RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 140,170
Posts: 5,435,229
Members: 24,939
Currently online: 443
Newest member: katlynwomack

TrekToday headlines

Two Official Starships Collection Ships
By: T'Bonz on Oct 22

Pine In New Skit
By: T'Bonz on Oct 21

Stewart In Holiday Film
By: T'Bonz on Oct 21

The Red Shirt Diaries #8
By: T'Bonz on Oct 20

IDW Publishing January Comics
By: T'Bonz on Oct 20

Retro Review: Chrysalis
By: Michelle on Oct 18

The Next Generation Season Seven Blu-ray Details
By: T'Bonz on Oct 17

CBS Launches Streaming Service
By: T'Bonz on Oct 17

Yelchin In New Indie Thriller
By: T'Bonz on Oct 17

Saldana In The Book of Life
By: T'Bonz on Oct 17


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy

Science Fiction & Fantasy Farscape, Babylon 5, Star Wars, Firefly, vampires, genre books and film.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old August 30 2013, 06:54 PM   #301
kirk55555
Fleet Captain
 
kirk55555's Avatar
 
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

DalekJim wrote: View Post
kirk55555 wrote: View Post
I've never read the book, but I, Robot is a vastly superior movie compared to Dune.
Strongly disagree.

Dune was just 2 hours and 17 minutes of David Lynch ruining a great sci fi book. Atleast I, Robot was entertaining and didn't make me want to break something.
Only because you hadn't read the book .

In the end, the Dune mini series is the real adaptation. It was long, but actually done well and it was a real adaptation, not a movie that seemed to just be the stupid screenwriter picking his favorite parts of the book and then doing them horribly, connected with a lot of stupid imagery and changes that did nothing but screw up the story.
The mini-series had no atmosphere. The Baron was vastly improved, but most of the cast were wooden as hell. William Hurt has absolutely no charisma, Paul is a whiny bitch, and Gurney seems to be reading his lines from an auto-cue.
I totally don't agree. The mini series Paul, Duke Leto, and jessica were much better than the movie characters (the movie Jessica in particular was just bad). I felt like most of the actors in the movie were trying with what they had, but none of them were anywhere near as good as the mini series actors (except Patrick Stewart and Brad Dourif, who I think could have played their parts well with the way they were written in the mini series). The mini series was amazing from beginning to end, and did absolutely everything, from writing to acting to effects, better than the movie. Its one of my favorite live action sci fi things ever. I won't convince you that its good, just like you'll never convince me that the Dune movie is anything more than the worst sci fi adaptation I've ever seen, so I don't want to argue about it.

As for I, Robot I thought about reading it. I looked through it, saw that it doesn't actually follow the story of the movie, and then decided against it. It looked like a book I'd have to drop after 20 pages from pure boredom. I'm predisposed against reading "classic" sci fi authors anyway. I don't like a lot of the style of writing of older sci fi books, or just books in general (The LOTR books are about as old as I can read, and even then they're an exception, anthing older than Dune is generally not something I enjoy reading). Authors like Ray Bradbury, Arthur C. Clarke, Issac Asimov, etc are all authors I'm sure were good for their time but I wouldn't read anything they did unless I had no choice. Its just not a type of writing that I feel holds up.
kirk55555 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30 2013, 06:59 PM   #302
DalekJim
Fleet Captain
 
DalekJim's Avatar
 
Location: Great Britain
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

kirk55555 wrote: View Post
The mini series was amazing from beginning to end, and did absolutely everything, from writing to acting to effects, better than the movie.
I think the miniseries has the better script, though that's only because it has more time. Absolutely everything else is better in the Lynch movie though. Direction, cinematography, effects, music, costumes, atmosphere, set design.. all of it.

As for I, Robot I thought about reading it. I looked through it, saw that it doesn't actually follow the story of the movie, and then decided against it.
WTF!

It looked like a book I'd have to drop after 20 pages from pure boredom.
WTF!

I'm predisposed against reading "classic" sci fi authors anyway.
WTF!

I don't like a lot of the style of writing of older sci fi books, or just books in general
WTF!

