of wisdom, is I do not know." - Lt. Commander Data, "Where Silence Has Lease"
BillJ is online now   Reply With Quote
Old December 8 2013, 05:54 PM   #810
Kelthaz
Rear Admiral
 
Kelthaz's Avatar
 
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Re: Do fans want the prime timeline back? Part 2: Poll edition.

I miss Berman Trek. The 24th century was the best.
__________________
"Who are you?! And how did you get in here?!"

"I'm the locksmith. And... I'm the locksmith."
Kelthaz is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
prime timeline, prime trek

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 03:21 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.