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Old September 10 2013, 10:39 PM   #76
teya
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

Lynx wrote: View Post
As for "The Gift", it was another horrible written episode with the one and only purpose to get rid of Kes as soon as possible. It's so thin, unconvincing and full of flaws that I guess that the writer must have written it on the toilet or during a coffee break.
I can see why you don't like "The Gift." I didn't much like the Kes parts either. If they were gonna get rid of her, I'd much rather she have taken off with the guy in Darkling.

However...

Jeri's performance is stunning.
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Old September 10 2013, 10:48 PM   #77
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

Lynx wrote: View Post
. . ."The Gift". . .[is] so thin, unconvincing and full of flaws that I guess that the writer must have written it on the toilet or during a coffee break.
It was written by Joe Menosky, who's usually pretty good at crazy weird stuff episodes, but it was directed by Anson Williams, better known as Potsie on "Happy Days", so that might explain everything.
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Old September 11 2013, 05:30 PM   #78
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

teya wrote: View Post
Lynx wrote: View Post
As for "The Gift", it was another horrible written episode with the one and only purpose to get rid of Kes as soon as possible. It's so thin, unconvincing and full of flaws that I guess that the writer must have written it on the toilet or during a coffee break.
I can see why you don't like "The Gift." I didn't much like the Kes parts either. If they were gonna get rid of her, I'd much rather she have taken off with the guy in Darkling.

However...

Jeri's performance is stunning.
I agree with you here.

Melankon wrote:

It was written by Joe Menosky, who's usually pretty good at crazy weird stuff episodes, but it was directed by Anson Williams, better known as Potsie on "Happy Days", so that might explain everything.
I guess that both the writer and the director were told to come up with somthing in which the character could be dumped as soon as possible which might explain the low quality of the episode.
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Old September 11 2013, 05:36 PM   #79
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

Lynx wrote: View Post
teya wrote: View Post
Lynx wrote: View Post
As for "The Gift", it was another horrible written episode with the one and only purpose to get rid of Kes as soon as possible. It's so thin, unconvincing and full of flaws that I guess that the writer must have written it on the toilet or during a coffee break.
I can see why you don't like "The Gift." I didn't much like the Kes parts either. If they were gonna get rid of her, I'd much rather she have taken off with the guy in Darkling.

However...

Jeri's performance is stunning.
I agree with you here.

Melankon wrote:

It was written by Joe Menosky, who's usually pretty good at crazy weird stuff episodes, but it was directed by Anson Williams, better known as Potsie on "Happy Days", so that might explain everything.
I guess that both the writer and the director were told to come up with somthing in which the character could be dumped as soon as possible which might explain the low quality of the episode.
"low quality" is your opinion, I don't think it's low quality.

as for dumping the character "as soon as possible" that's not quite right. They knew for a few episodes at least that Jennifer Lien was leaving since she was already listed as a guest star in Scorpion part 2. Going from a main character to a guest star requires a different contract, different hours, different pay scale, so it's not like nobody knew it was coming. Plus since she wasn't in any of the season 4 promo shots, I think she knew she was going well before The Gift
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Old September 11 2013, 09:04 PM   #80
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

^^
So you think it was funny that she was dumped, therefore the "LOL" smiley?

What I've heard, Jennifer wasn't told that she was going to be dumped until the filming of "The Gift" was about to start.

Correct information or not, she got the message rather late because Kim was the one who was chosen to be dumped after season 3, but those in charge changed their minds after a silly inside poll in a glossy magazine.

What I've heard, Jennifer was depressed during the filming of "The Gift". The other cast members weren't too happy over it either.

But maybe that was funny too?
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Old September 11 2013, 09:07 PM   #81
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

Lynx, I have to say your unwavering support of all things Kes frankly, to me, borders on the creepy. Things like getting your hackles up because of one emoticon...I mean really, is that such a huge deal?

Anyway, instead of us comparing what we've heard, how about providing sources that we can actually check against?

It seems likely to me that she must have known well prior to filming "The Gift" given that her credit had already been changed in the previous episode, unless "The Gift" was actually filmed first. But that strikes me as unlikely.
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Old September 11 2013, 09:21 PM   #82
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

Lynx wrote: View Post
^^
So you think it was funny that she was dumped, therefore the "LOL" smiley?

What I've heard, Jennifer wasn't told that she was going to be dumped until the filming of "The Gift" was about to start.

Correct information or not, she got the message rather late because Kim was the one who was chosen to be dumped after season 3, but those in charge changed their minds after a silly inside poll in a glossy magazine.

