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Old September 8 2013, 05:20 PM   #46
Harvey
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

DWF wrote: View Post
Jan wrote: View Post
Nope. That's the whole point of the campaign - to find channels to show it to help grow the fan base. As far as most of us can tell, B5 hasn't been on TV in the US for ten years or so. Perhaps only five in other countries, but that's why I'm asking the question.

As everybody knows, Trek TOS was cancelled (twice!) due to lousy ratings and then found its fans when it was shown in reruns for years and years afterward. B5's hardly ever been in reruns, particularly at any decent hour, so pretty much the only way for fans to find it is word of mouth.

ETA: Thanks, Reverend, that would be nice. In fact, one page I'm looking to add to the website will be banners, graphics, posters and memes that fans can use to spread the word. If you're interested in doing anything like that, that'd be great!

Jan
Actually TOS was only cancelled once the letter writing saved it from being cancelled in the second season. And TOS went straight into syndication and stayed there for years, which was't the case with B5. Now you could start a petition but in the end no matter what you do you'll be needing the cooperation of Warner Brothers to make it happen.
Star Trek also wasn't serialized and didn't have a lot of competition in terms of other science fiction programs in the 1970s, when it made a name for itself in syndication. The television landscape has changed dramatically in four decades.
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Old September 8 2013, 05:34 PM   #47
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

Getting Babylon 5 on Netflix and Hulu is without a doubt the way to go here. I don't think showing it on TV is going to do much since it demands that the audience be there for one specific hour each day.
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Old September 8 2013, 06:21 PM   #48
Triple-F
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

sidious618 wrote: View Post
Getting Babylon 5 on Netflix and Hulu is without a doubt the way to go here. I don't think showing it on TV is going to do much since it demands that the audience be there for one specific hour each day.
That there is exactly the big problem B5 has always had.

Itís remained a niche, cult based show not because it demands too much from the viewer in the way of intelligence, as is the often repeated belief (thatís just complete nonsense). Itís because itís not a jump in and watch show Ė the story arc which is the best thing about, also makes it difficult to attract new viewers once the weekly instalments had began and got running. Especially back in the day.

To be brutally frank, this request from jms is starting to feel a little bit odd. Why was Star Trek brought backÖÖÖÖ. Because the fans demanded it. What is jms asking fans to do now (while saying he canít get involved), even though for years heís said fan campaigns are a complete waste of time.

You donít need an established fan base to create a new sci-fi show! On top of that, it wasnít that long ago that he had made it known Warner was on the verge of giving the green light, but some issue arose about where to show it Ė remember his comments about rebooting the series. So itís not like Warner need convincing.

B5 has often been compared with ST and the Twilight Zone. One of the three seminal sci-fi works. If a new show was to appear, it would certainly make good (and long lasting) press if it did so after a fan campaign.

Not saying thatís whatís happening here Ė itís a bit of a stretch to say the least - but something has changed for him to do a complete 180 on fan campaigns. And I agree, for the quickest and easiest way to build up the fan base, streaming sites are the way to go.
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Old September 8 2013, 06:30 PM   #49
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

sidious618 wrote: View Post
Getting Babylon 5 on Netflix and Hulu is without a doubt the way to go here. I don't think showing it on TV is going to do much since it demands that the audience be there for one specific hour each day.
It would certainly be the optimal outcome, but has others have pointed out, if WB have already decided to keep it on their proprietary service, then that's that. The only way to convince them otherwise is to make them realise there's significant profit in it for them. The only way that'll happen is, as JMS said, if the fans get loud and get organised.

So feel free to pitch in any time now folks.

Triple-F wrote: View Post
Not saying that’s what’s happening here – it’s a bit of a stretch to say the least - but something has changed for him to do a complete 180 on fan campaigns. And I agree, for the quickest and easiest way to build up the fan base, streaming sites are the way to go.
My initial reaction was actually that it had something to do with his new studio...but I can't think of a way this would benefit things. I mean if the ulterior motive was acquiring the TV rights, then surely encouraging the fans to make a lot of noise would seam to be counter productive. I mean if the property looks popular, then surely WB are less likely to part with it, no?

Maybe if you take a very cynical view and think four steps ahead *maybe* you could theorise that WB are mor likely to commission that reboot (or something else altogether from JMS) if B5's profile was suddenly raised...but I honestly can't see it. I've never known JMS to be actively deceitful towards the fans.
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Old September 8 2013, 06:33 PM   #50
Jan
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

Triple-F wrote: View Post
Not saying thatís whatís happening here Ė itís a bit of a stretch to say the least - but something has changed for him to do a complete 180 on fan campaigns.
Could be any number of things. The number of fans who turned out for the B5 reunion in Phoenix (where Free Babylon 5 first came up as far as I know)? The fact that two years of trying to negotiate getting the rights to B5 have bogged down? Who knows?