Authors like Ray Bradbury, Arthur C. Clarke, Issac Asimov, etc are all authors I'm sure were good for their time but I wouldn't read anything they did unless I had no choice.
DalekJim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30 2013, 07:00 PM   #303
Lindley
Moderator with a Soul
 
Location: Fairfax, VA
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

I, Robot is just a collection of short stories exploring the implications of the Three Laws. The movie did that as well, so I felt it adhered to the spirit of the book if not its plot(s).
__________________
Lead Organizer for EVN: Firefly.
"So apparently the really smart zombies have automatic weapons!"
-Torg, Sluggy Freelance
Lindley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30 2013, 07:02 PM   #304
kirk55555
Fleet Captain
 
kirk55555's Avatar
 
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

DalekJim wrote: View Post

As for I, Robot I thought about reading it. I looked through it, saw that it doesn't actually follow the story of the movie, and then decided against it.
WTF!

I'm predisposed against reading "classic" sci fi authors anyway.

WTF!

I don't like a lot of the style of writing of older sci fi books, or just books in general
WTF!

Authors like Ray Bradbury, Arthur C. Clarke, Issac Asimov, etc are all authors I'm sure were good for their time but I wouldn't read anything they did unless I had no choice.

I've just never been able to get into most books older than Dune, and even then Dune is pretty old when it comes to books I like. Not as old as the LOTR books obviously, but outside of LOTR and the older Dune books I don't read much older than the 80's, and even then most of my reading is late 80's to present day. Before that, most books just aren't written in a way I like, even if they had premises I might have enjoyed from more modern authors.
kirk55555 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30 2013, 08:02 PM   #305
Hound of UIster
Rear Admiral
 
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

DalekJim wrote: View Post
kirk55555 wrote: View Post
The mini series was amazing from beginning to end, and did absolutely everything, from writing to acting to effects, better than the movie.
I think the miniseries has the better script, though that's only because it has more time. Absolutely everything else is better in the Lynch movie though. Direction, cinematography, effects, music, costumes, atmosphere, set design.. all of it.

As for I, Robot I thought about reading it. I looked through it, saw that it doesn't actually follow the story of the movie, and then decided against it.
WTF!



WTF!



WTF!

I don't like a lot of the style of writing of older sci fi books, or just books in general
WTF!

Authors like Ray Bradbury, Arthur C. Clarke, Issac Asimov, etc are all authors I'm sure were good for their time but I wouldn't read anything they did unless I had no choice.
Given how reading has falling out amongst the developed world, I'm sure it's a shared sentiment somewhere. He is just articulating the sentiment that a movie or tv show with a strong video equivalent delivers the same stimulation as a book would, but with less time consumption.
Hound of UIster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30 2013, 08:06 PM   #306
DalekJim
Fleet Captain
 
DalekJim's Avatar
 
Location: Great Britain
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

I'm genuinely too poor to afford video game consoles so reading is my main form of escapism from this dystopian world. The classic science-fiction authors are my favourites, so I feel protective of them. Wonder what he thinks about Heinlein?
DalekJim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30 2013, 08:42 PM   #307
Nagisa Furukawa
Commander
 
Nagisa Furukawa's Avatar
 
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

Hound of UIster wrote: View Post
Given how reading has falling out amongst the developed world, I'm sure it's a shared sentiment somewhere.
Careful saying that here; DalekJim and I once expressed that sentiment and got told in no uncertain terms that there most certainly is not a lack of reading in the public.
__________________
I am the one who guided you this far.
Nagisa Furukawa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30 2013, 10:19 PM   #308
JoeZhang
Vice Admiral
 
JoeZhang's Avatar
 
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

You have to wonder who's hand is up who's ass?
JoeZhang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30 2013, 10:53 PM   #309
kirk55555
Fleet Captain
 
kirk55555's Avatar
 
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

Hound of UIster wrote: View Post
DalekJim wrote: View Post
kirk55555 wrote: View Post
The mini series was amazing from beginning to end, and did absolutely everything, from writing to acting to effects, better than the movie.
I think the miniseries has the better script, though that's only because it has more time. Absolutely everything else is better in the Lynch movie though. Direction, cinematography, effects, music, costumes, atmosphere, set design.. all of it.

WTF!



WTF!