What I've heard, Jennifer was depressed during the filming of "The Gift". The other cast members weren't too happy over it either.

But maybe that was funny too?
She got the information that she was going to be leaving before filming of Scorpion Part 2 because she is listed as a guest star. This is a fact. You need to take a step back and look at the facts objectively. 1) she was listed as a guest star in the previous episode, as I mentioned earlier, this involves a different contract, and different pay, 2) she wasn't in any of the season 4 promo material. Therefore she knew well before she was handed a script to The Gift.

Just because you didn't like that she left doesn't change facts of the matter
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Old September 11 2013, 09:21 PM   #83
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

Creepy? Me?

And I thought that I was such a nice and pleasant fellow.

As for the emoticon, I just found it a bit annoying. Being fired isn't funny. It happened to me a couple of years ago and it wasn't a pleasant experience.

As for my support for the character, well someone's gotta do it and the way the character was treated was among the worst I've seen in a series.

Sources? Well, I find this information quite reliable http://reocities.com/Area51/zone/3939/lien.htm
especially since I've heard the same from some other people as well.

She might have gotten the information about not being wanted anymor shortly before the filming of "Scorpion 2" started, that's not impossible. But obviously she was informed rather late about it.
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Old September 11 2013, 09:22 PM   #84
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

DonIago wrote: View Post
Lynx, I have to say your unwavering support of all things Kes frankly, to me, borders on the creepy. Things like getting your hackles up because of one emoticon...I mean really, is that such a huge deal?

Anyway, instead of us comparing what we've heard, how about providing sources that we can actually check against?

It seems likely to me that she must have known well prior to filming "The Gift" given that her credit had already been changed in the previous episode, unless "The Gift" was actually filmed first. But that strikes me as unlikely.
Right, she was already a guest star in Scorpion 2 so she knew then, and as I said she wasn't in any of the season 4 promotions.
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Old September 11 2013, 09:25 PM   #85
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

According to Piccardo she knew beforehand. According to Phillips she learned in the Gift script. Neither position cancels out the other. And its always possible to retroactively put a contract in place, so the credits are no indication.
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Old September 11 2013, 09:27 PM   #86
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

Lynx wrote: View Post
^^
What I've heard, Jennifer wasn't told that she was going to be dumped until the filming of "The Gift" was about to start.

Correct information or not, she got the message rather late because Kim was the one who was chosen to be dumped after season 3, but those in charge changed their minds after a silly inside poll in a glossy magazine.
Show business is a business & it's a business in which the talent is unionized. Producers & studios work under strict SAG guidelines in the treatment of actors.

Jennifer, like the rest of the cast, had a 3 season contract. She would have known long before filming that her contract was not renewed along with the rest of the cast.

Plus, her agent would have had to negotiate with TPTB for her salary for her guest starring roles in Scorpion 2 & The Gift.
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Old September 11 2013, 09:29 PM   #87
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

Lynx wrote: View Post
Creepy? Me?

And I thought that I was such a nice and pleasant fellow.

As for the emoticon, I just found it a bit annoying. Being fired isn't funny. It happened to me a couple of years ago and it wasn't a pleasant experience.

As for my support for the character, well someone's gotta do it and the way the character was treated was among the worst I've seen in a series.

Sources? Well, I find this information quite reliable http://reocities.com/Area51/zone/3939/lien.htm
especially since I've heard the same from some other people as well.

She might have gotten the information about not being wanted anymor shortly before the filming of "Scorpion 2" started, that's not impossible. But obviously she was informed rather late about it.
what was so horrible about the way she was treated? it's pretty standard in hollywood. You take an acting job, and at some point it ends. You seem to be more upset about the actress leaving than the actress herself! it's been so so many years since this happend, she's moved on, maybe you should too.

and there is absolutely nothing reliable about that site. It's just some free site someone (maybe you?) whipped together in 10 minutes and wrote their own thoughts. how about a quote from someon on set?

Like before I've provided quotes from Lien herself about how she didn't mind leaving and wasn't upset about it, and I included the magazine issue the interview where she said that was from. That wuld be a reliabl source.

I don't find it hard to believe that it would be sad for her to go, afte three years of course it would be sad. But there is a difference between being sad, and being upset.

It's like being a temp. you get an assignment that is supposed to last a certain amount of time, after that amount of time your contract is done and you go to the next job. It might be sad to leave if you've been there for a while, but from the very beginning you knew you were only ging to be there for a limited amount of time
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Old September 11 2013, 09:31 PM   #88
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

Lynx wrote: View Post
Creepy? Me?