And I agree, for the quickest and easiest way to build up the fan base, streaming sites are the way to go.
You saw my previous note about it being available on Amazon and YouTube (plus the previously mentioned 26 episodes on WBs own site? Not one person mentioned them at all.

And for the above comment about B5 on TV requiring people to be in one place at one specific hour of the day...not in a universe that contains DVRs. If they find it and get interested they can probably set their DVRs for future episodes.

I also don't see that showing it in order is the issue it was back a ways. These days that's the standard rather than the exception.

Jan
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Old September 8 2013, 06:42 PM   #51
Triple-F
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

Reverend wrote: View Post
It would certainly be the optimal outcome, but has others have pointed out, if WB have already decided to keep it on their proprietary service, then that's that.
But they havenít. You can watch it on the Amazon and Youtube services Ė at least the US ones. So saying Warner are holding on to it and not sharing, is not the case.

I'll support a campaign, already have, but B5 is tailor made for binge viewing. So for jms to say no point in focusing on streaming sites, he clearly knows something we don't. Be it contractual problems or something else.
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Old September 8 2013, 07:15 PM   #52
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

This is an impossible sell: Trying to get a TV channel to broadcast an old '90s Science Fiction series. Sci-fi is a fringe genre and they have too many cheap modern crap shows to choose from. It is not going to happen.

Streaming is the logical choice for B5. JMS and WB needs to buckle down and clear out any hurdles to streaming. Shows sitting on the shelf make no money for either of them.
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Old September 8 2013, 07:23 PM   #53
Jan
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

Triple-F wrote: View Post
So for jms to say no point in focusing on streaming sites, he clearly knows something we don't. Be it contractual problems or something else.
Why is it so difficult to accept that he thinks that making it possible for people to find it while channel surfing is the way to go? As somebody who's found numerous shows that way and none via looking on streaming sites, I agree with him.

Brolan wrote: View Post
This is an impossible sell: Trying to get a TV channel to broadcast an old '90s Science Fiction series. Sci-fi is a fringe genre and they have too many cheap modern crap shows to choose from. It is not going to happen.
And yet there are any number of channels showing old shows including Andy of Mayberry and Twilight Zone and Time Tunnel...why is it so impossible?

JMS and WB needs to buckle down and clear out any hurdles to streaming. Shows sitting on the shelf make no money for either of them.
JMS has no say in the matter whatsoever. If he did, he wouldn't have spent over two years trying to get the rights from WB.

Jan
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Old September 8 2013, 07:47 PM   #54
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

Andy of Mayberry, Twilight Zone, and Time Tunnel were mainstream shows in their day and are broadcast on a network that caters to the old-time viewers. SyFy is the only network that would logically want B5, but we all know the cheap crap they have been showing in recent years instead of real sci-fi.
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Old September 8 2013, 08:34 PM   #55
Jan
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

Brolan wrote: View Post
SyFy is the only network that would logically want B5, but we all know the cheap crap they have been showing in recent years instead of real sci-fi.
How about the Science channel? They've done very well with showing Firefly and I'd warrant that B5 has more actual science to it. I'm sure there are others up and down the dial.

Folks, I'm sure there are all *sorts* of reasons why this can't work but to paraphrase Lady Morella, "There's always a chance. We say that there's no chance only to comfort ourselves with the excuse to do nothing".

This thread is for those who want to do something. It may work. It may not. But at least we'll know we tried. And if it doesn't, then we may try something else.

Jan
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Old September 8 2013, 09:20 PM   #56
Sindatur
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

Jan wrote: View Post
Brolan wrote: View Post
SyFy is the only network that would logically want B5, but we all know the cheap crap they have been showing in recent years instead of real sci-fi.
How about the Science channel? They've done very well with showing Firefly and I'd warrant that B5 has more actual science to it. I'm sure there are others up and down the dial.

Folks, I'm sure there are all *sorts* of reasons why this can't work but to paraphrase Lady Morella, "There's always a chance. We say that there's no chance only to comfort ourselves with the excuse to do nothing".

This thread is for those who want to do something. It may work. It may not. But at least we'll know we tried. And if it doesn't, then we may try something else.