WTF!

WTF!

Authors like Ray Bradbury, Arthur C. Clarke, Issac Asimov, etc are all authors I'm sure were good for their time but I wouldn't read anything they did unless I had no choice.
Given how reading has falling out amongst the developed world, I'm sure it's a shared sentiment somewhere. He is just articulating the sentiment that a movie or tv show with a strong video equivalent delivers the same stimulation as a book would, but with less time consumption.


I actually love to read. I read a lot, I don't know how my dislike of older styles of writing = not a reader, but I am an avid reader, I just have my likes and dislikes. Right now I'm going through a Dune series reread, this time in chronological order of the books (minus the Butlerian jihad books or the Bene Gesserit ancient history book) and i'm up to The Winds of Dune. I prefer sci fi and fantasy books, and specific non fiction (a lot of maritime non fiction, stuff like naval warfare and history).

Now, i don't read many "snobby" books (I'm a huge fan of star trek and especially Star wars novels, and i'll defend most of them as well thought out books and not just mindless action stuff that some people label them) but even though I'm not a fan of most "classic" sci fi/fantasy books I do read a good amount of books. Its rare for me to go outside specific franchises anymore, but I do sometimes and it usually works out. That said, I'll try out a lot of modern stuff, but if its a sci fi/fantasy book pre 80's, I'm probably not going to read it. I just don't like how most books were written before then.

Thats nothing against old authors, I just find the prospect of reading an Arthur C. Clarke or Issac asimov novel to be very unappealing. Their sci fi is old school stuff, its not what I want. A good example of that, to me, is the movie 2001: A Space Odyssey. I know its a popular book/movie, but the movie bored me to tears (and really confused me outside of the man vs. evil AI story, but even that wasn't too interesting). Since thats so popular, and its what I consider to be old school sci fi, I'm pretty sure almost all the sci fi around that time and before is just not for me. I'm not saying stuff like that is bad, just that its not something I enjoy. All sci fi is obviously not alike, but when I think of older sci fi novels and writers, I think of 2001 and have no desire to read any of it.

DalekJim wrote: View Post
I'm genuinely too poor to afford video game consoles so reading is my main form of escapism from this dystopian world. The classic science-fiction authors are my favourites, so I feel protective of them. Wonder what he thinks about Heinlein?


I enjoy video games (and i don't have much money, I got a PS3 because of an influx of money from relatives when I graduated High School several years ago) but I can understand noty being able to afford that stuff. Still, even though I enjoy that, I still enjoy reading as much as I like video games or television/movies.


Also, in case it was directed at me, I've never heard of Heinlein. I had to look him up on wikipedia (I'm assuming you're talking about Robert A. Heinlein, who wikipedia says was a sci fi writer). The only thing he's written that I've heard about is Starship Troopers, and I only know that because of the lame movie.
kirk55555 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30 2013, 11:01 PM   #310
Mysterion
Rear Admiral
 
Mysterion's Avatar
 
Location: SB-31, Daran V
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

Lindley wrote: View Post
I, Robot is just a collection of short stories exploring the implications of the Three Laws. The movie did that as well, so I felt it adhered to the spirit of the book if not its plot(s).
They should have filmed Harlan Ellison's I, Robot script instead of that think with Will Smith.
__________________
USS Galileo Galilei, NCC-8888
Prima Inter Pares
Mysterion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30 2013, 11:37 PM   #311
FPAlpha
Rear Admiral
 
FPAlpha's Avatar
 
Location: Mannheim, Germany
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

kirk55555 wrote: View Post
DalekJim wrote: View Post

As for I, Robot I thought about reading it. I looked through it, saw that it doesn't actually follow the story of the movie, and then decided against it.
WTF!




WTF!



WTF!

Authors like Ray Bradbury, Arthur C. Clarke, Issac Asimov, etc are all authors I'm sure were good for their time but I wouldn't read anything they did unless I had no choice.

I've just never been able to get into most books older than Dune, and even then Dune is pretty old when it comes to books I like. Not as old as the LOTR books obviously, but outside of LOTR and the older Dune books I don't read much older than the 80's, and even then most of my reading is late 80's to present day. Before that, most books just aren't written in a way I like, even if they had premises I might have enjoyed from more modern authors.
You are missing out on so much but you have pretty much made up your mind so no effort to dissuade you.