And I thought that I was such a nice and pleasant fellow.

As for the emoticon, I just found it a bit annoying. Being fired isn't funny. It happened to me a couple of years ago and it wasn't a pleasant experience.

As for my support for the character, well someone's gotta do it and the way the character was treated was among the worst I've seen in a series.

Sources? Well, I find this information quite reliable http://reocities.com/Area51/zone/3939/lien.htm
especially since I've heard the same from some other people as well.

She might have gotten the information about not being wanted anymor shortly before the filming of "Scorpion 2" started, that's not impossible. But obviously she was informed rather late about it.
You may or may not be a nice and pleasant fellow, but usually when I interact with you you seem wound up about Kes and unwilling to hear anything that might be less than glowing about her. As I've already said, it damages your credibility and frankly is at the point where I don't tend to look forward to your participation in threads. I wish you'd take some time to consider our concerns regarding your lack of objectivity.

Under some circumstances I think being fired is quite funny. For instance, when you call in sick and then post pictures of yourself drunk at a football game to your Facebook account which your supervisor stumbles upon.

Amusingly, I was going to say that three years on a major television series is more than many actors ever get, but then I realized you were talking about the character, not the actress. Frankly I think she was treated better than Neelix. She certainly was treated better than Mayweather! Some people might argue she was treated better than Gul Dukat in his later appearances as well. Anyway, bad treatment of characters happens; it's not a crime.

I don't believe it's been established that she "obviously" was informed late.

FWIW I reviewed Memory Alpha (which granted is a wiki) and didn't see anything to suggest that Lien received late notice that she'd be leaving the show. Which doesn't rule it out, but I'd feel more inclined to believe the argument being made if it was mentioned there.
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Old September 11 2013, 09:41 PM   #89
Lynx
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

KaraBear wrote: View Post
Lynx wrote: View Post
Creepy? Me?

And I thought that I was such a nice and pleasant fellow.

As for the emoticon, I just found it a bit annoying. Being fired isn't funny. It happened to me a couple of years ago and it wasn't a pleasant experience.

As for my support for the character, well someone's gotta do it and the way the character was treated was among the worst I've seen in a series.

Sources? Well, I find this information quite reliable http://reocities.com/Area51/zone/3939/lien.htm
especially since I've heard the same from some other people as well.

She might have gotten the information about not being wanted anymor shortly before the filming of "Scorpion 2" started, that's not impossible. But obviously she was informed rather late about it.
what was so horrible about the way she was treated? it's pretty standard in hollywood. You take an acting job, and at some point it ends. You seem to be more upset about the actress leaving than the actress herself! it's been so so many years since this happend, she's moved on, maybe you should too.

and there is absolutely nothing reliable about that site. It's just some free site someone (maybe you?) whipped together in 10 minutes and wrote their own thoughts. how about a quote from someon on set?

Like before I've provided quotes from Lien herself about how she didn't mind leaving and wasn't upset about it, and I included the magazine issue the interview where she said that was from. That wuld be a reliabl source.

I don't find it hard to believe that it would be sad for her to go, afte three years of course it would be sad. But there is a difference between being sad, and being upset.

It's like being a temp. you get an assignment that is supposed to last a certain amount of time, after that amount of time your contract is done and you go to the next job. It might be sad to leave if you've been there for a while, but from the very beginning you knew you were only ging to be there for a limited amount of time
Well, I thought it was horrible, but that's me.

No, I didn't create that site with the quote I posted a link to. I already have a site, you can find it at the bottom of my posts.

Frankly, I do find the information on that website more, or at least as believable than official propaganda.

As for Lien's statement in that article, it was published a long time after the firing so I guess she had got over it by then.
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Old September 11 2013, 09:46 PM   #90
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Re: Thoughts on Season 2

DonIago wrote: View Post
I don't believe it's been established that she "obviously" was informed late.

FWIW I reviewed Memory Alpha (which granted is a wiki) and didn't see anything to suggest that Lien received late notice that she'd be leaving the show. Which doesn't rule it out, but I'd feel more inclined to believe the argument being made if it was mentioned there.
The only way she would have only found out that she was leaving the show when she got the script for The Gift (as Lynx alleges), would be if she paid absolutely no attention to the contracts her agent handed her to sign so that she would be paid for the 1st 2 episodes of the 4th season. She would have had to have been unaware that she hadn't signed a contract for the next three seasons.

I just don't think Jennifer is that stupid. She'd been in the business since she was a teen. She wasn't a naive kid who fell off a turnip truck.

She knew how the business worked.
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