Jan
And Farscape, apparently just started up recently on some channel (A new channel maybe?). a guy at work me told me he discovered this show called Farscape, and said it was weird with Muppets and everything and asked if it was a new show. I gave him the "Farscape is awesome, the characters are so well realized, you forget they're Muppets" Speech. So, he's apparently been watching it and asked me a bunch of questions to get his bearings.

BBCA recently had most of NuWho on On Demand Menu, so, that people could catch up. A channel could even do that, run weekly episodes and put them up on On Demand Menu for 6 weeks or more, and if people catch a "New" episode, and are attracted, they could watch the previous episodes on On Demand.
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Old September 8 2013, 09:28 PM   #57
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

Jan wrote: View Post
Folks, I'm sure there are all *sorts* of reasons why this can't work but to paraphrase Lady Morella, "There's always a chance. We say that there's no chance only to comfort ourselves with the excuse to do nothing".

This thread is for those who want to do something. It may work. It may not. But at least we'll know we tried. And if it doesn't, then we may try something else.
Am I getting paid for this? Because if not, why should I care? You're treating Babylon 5 like it's a charity or a political cause; Babylon 5 is a commercial product. If JMS puts out a product that I like I'll happily pay for it, but to expect me to organize to help make some other dude money is ridiculous. It's just a TV show.

Tell JMS to start a kickstarter. I would willingly contribute money to a future Babylon 5 film/TV Series if I get something out of it. It worked for Veronica Mars.
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Old September 8 2013, 09:52 PM   #58
Jan
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

Kelthaz wrote: View Post
Am I getting paid for this? Because if not, why should I care? You're treating Babylon 5 like it's a charity or a political cause; Babylon 5 is a commercial product. If JMS puts out a product that I like I'll happily pay for it, but to expect me to organize to help make some other dude money is ridiculous. It's just a TV show.
No, I'm treating Babylon 5 like a show that's got a passionate fan base that might be interested in growing and maybe...far in the future, becoming powerful and visible enough that WB might want to do something with the asset that they seem determined to let sit and gather dust. You don't want to participate, don't.

Tell JMS to start a kickstarter. I would willingly contribute money to a future Babylon 5 film/TV Series if I get something out of it. It worked for Veronica Mars.
Well...let's see... Should I mention that VM has a large and growing fan base *because it's on TV in reruns*? Or would that be too obvious? I won't insult your intelligence by pointing out that a B5 film would take a minimum of $60M, far beyond anything Kickstarter has ever garnered.

But I will point out once again that JMS *can't* do anything without WB. Yes, he owns the feature film rights. But nobody's going to finance a feature film that can't eventually be sold to TV. And without WB, it couldn't be.

And if you want him told anything, go to Facebook and do it yourself.

Jan
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Old September 8 2013, 10:13 PM   #59
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

I think a reason why many people are pushing the streaming idea of Netflix, Hulu or Amazon Instant is that for several shows it has been shown to help boost ratings of the shows and or in some cases bring them back.

One example is Breaking Bad where the later seasons have seen a ratings spike and can be portion of that attributed to it being on streaming services. The most recent season premiere of August 2013, hit a record high for the show of 5.9 million.

A quote from What the Networks (and Netflix) Should Learn from the Boffo Ratings for Breaking Bad

Credit for the rating boost doesnít just go to Vince Gilliganís awesome plotting or AMCís rare patience: It also goes to Netflix. Breaking Badís ratings suggest a seriously symbiotic relationship between AMC and Netflix, where all of Breaking Badís past episodes have been available for binge-watching. One of the very few hard statistics Netflix has ever released has to do with Breaking Bad: The companyís chief content officer once said that 50,000 Netflix subscribers watched all 13 episodes of Breaking Badís fourth season the day before Season 5 premiered. One can only imagine the kind of binging that was going on in this last hiatus for the show to double its viewership.
Another article on same subject- Should Netflix be paying studios for content or the other way around?

Another example is Arrested Development, I bet part of the reason Netflix was willing to bring it back was how the previous seasons had performed on their service.
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Old September 9 2013, 12:27 AM   #60
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Re: #FreeBabylon5 Campaign

Nobody is saying streaming services aren't a good platform to try and get B5 out there, it's a great platform and I'm all for pushing it if at all possible. But right now the campaign is at step one, whereas that is step forty seven. Right now the thing to do is organise, gather information and start making noise.

@Kelthaz Hey mate, the second you do anything worth paying for I'll be sure to rush over with my check book. Seriously though, nobody asked you to care. Nobody asked you to anything you don't want to do. So what exactly are you whining about?
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