Edit:
Oh.. and that you elevate Star Wars and Star Trek novels (which i also love but consider to be mostly mediocre, action adventure writing you can read casually on a train) to be the same league or better than classics by Clarke or Asimov is very telling.. at least to me. Why not risk something and actually read one of their books fully with an open mind (personally i recommend the original Foundation trilogy by Asimov).. it something else than reading how an XWing does a special maneuver and then blasts a Tie Fighter for the xth time.

And damn.. did try to persuade you. Oh well..
__________________
"But that emergency was supposed to be the fall of an Avenger!" Phil Coulson
"Exactly!"
Nick Fury
FPAlpha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30 2013, 11:48 PM   #312
DalekJim
Fleet Captain
 
DalekJim's Avatar
 
Location: Great Britain
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

There are plenty of very good Star Trek novels, and the Star Wars Expanded Universe books are more interesting than the movies. I've given up on them now though so I can focus on catching up with more interesting literary works.

When I was a little kid, the Star Wars EU helped me get in to reading.
DalekJim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30 2013, 11:51 PM   #313
Mysterion
Rear Admiral
 
Mysterion's Avatar
 
Location: SB-31, Daran V
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

I am begining to get the impression that to science-fiction fans below a certain age nothing exists unless it is on TV, a movie, a video/computer game, or adapted from one of those things. The whole literary side of the genre seems to be fading into obscurity. I hope I am wrong about this.
__________________
USS Galileo Galilei, NCC-8888
Prima Inter Pares
Mysterion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 31 2013, 12:01 AM   #314
kirk55555
Fleet Captain
 
kirk55555's Avatar
 
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

Yes, because all star wars books are about random jedi/x-wong battles

Star wars novels have created a lot of characters never in the movies that are some of my favorites in any media, and some of my favorite books ever. If i was alone on a desert island and could only take one book series, it would be the Star Wars: Republic Commando books, even over the Dune series and LOTR. Thats not saying I think its a higher quality neccesarily, but if I ever had to list my favorite books, with my favorite characters, SW: RC is on the short list (which also has LOTR and Dune). Including stuff by Timothy Zahn or Michael Stackpole/Aaron Allston's X-Wing series, a lot of my favorite novels are Star wars, and I'll defend them against all book snobs

I honestly don't want to argue about this. I'm fine with people looking down on Star wars books. I know I'd rather read a Karen traviss or timothy Zahn Star Wars book over any of the snobby "classics", so I get it from the other perspective. I can't (and won't) argue the signifigance of people like asimov, Clarke and Bradbury. At the same time, I'd personally put my favorite SW authors over any of them when it comes to what I think makes an entertaining read. I don't want to read sci fi novels about random robots and their three laws (which I thought were extremely stupid, but thats just coming from the I, Robot movie, maybe they're better thought out/less stupid in writing) or books about some guy inventing BS "psychohistory" (I half thought the Foundation wikipedia page was a joke when I just looked it up, I don't think I could invent a less interesting concept for a book if I tried). I don't read sci fi to read about stuff like that. I like interesting characters, and I somehow doubt characters matter much in a collection of short stories like I, Robot, or in stuff like the story of a man, an evil AI, and for some reason both monkies and space fetuses (which may have just been on the movie version, but like I said, when I think of snobby sci fi, I think of 2001). I'm not saying those aren't classics or that they're bad, I'd just take the worst Star wars book over them any day of the week.
kirk55555 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 31 2013, 12:01 AM   #315
Aldo
Admiral
 
Aldo's Avatar
 
Location: Somewhere Out there beneath the pale moonlight.
Re: Dune - The Book and the 1984 film *spoilers for both*

I've read a few Star Trek novels in my time, even the much heralded "A Time to..." series. For the most part they've been pretty good, but the writing has never approached anything that I'd even consider "hard scifi."

I had better luck with the Star Wars EU, namely the Timothy Zahn trilogy, they seemed pretty dense to me...than again I was 11 when I read them
__________________
Don't believe everything I say.
Aldo is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 07:14 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.